Predictions for Obama admin

wilheldp_PE · Nov 13, 2008

CbusPaul said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if those jobs are really needed, meaning we need to produce as many cars after the collapse as we do before, then wouldn't another company step in and pick up manufacturing.
If they collapse and all of these people are out of a job, then doesn't that mean that the jobs weren't needed in the first place. So would the market forces have created the sinking of the industry due to supply and demand. Isn't that what we want in a capitalist society?

That was the point that I was making in saying that foreign car makers would step in to fill the void. But they aren't going to accept the lazy, entitled, and overpaid attitude of existing UAW workers. So they are either going to have to change their attitude, or live with being unemployed.

Also, with the collective bargaining power of the UAW, there were also far more employees required to be on payrolls than were actually required to build the cars. Hence the reason that GM isn't worth saving as long as the UAW is still calling the shots.

CbusPaul · Nov 13, 2008

wilheldp_PE said:
That was the point that I was making in saying that foreign car makers would step in to fill the void. But they aren't going to accept the lazy, entitled, and overpaid attitude of existing UAW workers. So they are either going to have to change their attitude, or live with being unemployed.
Also, with the collective bargaining power of the UAW, there were also far more employees required to be on payrolls than were actually required to build the cars. Hence the reason that GM isn't worth saving as long as the UAW is still calling the shots.

I agree wholeheartedly. That Jobs Bank that they have to pay workers to do nothing is incredibly UnAmerican or the way I perceived America to be before this latest fiasco.

Capt Worley PE · Nov 13, 2008

wilheldp_PE said:
Agreed. That number might actually be representative of the entire auto industry, including supply chain and support industries. But GM going out of business, or even all of the Big 3, would not make the entire auto industry in America disappear. I guarantee you that Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, Kia, etc. would expand to fill most of the void, and some Chinese and Indian companies would jump at the opportunity to enter the American market. I'm sure that Detroit suppliers that are facing the decision to either reorganize to reduce costs and supply to the foreign auto plants, or close up shop and go out of business would choose the former in great numbers.

The part suppliers already supply the foreign factories on US soil. The proble is that if one of the automakers, say GM, closes its doors, the parts suppliers will lose a bunch of business and collapse. then all the other carmakers can't get parts.

I do, however, feel that the end of the Big 3 would sound the Death Toll for the UAW which has been a long time coming.

100% agree. One of the main reasons I think GM would be better off going Chapter 11. They can void the contract.

Chucktown PE · Nov 13, 2008

I don't know if ya'll are aware of this but while I was living in Atlanta, I guess it has been about two years ago now, Ford and GM both shut down plants in Atlanta. The Ford plant was down near the airport and the GM plant was on the north side. Even though they shut the plants down and paid the workers that used to work there not to work, the UAW wouldn't let them sell the property or bulldoze the plants for two to three years. The reason why was great, "in case they needed to start building those cars again." The same cars that were discontinued because people weren't buying them. The UAW actually thinks that one day millions of Americans are going to wake up and decide to start buying ****** products that are inferior to the Japanese competition. During the real estate boom it was estimated that these properties were worth nearly a billion dollars, and that's just the property. It doesn't include the machinery and equipment.

Capt Worley PE · Nov 13, 2008

I thought the GM Atlanta plant was still buiding the bottlenosed minivans thru December.

MGX · Nov 13, 2008

Ugh, Union Workers.

Here in OKc GM shut down its plant several years ago. The layed off employees sought work and found no jobs that would pay big salaries to pretty much stand around and complain about the injustices of the world.

Most company owners I know wouldn't hire someone if they knew they worked for GM previously. The sense of entitlement and attitude is enough to put you off the idea of hiring anyone union.