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D, changes are exciting, scary and stressful. But have to ask yourself where do you want to be in 3,5,10 years from now and the steps needed to be there.

Sorry. What am I doing? Am talking to an engineer. Carry on.

 
Yeah, it's just really hard for me to justify ever leaving this place. I get paid real well (Denver is also a total pay cut for me), I own my house here (and can't sell it), my job is satisfying and under control, and I have a great lifestyle.

Still, something tells me that I need to get back to the real world sometime... but I don't know why, if it's really because I need to, or if it's just some sort of guilt or similar feeling that I have it too good and life should be more challenging. I tend to overthink these things, as I am sure you have all noticed.

One thing I know for sure, if I apply for the Denver job and receive an offer, I won't be able to decline. My parents, wife, and children would just not understand.

So of course I haven't told any of them about this...

 
I thought you were too cheap to buy a house? ;)
I am!

And too old. Think about it: I have a little over 16 years left before I become eleigble to retire. I can't realistically sell my house here, so I don't have any equity beyond what I can manage in savings. I only recently started saving, after over a decade of barely making ends meet. So my house buying options are severely limited. In Denver, for my price range and mortgage timeframe, I am probably only capable of owing a condo. Defintely not a house, at least not in the average Denver suburban settings.

 
You just have to ask yourself if you want a ticket home or not. If I only had one kid at home I would give strong consideration to a condo. with the "California" subdivision concept here few people have actual yards anyways.

But if I had found a job in key largo I don't know if I would leave...

You have todo what's best for your family.

 
wow, that's a tough decision! you would be in the Lakewood office? that sounds like a sweet posting.

a friend that retired from CDOT recently has a consultant gig doing Central Federal Lands work, small projects at a national park, then a national forest, etc. tows his fifth wheel and collects per diem. I'm jealous!

the money situation would make it difficult. but you know the neighborhoods and can check out rents at condos / townhouses

Pinetop sounds really neat too, but how are the school choices for your son? is it too remote?

 
Lakewood - yes, definitely a sweet posting.

I'm not sure about Pinetop schools - it's a small area but it attracts a lot of higher-income snowbirds from Phoenix and Tucson. Showlow is right next door and a little larger (maybe 35,000 or so?), so the schools might be decent. My old boss says they are, but he is working his angle to get me out there, so I'm not sure how much stock to put in his opinion.

RG, you have a good point about living in a condo with just 1 kid, which will be us in the near future. I just don't want to have shared walls - I like my subwoofers. I also dream of some day having a garage and basement and space to work on hobbies... can't do that in a condo, but I've fallen short of those dreams for so many years anyway. Plus, I have lived in a non-regulated, non-HOA environment for so long that I am probably one of "those" types of neighbors. We would probably horrify the average suburban condo dweller.

 
actually even in our overpriced neighborhood (with the top 7th HS in the state) you can get a 3 BR for around $300 ish.. condo will be about the same.. we almost bought a 3BR and debated fixing a room / suite in the basement for my 3rd kid but then figured that would cut into my 14'er time.. there were several 3 BR models that had not been updated that were not moving very fast. the 4BR and 5BR are up there and they don't stay on the market long..

..

 
$300k-ish is way outside my ballpark...

Or at least, I think it is, so maybe I am too cheap to buy a house? I could build a f*cking palace here for $300k, and if I was going to go that route, I'd probably cap my budget at $180 to 200k (after swindling some meth addict out of his hill-side ocean view land for $5 grand or so). But I won't even do that, since I am paying nothing at all on my no-view house in the lowlands.

 
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You're not alone dleg, $300k is a lot of money for a house. On the other hand, the Denver job sounds absolutely awesome, so it's just a matter of figuring out your priorities. If the job is really as awesome as it sounds maybe you wouldn't need/want to retire anyway?

As for Show Low, I've been through the town and it seems decent. I have some very distant relatives that live there if you end up needing some input on the area down the road.

 
The pressure is mounting.... The Bremerton folks called my boss and my old boss for references today. Both gave me positive references and told me to expect an offer, soon.

I had breakfast with my mentor, the Captain, today to mull over the positives and negatives:

positives:

- a geographic move would all but guarantee I make O-5 during next year's promotion cycle (my first year up for it). That represents a modest raise ($270 a month) and of course much more "prestige" and all that.

- We'd be in the mainland, which means more fun stuff to do and we'd be closer for visiting my family and our daughter, wherever she ends up in college

- It would be a cool job.

- It would be a beautiful area to live in

- We wouldn't (couldn't) have to pay a housekeeper any more, and no associated liabilities

- Schools would (presumably) be better for my son

negatives:

- my job now is really good, and I would miss out on some really good resume stuff over the next couple of years (developing new programs, publications, big projects, etc.)

- I have a coveted and very "cool" job now, in a place where my work actually makes a difference - I've been told it's not as much that way for the Bremerton job (all my references and mento worked there before). So for USPHS purposes, the only thing that would keep the new job from looking like a step down, is that it satisfies the geographic move, which is still viewed as the holy grail of "mobility".

- I would be dropped from the Region 9 Rapid Response Team, which I just got on to, and is something that would help me get my next promotion.

- the new job is temporary - max of 4 years, while my current job has no time limit.

- my boss and I have recently worked out new duties for me, which will translate to new orders/a new position here, so that partially satisfies the "mobility" criteria, and potentially puts me into an O-6 billet, which makes promotion to O-5 much easier.

- I would take a hit of nearly $11,000 per year by moving to Bremerton, purely due to the difference between the overseas allowances I get here and BAH there.

- I would take an indeterminate hit on my paycheck due to taxes, but this may be less than I thought because there is no state tax in WA (plus I can still claim residency in the CNMI).

- I would take a huge financial hit because I would have to pay for housing. My house now is all mine - I don't pay a dime for rent or mortgage, but I also can't sell it.

- I would take an additional financial hit because my wife wouldn't be working, but she doesn't contribute much these days anyway - her salary goes mostly to paying the housekeeper (which keeps increasing every year) and her family.

- my wife would no longer have her own money to give to her family, when they ask.

- my wife would be away from her family (could be bad...)

- my wife would not be working (which could also be bad, although she thinks it sounds great)

- my son would be away from his "friends" (his cousins), and he doesn't make friends too easily with his autism symptoms.

- No housekeeper (I have forgotten how to take care of myself)

- Not a tropical island

Just the financials alone are reason enough to reject it, but it is going to cost me more to live in the states no matter what, so this is less of an issue than it otherwise may seem. In other words, if I am going to ever move to the states, I might as well just do it now, since it would give me more time to pay off a small house or condo before I retire. Otherwise, if I wait to long, it just becomes even more unattractive. Kind of like ripping off a bandaid - it's going to hurt no matter what, so might as well just get it over with. So "being in the states" is really the only argument in favor of moving, otherwise I would be moving only to satisfy some primitive, ladder-climbing instinct, which I really don't need because I am doing very, very well as I am.

Ugggghhhhh..... I just want to drink and not think about this stuff.
Bump. Bringing it forward. :popcorn:

 
^I'm glad I put all of that down in writing. Thanks for reminding me, Wolverine.

The Denver position adds some significant positives and removes a couple of negatives. Denver is the one place that I know I and my family would be "happy", because my family is there, I have lots of friends (from high school, EB, and about half a dozen good ex-Saipan friends). Denver doesn't have that dreary, depressing Seattle climate. And the job would be great. I am leaning toward applying, but still haven't told my wife about this.

 
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The main problem here is there is too much shit to do in your free time:-(. I haven't even scratched the surface on hunting/ fishing.... People pay insane amount of money to come here and hunt and I get to do it for next to nothing and haven't taken the first trout out of the water....,

 
I'll need a hunting and fishing partner if I move back there. My Dad's too old now, at least for the hunting, and my best high school friend scared the shit out of me last time we attempted it (extremely poor muzzle awareness). My other friends weren't hunters at all.

Actually it has been so long that I am not sure I would even be all that up for the big game, myself. When I hunted in HS and college, we had a family friend with a several-thousand acre ranch out near Rifle. He'd charge $5000 per person per season to wealthy out-of-state hunters to come there and shoot grain-fed elk and deer. We hunted for free, but had to stay away from the areas the tourists were hunting, and had to make a show of working on the ranch (repairing fences, transporting hay) to make sure they didn't feel ripped off. He sold the place back in the 90s, though, and got onto the state Agricultural Board or something like that. We had breakfast with him when I was there last year, and he was talking about all kinds of weird stuff like government conspiracies and vaccinations.... so I don't think he's going to be much of a hunting resource anymore!

I've only hunted public lands a few times, and it sucked in comparison. Too many people, bullets whizzing over your heads, gamey tasting deer and elk, etc. You have to get pretty far out, like way up near Craig, to get away from the idiots coming out of Denver. And this was in the 80s, with half the current population. I have no idea what it's like now.

On the other hand, what I'd like to get into if I move back is pheasant and dove hunting on the Eastern Plains, and Goose hunting after that. We'd need a dog...

 
If you want goose, come to our local river park here in North Atlanta suburbia. They are plentiful. And annoying.

On second thought, just go to the SuperDuperMega-Golf Store parking lot down the street. They congregate there. And poop on everything.

Hmmm...golf store...over-abundance of annoying geese... I'm thinking there might be an opportunity for some synergy in there somwhere, but I can't quite put my finger on how.

 
I never learned to hunt growing up, but I was always curious and a buddy at work invited me to go elk hunting. He had a condo in Fraser and his tag was for the Sheep Mountain area so that was an easy start. My wife is wary of guns so I decided to see if I liked it before taking the plunge on a rifle and a safe. So i just walked along with walking stick for stability on the snow covered ground.

It was a great adventure, he never got an elk but it was nice to hike through the woods. I did nearly get myself lost in the late afternoon one day, and just about stumbled over a 400 lb bear that was feeding on a carcass another day. But not to worry, I had sharpened on end of the walking stick so I would have had no problems if he hadn't run off.

 
I don't think I would go far from the paved road here without a .357 or .44 to be honest....

 
My parents live just a couple hundred feet from National Service property. I've been hunting since I was 14, although I haven't gone in a few years. I may apply for a license this year, and if I do you guys are welcome to tag along.

 
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