April 2018 Power PE Difficultly Level

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Meh. I got the survey today too. We ALL did. It’s Automated. I wouldn’t stress about it. But I could see it being a fun way to taunt the new guys every test cycle. 


I mean, take a look at this!


Just going to throw out there that it would be impossible for them to know the score by now. They score new exams with a board of engineers that determine the cut score after scoring each individual problem on difficulty. They also have to do a bunch of stuff like hand grading a random sample of tests to ensure Scantron grading accuracy etc. 

A good read on how NCEES figures out cut scores: http://ncees.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/2012_AM_Understanding_Exam_Dev.pdf


NCEES Survey email freaked me out for a sec :huh:  for no reason!!! I’m not even joking .... 
Anh logically I know its a stretch 1) to assume they would have scores by now  and 2) that they would select failed students for the survey specifically(NCEES i don't think has that much energy or time, else we wouldn't wait 8 weeks for results)

But I think logic was left at the exam hall when i left and everything makes me anxious now till I get the results.
 

 
I felt that the exam was fairly difficult. I am a recent college grad and studied probably 300-500 hours since January. I went into the exam 80-90% confident I'd pass and left thinking anything could happen. I managed to come up with an answer for probably 75/80 questions (doesn't mean I got 75 right though) and felt really unsure about 5 questions.

I took the entire 4 hours for the morning section and had to guess on 2-3 questions. I ate lunch feeling discouraged, mentally drained, and a little frustrated. Some of the questions on the morning section felt very foreign to me and just plain weird. 

The afternoon section went more smoothly for me. I finished the exam in about 3 hours and had to guess on only 1-3 questions.

Difficulty level wise, I'd rate:

NCEES practice test: 6/10 

Engineering Pro practice test: 7/10

Actual PE morning section: 10/10

Actual PE afternoon section: 8/10

Glad to know you guys thought it was difficult as well!

 
As for the Exam, I thought the morning session was difficult. I struggled with some questions to even figure out where to start. 

By the time lunch came i was mentally exhausted and ready to give up . some morning questions could have been attempted with FE handbook equations , So I  kicked myself a few times for not carrying the FE handbook! 

Afternoon was much better in that I at least knew how to start or attempt the problems. 

All in all I think I had to Completely guess about 10 in each session. About 5 in each I think I solved but I don't know how.

I think they need to update the NCEES practice exam because that is seriously outdated.

 
As for the Exam, I thought the morning session was difficult. I struggled with some questions to even figure out where to start. 

By the time lunch came i was mentally exhausted and ready to give up . some morning questions could have been attempted with FE handbook equations , So I  kicked myself a few times for not carrying the FE handbook! 

Afternoon was much better in that I at least knew how to start or attempt the problems. 

All in all I think I had to Completely guess about 10 in each session. About 5 in each I think I solved but I don't know how.

I think they need to update the NCEES practice exam because that is seriously outdated.
I totally agree! The sample exam needs to be updated :|

 
I totally agree! The sample exam needs to be updated :|
I think the sample exam does an okay job of giving you a sense of the breadth of the material.  The problem is the difficulty is nowhere near comprable to the actual exam, at least not this time.  As long as they scale the passing score to reflect that fact it shouldn't be a problem  (As long as they...).  But none of my practice exams, including the hardest which were the official NCEES and the EngProGuide Power exam, gave an accurate representation of the difficulty of this exam.  

I think a lot of it has to do with the change in priorities in the syllabus for this exam, which was the first instance of the realignment of number of questions for different topics.  Without going into specifics I think some of what would have been the more anticipated questions that had been represented in the practice exams were taken out and replaced by more difficult questions.

 
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Same feeling here guys! I was fully prepared with a lot of practice and a lot of reading (about 4-5 months). But, I believe generally, the reference material in the market (practice exams and study books) is less complicated compared to the actual exam. I was really stuck in first 2-3 questions in the morning session and then realized I was wasting my time. The morning test was bit tricky and some questions were very complicated; never heard of them before. Afternoon session has some questions which  confused me a lot but i figured out better than morning. Last time, it was opposite; I was feeling confident in the morning and confused in the afternoon session.

This was my second attempt and feel like the this time it was more harder than last time; and I am not hesistant to say, I went blindly without a lot of practice/reading last time! But, this time I practice a lot and did pretty good (I believe) as a whole. That helped me a lot for the questions with calculations as well as reading helped me to figure out the conceptual questions. Hope to pass this time :D  but fingers cross :(

 
As we have not received scores yet, take this with a grain of salt and through a colored visor... but my opinion is as follows:

I agree with you the testing system is bad.  But the individual questions are actually very  easy if you know the specific angle they are coming from and have experience with it.  Will not get into more detail then that.      

The problem as I see it is the wide breadth of information that is required to be a component electrical engineer in the eyes of the PE Exam.  For instance, if you are doing building systems... you will never jump into Distribution / Transmission systems unless you change job positions.  Generation engineering is an entirely separate beast from all of the above.  They may or may not use the NEC depending on how badly the Gen/Trans/Dist utility wants to act on its Utility Exemption.  They are just completely different job descriptions, requirements and specialty codes and honestly your PE experience in one will not relate to your PE experience in the other.  Engineer's can completely specialize in System Studies and never see the inside of a building or open a code book. 

Keep in mind I am only talking about the time served at a particular job and not over their entire career, but realistically who isn't going to have to relearn this information after 10 years of not touching it?  And almost guaranteed the codes will be different, the type of work you do will be far more in depth then what the PE covers and you are still going to have to study more to become proficient at your new job.   

The test wants you to know the basics of everything upfront.  And I agree that is not a bad strategy.  But where this really begins to grind my gears is the knowledge one needs to comfortable ACE the PE exam cannot be readily obtained from a single library or a limited set of experience.  The PE almost requires you to have worked in multiple  jobs across multiple industries due to the varied and vague listing of study topics.  I take a problem with the premise that there will be some questions you simply cannot answer because you didn't know you needed a specific material or reference.      

The other hardship as I see it is is not knowing the limits that test places on the knowledge base needed.  Similar to above, but whereas above I am talking about different industries, here I am talking about the nuts and bolts of a specific industry.  Take lighting systems for example and the study information from several authors for the PE sample test exams.  Some ask you questions about luminaire distribution types, others about color temperatures, others about wavelengths, others about the general calculations, others about ballast types, other about NEC code requirements, others about IES standards.  The single field of lighting is not exactly massive but it is pretty huge none the less and is noted a single line item on the syllabus.  How far we need to take this?  Do I search these topics in regards to Fluorescent and LED only?  What about LPS, HPS and Incandescent which are outdated technologies and no longer generally specified... but still prevalent in the field?  Do I need to research emergency drivers and egress lighting?  Are these questions fair and will I expect them on an exam?   

Do not get me wrong.  I feel pretty strongly that I passed, but its frustrating when I see questions asked that I know no engineer would ever come across in the field.   

Anyways, end of my rant!

 
Just going to throw out there that it would be impossible for them to know the score by now. They score new exams with a board of engineers that determine the cut score after scoring each individual problem on difficulty. They also have to do a bunch of stuff like hand grading a random sample of tests to ensure Scantron grading accuracy etc. 

A good read on how NCEES figures out cut scores: http://ncees.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/2012_AM_Understanding_Exam_Dev.pdf
I found slide 75/76 very interesting!

Does this mean they grade all the tests, double and some triple checked, within 2 days?!

:eek:

 
By the way, is there any board in US that allow more than three times before asking to go back to shool? Just asking to be on the safe side :blink:

 
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By the way, is there any board in US that allow more than three times before asking to go back to shool? Just asking to be on the safe side :blink:
Some states will ask to submit documentation that you changed your study habits if you have failed 3 times. 

An example may be taking a paid study class or something similar.

 
Some states will ask to submit documentation that you changed your study habits if you have failed 3 times. 

An example may be taking a paid study class or something similar.
Paid study class for a particular course or PE exam? or any of that?

 
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Paid study class for a particular course or PE exam? or any of that?
That's more a question for your specific board. 

The language on my board's website was something to the effect of "demonstrate additional preparation" which typically inferred some type of paid class.

 
Guess what :D , I talked to my collegue who wrote exam second time last year with me and said he got the same survey email both the time; so that is not necessary a sign for failure :laugh:  

 
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I think it was harder than the Oct. 27th 2017 Exam.

That said, I'd say there were 3 problems that I had no clue on and probably had 6 in the morning and 6 in the evening that required guessing.

I felt the morning was more difficult than the afternoon.

Just crossing my fingers and praying.

And, also still gonna do one practice problem a day to keep it fresh until I get my results.
AM session was harder for me. I finished the PM session about an hour early and review my answers and then left about 20 mins early. 

 
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