Tunisia, Egypt...what's next?

[Dleg]

I heard this morning (on Fox News - grain of salt required) that the government was calling its employees and offering to pay them to go out on the streets to help beat on the "traitors", and that if they didn't, they simply would not get paid ... at all. They talked so some guy who had received one of those calls, and supposedly his answer was "I'm hungry, but I'm not selling my soul!"

 

[Capt Worley PE]

Bahrain, Yemen, Libya Face Protests as Region's Unrest Spreads

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-02-16/b...the-unrest.html

 

[Kephart P.E.]

I look at this as a scary thing for US interests, but also these governments deserve it, as you reap what you sow.

These leaders allowed extremist groups to spew Islamic hate at the West and US in particular because is defected that potential anger away from themselves. ie "Don't mind the new Rolls I just bought my teenage son, look at the US people, they are your true enemy."

Finally the right combination of food shortages and unemployment tipped people over the edge, many people removed the blinders and saw that while the US may still be the devil, the ones running your country are no better and have more influence on your life.

Hopefully the nut-jobs don't seize too much power and some the moderates can obtain enough leverage to rule their countries a bit more fairly.

 

[FusionWhite]

^^^ Actually the problem is just the opposite in a lot of countries. In Egypt in particular Mubarak was a huge ally of the US and he and his country received billions a year in economic and military aid from the US. The fact that the protesters in Egypt werent pissed at the US is a bit of a miracle as far as Im concerned. We kept Mubarak fat and happy and in power for a long time and yet I rarely heard much said about the US by the protesters.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

^^And that makes me wonder if we're going to cut foriegn aid to Egypt. Personally, I think we should have long ago. I think pretty much all foriegn aid oughta go away.

 

[CbusPaul]

If we give these countries that don't like us more money, maybe they will like us more. And sadly that's the thinking of the current administration.

 

[FusionWhite]

^^^ HAHAAHAHA, are you serious??? This administration? Giving...money...so people like us?

Countries have been giving money (economic, military aid etc) to other countries since WAY before the US was even ever founded. The current system of "aid" that we see in the world today is still a hold over of the Cold War when the US vs Russia was fought not just with bullets but with money.

We gave country X money to not be communists, Russia gave rebel faction Y to spread Marxist rhetoric. We bought friends, so did the Russians. Egypt was originally a benefactor of Russian generosity as a check against Israel in the 40'-early 70's. After the Egyptian "victory" in the Yom Kippur War (seriously they consider it a victory) and the assassination of Sadat; Mubarak switched sides and withdrew from the Soviet sphere of influence and moved over the good-guys side. We started pouring tons of money and weapons into Egypt (notice the M-1 tanks the military has parked out on the street, they are license built in Egypt). Ohh and all that money to get Egypt to switch sides? Can from Reagan, and then Bush 1, then Clinton, and then Bush 2. So THIS adminstration is not doing anything different then all the other administrations before it for years and years and years.

 

[Kephart P.E.]

^^^ Actually the problem is just the opposite in a lot of countries. In Egypt in particular Mubarak was a huge ally of the US and he and his country received billions a year in economic and military aid from the US. The fact that the protesters in Egypt werent pissed at the US is a bit of a miracle as far as Im concerned. We kept Mubarak fat and happy and in power for a long time and yet I rarely heard much said about the US by the protesters.

Not really, there is a strong voice of Islamic extremists in Egypt, Saudi, not just Iran.

Sure the US supported Mubarak, just like Saudi Arabia, but that didn't make the ruling parties put a stop to the Western hate groups. -If anything it make them more lenient to allow the groups to grow.

This way they couldn't be called out for being Anti Islamic.

 

[benbo]

Not really, there is a strong voice of Islamic extremists in Egypt, Saudi, not just Iran.

Some might say that Egypt was the birthplace of what we now call Islamism. With Qutb and his student Ayman Zawahiri (a mentor of UBL). At least that's what it says in "The Looming Tower."

A lot of this predates Mubarak. I may be wrong, but I thought I read somewhere that the Muslim Brotherhood had something to do with Sadat's assasination because they didn't like the hanky panky with Isreal.

Anyway, as far as the recent goings on, they look fairly multifactional (although I have purposefully not been following it much). I was also sort of surprised at the lack of fiery anti US rhetoric. THat doesn't mean the sentiment doesn't exist. I don't know.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

Bold talk from Khadaffty.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/22/...E71G0A620110222

He may get his wish.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

uh-oh...

WASHINGTON—The government of Col. Moammar Gadhafi hasn't destroyed significant stockpiles of mustard gas and other chemical-weapons agents, raising fears in Washington about what could happen to them—and whether they may be used—as Libya slides further into chaos.
Tripoli also maintains control of aging Scud B missiles, U.S. officials said, as well as 1,000 metric tons of uranium yellowcake and vast amounts of conventional weapons that Col. Gadhafi has channeled in the past to militants operating in countries like Sudan and Chad.

Current and former U.S. officials said in interviews that Washington's counterproliferation operations against Libya over the past decade have scored gains, in particular the dismantling of Tripoli's nascent nuclear-weapons program and its Scud C missile stockpiles. But the level of instability in Libya, and Col. Gadhafi's history of brutality, continues to make the U.S. focus on the arms and chemical agents that remain, they said.

"When you have a guy who's as irrational as Gadhafi with some serious weapons at his disposal, it's always a concern," said a U.S. official. "But we haven't yet seen him move to use any kind of mustard gas or chemical weapon" during the unrest.

More: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405..._LEFTTopStories

 

[wilheldp_PE]

1,000 metric tons of uranium yellowcake.

Oh shit...we invaded Iraq because they didn't have yellowcake uranium. Imagine what we would do with somebody that actually does have some.

 

[FusionWhite]

^^^ Probably nothing.

I just saw this on CNN:

"Benghazi, Libya (CNN) -- Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi on Thursday blamed the violence in his country on young people, who he said are taking some sort of pills and being exploited by Osama bin Laden."

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02/24...ex.html?hpt=T1#

Blaming pills and Bin Laden for his countries problems. WTF is going on in that guys head?

 

[snickerd3]

hes been taking the crazy pills too

 

[Capt Worley PE]

K-daffy has been insane for years. His greatest accomplishment was daring the Great Satan to cross the Line of Death in the Gulf of Sidrah. Today, it's known as the final resting place of the Libyan navy.

 

[navyasw02]

1,000 metric tons of uranium yellowcake.

Oh shit...we invaded Iraq because they didn't have yellowcake uranium. Imagine what we would do with somebody that actually does have some.

Yellowcake is my favorite kind, with chocolate frosting.

 

[cableguy]

Wasn't it Robin Williams with the Line of Death routine?

This is my line of death. You cross it, you die.

{crossed... he backs up}

OK, This is my line of death. You cross it, you die.

{backs up again}

OK, This is my line of death. You cross it, you die.

{backs up again}

OK, you knock on my door, I'm not coming out.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

I liked Kinison's routine.

"Jets were screaming in going, 'Where's the babies room?'"

"Well, we made one little error. we bombed the French Embassy. Maybe our aim would have been a little better if we didn't have to fly those extra 6500 air miles!"

 

[FusionWhite]

^^^ In 1986 the US shot down a couple of Libyan planes over the Mediterranean Sea in a dispute over territorial waters. Libya then bombed a club in Berlin killing two US service members. The US then planned to bomb Libya (airfields and military targets) with F-111's based out of the UK. France, Spain and Italy all denied the US its airspace to carry out the airstrikes, requiring the bomber to fly around Europe adding a bunch of miles onto the trip and requiring extensive aerial refueling. Several bombs missed their intended targets and ended up hitting some embassies.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

FW's explanation was better than mine.

As for Libya and oil, this is an interesting peice of info: