# Just got an NCEES email saying October PE exams are canceled.

### Help Support Professional Engineer & PE Exam Forum:

#### speakeelsy PE

##### Well-known member
WOW! CBT is expensive \$375 + tax.
yeah pencil and paper was only \$350... though we're supposed to get a \$25 refund if we sign up before January...not sure that's a great consolation prize for getting jerked around for a year, but whatever!

@Tim @ NCEES I believe there is a typo in the sample. Referring to question 12:

Question:

View attachment 18349

Answer given in the book:

View attachment 18350

Symmetrical Component section from the reference handbook:

View attachment 18351

I believe the answer should be (B, D), excluding (A). Option A states "The three zero-sequence current phasors are equal in magnitude and displaced by 120°." The solution states "Options (A) and (B) are correct, by definition from the transformation matrices shown in the [reference handbook]." However, if we look at the section in the reference handbook, we can clearly see that the zero-sequence current phasors (even though only voltage phasors are specified) have no displacement. Option A would only be true if it said "The three zero-sequence current phasors are equal in magnitude and are in phase." Or "The three zero-sequence current phasors are equal in magnitude and displaced by " It would also be true if it said "The three positive-sequence current phasors are equal in magnitude and displaced by 120°."

However, I have been wrong before. If anyone notices that I missed something please let me know.
A is definitely incorrect. zero sequence currents and voltages are equal in magnitude and angles. If C is incorrect, then A is incorrect. it shouldn't matter if they are currents or voltages.

Frustrating!!!

#### Tim - formerly @ NCEES

##### Member
I passed along the comments and heard the following back from our exam development engineer and publications manager:

This item was updated from the 2017 PE Power practice exam into an alternative item type (AIT).  Option A has now been revised to eliminate any confusion. You can see the revised version in the free preview on ncees.org.

#### Orchid PE

##### Member? You 'member.
Just checked and it now says positive-sequence for Option A. That was a quick update!

#### TwistedLeague

##### A Friend of Hosidius
Looks like all that effort into my Bible binder just went down the drain!!!

Anyone else got this email? Thoughts? Opinions?

As the topic title mentioned, I just received an email from NCEES stating that:

"NCEES has accelerated the PE Electrical and Computer Power exam transition to computer-based testing (CBT). All examinees who are currently registered to take this exam in October will be canceled and automatically provided a full refund of their exam registration fee so they can immediately register for the computer-based exam."
Next time please mark this as PE Electrical. Here i am studying for the Civil Transpo exam and had a big ole heart attack and dirty pants because i read this header

Edit: Apparently I'm blind and cant read that this was under the power forum. Carry on

Last edited by a moderator:

#### Sparky Bill PE

##### Senior, Master, Professional, Licensed Electrical
Next time please mark this as PE Electrical. Here i am studying for the Civil Transpo exam and had a big ole heart attack and dirty pants because i read this header

Edit: Apparently I'm blind and cant read that this was under the power forum. Carry on
Exactly. Imagine how we feel? I have a solid 8 months studying for this stupid test that I'll never get to use these 30+ books on.

#### Zach Stone P.E.

##### Well-known member
I passed along the comments and heard the following back from our exam development engineer and publications manager:

This item was updated from the 2017 PE Power practice exam into an alternative item type (AIT).  Option A has now been revised to eliminate any confusion. You can see the revised version in the free preview on ncees.org.
Hi @Tim @ NCEES, I've found a few mistakes in the new NCEES® Power PE Reference Manual for the CBT exam. One of them is a formula mistake with the variable in the wrong place that will result in a wrong answer for anyone that uses it.

Who can I can notify at NCEES to help bring this to the right persons attention?

#### Tim - formerly @ NCEES

##### Member
Hi @Tim @ NCEES, I've found a few mistakes in the new NCEES® Power PE Reference Manual for the CBT exam. One of them is a formula mistake with the variable in the wrong place that will result in a wrong answer for anyone that uses it.

Who can I can notify at NCEES to help bring this to the right persons attention?
The best way to submit a comment is to use your MyNCEES account. Click the ? by your name in the upper right hand corner and then choose the "ask" option to submit a help ticket detailing your concerns.

#### Zach Stone P.E.

##### Well-known member
The best way to submit a comment is to use your MyNCEES account. Click the ? by your name in the upper right hand corner and then choose the "ask" option to submit a help ticket detailing your concerns.
Thanks Tim, will do.

#### Mohammed Ahmed

##### Active member
Hi,

I have noticed one comment in the reference book page# 65, I would like to share it with you before we escalate it to NCEES.

The equation to find the capacitance is C=Q/pi*f*(Square V)

but if you start analysing the equation from reactive power you will get:

Q= (Square V)/Xc  where Xc=1/2*pi*f*C

then

C=Q/2*pi*f*(Square V)

So, as shown number 2 is missing in the denominator of the equation which mentioned in the handbook.

Is my analysis above correct?

#### speakeelsy PE

##### Well-known member
Hi,

I have noticed one comment in the reference book page# 65, I would like to share it with you before we escalate it to NCEES.

The equation to find the capacitance is C=Q/pi*f*(Square V)

but if you start analysing the equation from reactive power you will get:

Q= (Square V)/Xc  where Xc=1/2*pi*f*C

then

C=Q/2*pi*f*(Square V)

So, as shown number 2 is missing in the denominator of the equation which mentioned in the handbook.

Is my analysis above correct?
Not totally sure on your question @Mohammed Ahmed but on page 63 they have a formula with the 2 in it under "the relationship between capacitive and reactive power".

No idea why they change notation and have Preactive in one spot and q in another spot and the MVAR in another spot?

It's like they gave an intern a stack of books and said "copy paste formulas and diagrams for these topics into a file"

I attempted to solve some problems with the handbook today, and it's just missing so many little things, or it uses really complex formulas for easy stuff - like the above situation.

I did send a feedback letter to NCEES and got a very concise response to my concerns, and that they are aware of the rumors that protection will be hard because it is not in the reference book.

#### Orchid PE

##### Member? You 'member.
Hi,

I have noticed one comment in the reference book page# 65, I would like to share it with you before we escalate it to NCEES.

The equation to find the capacitance is C=Q/pi*f*(Square V)

but if you start analysing the equation from reactive power you will get:

Q= (Square V)/Xc  where Xc=1/2*pi*f*C

then

C=Q/2*pi*f*(Square V)

So, as shown number 2 is missing in the denominator of the equation which mentioned in the handbook.

Is my analysis above correct?
Yes your math is correct, but you need to pay closer attention to what is specified in the reference book. Notice on page 65 it says "V_line is the maximum value of the sinusoid." For the other formula you were using V is assumed to be RMS.

Remember

And

Substituting

That's my best guess as to how they arrived at their formula.

#### Mohammed Ahmed

##### Active member
Yes your math is correct, but you need to pay closer attention to what is specified in the reference book. Notice on page 65 it says "V_line is the maximum value of the sinusoid." For the other formula you were using V is assumed to be RMS.

Remember

View attachment 18416

And

View attachment 18417

Substituting

View attachment 18418

That's my best guess as to how they arrived at their formula.
Thanks for clarification.. to avoid confusion I would recommend to mention in the equation Vmax instead of Vline.

#### MLbS

##### Member
Hi everyone,

Should we print the NCEES Reference book out and using it for the exam? How about NFP70? I got two types of email, one of them said I should print it and bring it to the exam (Texas board) and another said I don't need to bring anything (NCEES). I really confuse? What we should to do? Thank you

#### Dothracki PE

##### Where is my mind?
EB Supporting Member
Hi everyone,

Should we print the NCEES Reference book out and using it for the exam? How about NFP70? I got two types of email, one of them said I should print it and bring it to the exam (Texas board) and another said I don't need to bring anything (NCEES). I really confuse? What we should to do? Thank you
If I were you I would email NCEES stating that Texas is informing their applicants to print out material and bring it to the exam to confirm if that is an accurate statement or not. You should be given access to the reference book as well as NEC, NESC, and NFPA 70E in PDF format on the exam according to NCEES.

#### MLbS

##### Member
If I were you I would email NCEES stating that Texas is informing their applicants to print out material and bring it to the exam to confirm if that is an accurate statement or not. You should be given access to the reference book as well as NEC, NESC, and NFPA 70E in PDF format on the exam according to NCEES.
I got this email from NCEES about my concern.

Hello,Thank you for your email. This exam is computer based and a closed book exam. https://ncees.org/pe-electrical-and-computer-power-exam/The reference handbook will be provided to you at the testing center as a searchable document on the computer. Here is a copy of our Examinee Guide. Please review it before your exam.https://ncees.org/exams/examinee-guide/

#### Dothracki PE

##### Where is my mind?
EB Supporting Member
I got this email from NCEES about my concern.

Hello,Thank you for your email. This exam is computer based and a closed book exam. https://ncees.org/pe-electrical-and-computer-power-exam/The reference handbook will be provided to you at the testing center as a searchable document on the computer. Here is a copy of our Examinee Guide. Please review it before your exam.https://ncees.org/exams/examinee-guide/

Correct, this is what the exam specifications state. https://ncees.org/wp-content/uploads/Power-Dec-2020_CBT.pdf

Maybe Texas didn't get the memo about the change to closed book CBT?

#### Owism

##### PE
Hi everyone,

Should we print the NCEES Reference book out and using it for the exam? How about NFP70? I got two types of email, one of them said I should print it and bring it to the exam (Texas board) and another said I don't need to bring anything (NCEES). I really confuse? What we should to do? Thank you
I printed both and put in a binder. you never know. Ive done practice questions where ive needed nfpa70

D

#### Dilutedar18

Thanks Tim, will do.
Zach, did you ever hear back on these issues?

#### Zach Stone P.E.

##### Well-known member
Zach, did you ever hear back on these issues?
Yes, I contacted NCEES per @Tim @ NCEES's instructions. They said they are working on revising issues.