SE Exam Oct 2019 Result

[mikesltj23]

@mikesltj23

Worked through the 5 stages pretty quick there...

Lol I'm still in denial.  But it's an accepting denial.  And I think I've gone through more than 5 stages!

 

[mikesltj23]

You probably already think I'm crazy.  But just showing part of my frustration and confusion...is what it is I guess.  Gonna look into these classes and think about trying again.

Last time I took this (2015) with less confidence:



This test with more confidence:

 

[tj_PE]

You probably already think I'm crazy.  But just showing part of my frustration and confusion...is what it is I guess.  Gonna look into these classes and think about trying again.

Last time I took this (2015) with less confidence:

View attachment 15570

This test with more confidence:

View attachment 15571

This is very similar to my comparison of the time before to this time. 

I HIGHLY recommend the AEI courses. Had I not had personal and professional obstacles in the way and I had committed the right amount of effort to doing the practice problems, I'm confident i would have passed. A coworker of mine passed both vertical and lateral on the first try by taking their courses and basically only bringing the references provided through AEI and the applicable codes to the exam. AEI is formerly EET.

 

[Titleistguy]

Screw it.  Maybe I'll take the courses, re-pass Vertical, finally pass Lateral, and be a better structural engineer as a result.  If only there's enough time in the day.

Mike,

I don't know you or your life or your situation, so let me qualify what I'm about to say with that.  Your situation is a tough one, especially with the expiration of your vertical results.  That said, I feel like you would likely regret it for a very long time if you didn't see this thing through.  You've come this far, why quit now?  You're pot committed, and to be perfectly honest, at this point you owe it to yourself to see it through.  I'll go one further and say you owe it to the profession.  You owe it to the profession because based on all of your hard work and effort thus far, you'll be a ******* good SE when you do pass.  Whereas if you didn't press on, frankly, it would be a disservice to anyone that would otherwise benefit from your knowledge (and stamp) had you seen it through. 

I failed both of my tests, it sucks, and so I take that feeling compound it by around 100 and that is maybe where you're at.  But , not to be overly reductive, whatya gonna do?  You get up, you dust yourself off, and you get to work.  You'll never lose the knowledge you've gained thus far, and your day will come.  

I like to read this when needing inspiration: 

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat."  -Theodore Roosevelt

 

[SE-wishes]

You probably already think I'm crazy.  But just showing part of my frustration and confusion...is what it is I guess.  Gonna look into these classes and think about trying again.

Last time I took this (2015) with less confidence:

View attachment 15570

This test with more confidence:

View attachment 15571

Since we’re sharing results, here are mine:

spring 2018: 20/40, A, A,IR,IR

fall 2018: 28/40, A, A, IR, U

fall 2019: 36/40, A, IR, U, U

How in the ____ does one improve dramatically and perfectly linearly in the AM while simultaneously get worse linearly in PM. There is simply no logic. The subjects are the same, I’m not gaining less experience and I have taken review classes. 

 

[TheLoneStarEngineer]

I can also attest to nearly eschewing all actual calculations and getting an acceptable on an essay question. I have conversely done detailed and (what I felt were) accurate mathematical solutions for problems and felt really good about them, and gotten unacceptable. Additionally, my sources tell me that wrong citations/procedures get points deducted. This tells me the following:

1. The key to the afternoon is procedure. Follow the right one, and you're nearly guaranteed an "IR" or an "A".
2. Math is only semi-important. 
3. Present a complete solution. Don't miss checks...but this seems less important then item #1. A missed check/verification isn't as bad as using the wrong procedure.
4. Focus on the trick that is inherent in each question. Based on the data, 70% of people can't identify the tricks in the 4 afternoon problems if you're buildings.
5. Graders check if you are competent, that is, if you know what you're doing. It is objectively easier to say "someone doesn't know this" if you do the wrong thing, cite the wrong portion of the code, etc. It is far more difficult to do this if you use broad generalities in procedural list of steps. It will be easier to hide what you don't know in this fashion rather than a "throw everything at the wall and see what sticks" approach. This isn't college.

I agree with this as well. Last time I took the test in April 2019, I received an A, A, IR, U on the lateral afternoon. I wrote the procedure and applicable code references for 50% of a problem and received an IR. Had to do the same on one half of another problem but couldn't note down the code references due to time and received an unacceptable. I think there is a good amount of credit for Correct procedure, Code references and Completeness (3 C's). I also listed what information the questions did not provide for other applicable code checks that were necessary and made a reasonable assumption to at least make sure I am covered in case those were the tricks the graders expected examine's to identify. I also provided alternate solutions in case the assumptions I made based on the missing information was something the graders might not be looking for/did not care (This took a lot of time I didn't have in my first try). I did not miss any opportunity to throw in sketches to supplement my solutions even though they were not required by the problem statement.

I work in a consulting firm where I have to deal with a variety of project types and design on a daily basis. Had quite a few projects in California with SDC D (SCBF, SMF, Wood, Special Concrete and masonry shear walls) within the last year which have helped a lot in preparing for this exam.

 

[GTTrekkie]

I wanted to chime in a say that I completely echo taking the EET/AEI course. I did, however, fail both portions even after taking the courses but I admit that I did not put in the practice time... One book that really helped me for the lateral concrete was Design and Detailing of Low Rise Concrete Buildings through CRSI (I'm convinced I wouldn't have passed if I didn't have this to help me study)...: http://resources.crsi.org/resources/design-and-detailing-of-low-rise-reinforced-concrete-buildings1/ 

 

[Titleistguy]

That book is written by David Fanella and is outstanding. His concrete textbook is even better.  Frankly the best concrete seismic resource in my opinion you can get.  Its the best organization of the detailing and design requirements that I've seen.  

 

[SE-wishes]

I will have to look into that book. I am a big fan of the ACI Concrete Design Handbooks, the examples are fantastic. They are the main reason I got A for the first two attempts ..... still undecided on moving forward. 

Am very seriously thinking about trying to start a career writing children’s books. Reading to my two feels far more rewarding than this has up to the present.

 

[Stewie]

That book is written by David Fanella and is outstanding. His concrete textbook is even better.  Frankly the best concrete seismic resource in my opinion you can get.  Its the best organization of the detailing and design requirements that I've seen.  

which book? Reinforced Concrete Structures: Analysis and Design, Second Edition?

 

[tj_PE]

That book is so expensive but I might buy it. 

 

[JP87]

Signed up today for the AEI courses. Gonna try and actually put in 100% effort on the example problems...The feeling in my stomach I got when I saw those bright red and white "Unacceptable" on my NCEES dashboard will keep me motivated...

 

[Titleistguy]

That book is worth the money.

Fanella authors a few documents that are really good.  One on structural loads and some older PCA stuff.  

His concrete book is the 2nd edition...and buddy of mine from class got it at my recommendation (SK) and he would likely agree that it was great.  One of the only things that I used outside of AEI notes.

 

[MR_E30]

I'll add my experience to this thread as well, given that the 'Unacceptable' I received for Vert- Buildings has worn off. Results: 31/40 IR IR IR IR

I will mimic others in this thread with the following statement:

I do 98% wood design in my day to day engineering, and the afternoon wood problem was like performing basic arithmetic to me. I could literally envision every single table, equation, and page of the codes that was required to answer the problem. I was in test taking heaven. I referenced every single piece of info that was used, with ~19 minutes to spare (41 mins to answer the question).

When it came to the concrete problem, I was in the absolute dark. I never do sophisticated concrete design. I had a 15% idea of what to do, but went through my procedures and notes and plugged away, attempting to tell a story. I referenced a few things, but not many.

And I end up with the same results for those two questions. That is upsetting/surprising to me.

This was my first attempt at any professional licensure (FE/EIT excluded, though I suppose that isn't a 'professional' title). I work in a very niche industry that uses a niche material, but I figured with diligent studying (~400 hours) I could overcome my weaknesses, but that wasn't the case. I honestly expected to have an incredibly difficult time, as I went to college and received a BSME, so I have never even taken a civil class. The main point that upset me was the fact that never before in my life have I ever failed at something that I legitimately focused on and worked diligently towards. I'm not the worlds best person, but I am certainly no slouch. That just goes to show you how difficult this test is, and how 'next level' of a structural engineer that you need to be. A level that I have, for the time being, not been able to reach.

I am going to tackle the PE Civil: Structural Depth in April instead of retaking the SE, as I need a license to start my firm. I currently work for a manufacturer (after working for an SE firm for a couple of years) as their lone engineer, so having a license is the paramount objective, and a PE will do what I need it to do to get things started. I will be back to obtain the SE designation, but it is not this cycle. Perhaps OCT 2020 as I am confident with how 'well' I did on this exam that the PE will be a cakewalk, though I will still study my butt off for it.

Thankfully I prepared and began the testing process early, as I cannot receive a license until June 2020 anyways. So no time is lost, just a slight bruise to the psyche. But there has been a tremendous amount of knowledge accrued and stored in my brain, already making me better at my job.

To everyone who passed, congratulations! To those who did not, we will chat with each other again and share in victory in time to come.

 

[Nebraskangineer]

I do 98% wood design in my day to day engineering,

I was not aware such engineers existed, but then again I'm a bridge guy.

 

[MR_E30]

I was not aware such engineers existed, but then again I'm a bridge guy.

Neither was I!

 

[Baggu]

IL is killing me with the wait.

 

[mikesltj23]

I'll add my experience to this thread as well, given that the 'Unacceptable' I received for Vert- Buildings has worn off. Results: 31/40 IR IR IR IR

I will mimic others in this thread with the following statement:

I do 98% wood design in my day to day engineering, and the afternoon wood problem was like performing basic arithmetic to me. I could literally envision every single table, equation, and page of the codes that was required to answer the problem. I was in test taking heaven. I referenced every single piece of info that was used, with ~19 minutes to spare (41 mins to answer the question).

When it came to the concrete problem, I was in the absolute dark. I never do sophisticated concrete design. I had a 15% idea of what to do, but went through my procedures and notes and plugged away, attempting to tell a story. I referenced a few things, but not many.

And I end up with the same results for those two questions. That is upsetting/surprising to me.

This was my first attempt at any professional licensure (FE/EIT excluded, though I suppose that isn't a 'professional' title). I work in a very niche industry that uses a niche material, but I figured with diligent studying (~400 hours) I could overcome my weaknesses, but that wasn't the case. I honestly expected to have an incredibly difficult time, as I went to college and received a BSME, so I have never even taken a civil class. The main point that upset me was the fact that never before in my life have I ever failed at something that I legitimately focused on and worked diligently towards. I'm not the worlds best person, but I am certainly no slouch. That just goes to show you how difficult this test is, and how 'next level' of a structural engineer that you need to be. A level that I have, for the time being, not been able to reach.

I am going to tackle the PE Civil: Structural Depth in April instead of retaking the SE, as I need a license to start my firm. I currently work for a manufacturer (after working for an SE firm for a couple of years) as their lone engineer, so having a license is the paramount objective, and a PE will do what I need it to do to get things started. I will be back to obtain the SE designation, but it is not this cycle. Perhaps OCT 2020 as I am confident with how 'well' I did on this exam that the PE will be a cakewalk, though I will still study my butt off for it.

Thankfully I prepared and began the testing process early, as I cannot receive a license until June 2020 anyways. So no time is lost, just a slight bruise to the psyche. But there has been a tremendous amount of knowledge accrued and stored in my brain, already making me better at my job.

To everyone who passed, congratulations! To those who did not, we will chat with each other again and share in victory in time to come.

This is amazing to me.  You do wood design all day, you felt you nailed the section (no pun intended), and you got an IR.  And absolutely no recourse to even challenge the results if you felt it worthwhile to.  It's mind-boggling.  I swore I would be done now that my 5 year vertical expired.  And then decided yesterday that I'm just going to take the classes and take both again, but comments like yours make me question whether I really want to lol.

 

[MR_E30]

This is amazing to me.  You do wood design all day, you felt you nailed the section (no pun intended), and you got an IR.  And absolutely no recourse to even challenge the results if you felt it worthwhile to.  It's mind-boggling.  I swore I would be done now that my 5 year vertical expired.  And then decided yesterday that I'm just going to take the classes and take both again, but comments like yours make me question whether I really want to lol.

I wouldn't let my lone review sway you one way or the other, but that is the truth of the matter in its entirety. Maybe I missed some wood check because I 'hurried' along so that I would have extra time for the more complex concrete problem, but I was literally on cloud nine with the afternoon wood problem. It may not have been 'perfect' but 100% an Acceptable.

 

[STR_BR]

I am going to tackle the PE Civil: Structural Depth in April instead of retaking the SE, as I need a license to start my firm. I currently work for a manufacturer (after working for an SE firm for a couple of years) as their lone engineer, so having a license is the paramount objective, and a PE will do what I need it to do to get things started. I will be back to obtain the SE designation, but it is not this cycle. Perhaps OCT 2020 as I am confident with how 'well' I did on this exam that the PE will be a cakewalk, though I will still study my butt off for it.

First of all, MR_E30, that is amazing with your background to be wanting to go this far. Now, for the PE, it may still be a struggle as you do not have the Civil background from your undergrad time. I just say that, because although the PE Civil: Structural Depth is indeed very simple in my opinion, fellow coworkers that have failed only failed due to the morning, as you will need to study some water resources and transportation stuff. Honestly, I do not know how that would look like for you since you were not exposed to any of those classes back in undergrad. However, I think the CERM is concise enough to cover those topics. When I took it it was just a matter of  tabbing those sections. I mean the morning is basically 70% Structural, Geotech and Construction and for a Structural Engineer that is something we deal with it in a daily basis especially if you do a lot of foundation design, so I think the morning favors Civil Structurals.

Anyways, just wanted to give you the heads up, I am sure you know all this. I wish you the best, and please, keep going and would love to see you posting here on EB the day you pass the SE Exams! Best of luck!