Post your PE failure diagnostic report!

[RIP - VTEnviro]

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[dneva]

How could there not be a direct correlation between the scaled score and the raw score? If there was no direct correlation how would you come up with a scaled score. That means that everyone that failed would receive a score of 69. Makes no sense. 70 is passing. I believe that anywhere in the range from 48-50 for the civil-structural was the passing score since a scale score of 68 resulted in 46 proplems correct. Texas and Virginia results would give you a good educated guess on what number of problems were needed in order to pass the exams. Other states either give you the scaled score or a diagnostic report where one can determine the number of problems answered correctly.

Looking at the numbers, the scores in the morning look like they may be multiples of 12.5% whereas the depth scores are multiples of 20 except for Member Design where it's a multiple of 10. Looking at the test plan, all of the depth topics cover 12.5% of the exam except for Member Design which is 25%. So no once can be certain if the scores are raw or scaled. Also, how can a score of 68% be achieved unless the scores provided were raw and then scaled to 68%. But as anyone who's taken the exam knows that the questions are not equally distributed. Out of 40 questions in the breadth exam, there may not be an equal number of questions for each topic (8 per topic) and I'm sure the same circumstance applies for the depth exam, so the scores may be weighted differently.

So the true question is "How much of an improvement would be required to pass the exam?" If the SMITHRJ40 answered 3 or 4 more questions correctly for the entire exam, would he/she pass the exam?

The other question would be "How confident was SMITHRJ40 after taking the exam?"

Anyway, the diagnostic should be enough to determine areas of improvement. In CA, they don't reveal the scores, but give qualitative remarks for each topic and just a "pass" or "fail" when you receive the letter.

The questions are not equally distributed by are equally weighted. In California they give you percentages for each topic and from these percentages one can determine their number of problems correct. In Texas and Virginia they give you both raw and scaled, therefore someone can have a good idea of the number of problems needed to pass the exam. And if SMITHRJ40 answered 3 or more 4 questions correctly I would bet my lunch money he passes.

 

[benbo]

In Texas and Virginia they give you both raw and scaled, therefore someone can have a good idea of the number of problems needed to pass the exam. And if SMITHRJ40 answered 3 or more 4 questions correctly I would bet my lunch money he passes.

One more time and I give up. There is no indication anywhere that the relationship between the raw score and the scaled score is linear, or anything approaching linear. If you can find such a citation anywhere, please produce it.

The conversion could very well be -

70 scaled score = 56 or more correct

69 scaled score = 47, 48, 49, 50, 51,52, 53, 54, or 55 correct.

68 scaled score = 42, 43, 44, 45, or 46.

You have absolutely no way of telling how they make this conversion. I understand you have some opinion that there is some sort of linear relationship. It could be. But you do not know that and from looking at scores on this site for years, where people with scaled scores of "69" report wide ranges of raw scores, you would have to show me some evidence.

If you believe that 48-50 out of 80 is a typical passing score, you are likely very off the mark. There have been many people posting here with diagnostic computed raw scores well above that level who failed. Although nobody really knows, the consensus around here is that passing is somewhere around 70%. But it depends on the exam, and like I said, nobody knows.

 

[dneva]

In Texas and Virginia they give you both raw and scaled, therefore someone can have a good idea of the number of problems needed to pass the exam. And if SMITHRJ40 answered 3 or more 4 questions correctly I would bet my lunch money he passes.

One more time and I give up. There is no indication anywhere that the relationship between the raw score and the scaled score is linear, or anything approaching linear. If you can find such a citation anywhere, please produce it.

The conversion could very well be -

70 scaled score = 56 or more correct

69 scaled score = 47, 48, 49, 50, 51,52, 53, 54, or 55 correct.

68 scaled score = 42, 43, 44, 45, or 46.

You have absolutely no way of telling how they make this conversion. I understand you have some opinion that there is some sort of linear relationship. It could be. But you do not know that and from looking at scores on this site for years, where people with scaled scores of "69" report wide ranges of raw scores, you would have to show me some evidence.

If you believe that 48-50 out of 80 is a typical passing score, you are likely very off the mark. There have been many people posting here with diagnostic computed raw scores well above that level who failed. Although nobody really knows, the consensus around here is that passing is somewhere around 70%. But it depends on the exam, and like I said, nobody knows.

SMITHRJ40 received a 46 so a 50 is very plausible for being the passing score in the Civil-Structural Depth. Now a 50 for the Civil-Water Depth is not good enough to pass the exam. Now explain what a scaled score of 91 is for problems correct. Someone posted this scaled score. 69 cannot range from 47 to 55, this would make no logical sense if the scaled score can be reported up to 100. I do agree, there is no official document stating the correlation or the non-correlation. But I do believe there is one.

 

[dneva]

In Texas and Virginia they give you both raw and scaled, therefore someone can have a good idea of the number of problems needed to pass the exam. And if SMITHRJ40 answered 3 or more 4 questions correctly I would bet my lunch money he passes.

One more time and I give up. There is no indication anywhere that the relationship between the raw score and the scaled score is linear, or anything approaching linear. If you can find such a citation anywhere, please produce it.

The conversion could very well be -

70 scaled score = 56 or more correct

69 scaled score = 47, 48, 49, 50, 51,52, 53, 54, or 55 correct.

68 scaled score = 42, 43, 44, 45, or 46.

You have absolutely no way of telling how they make this conversion. I understand you have some opinion that there is some sort of linear relationship. It could be. But you do not know that and from looking at scores on this site for years, where people with scaled scores of "69" report wide ranges of raw scores, you would have to show me some evidence.

If you believe that 48-50 out of 80 is a typical passing score, you are likely very off the mark. There have been many people posting here with diagnostic computed raw scores well above that level who failed. Although nobody really knows, the consensus around here is that passing is somewhere around 70%. But it depends on the exam, and like I said, nobody knows.

SMITHRJ40 received a 46 so a 50 is very plausible for being the passing score in the Civil-Structural Depth. Now a 50 for the Civil-Water Depth is not good enough to pass the exam. Now explain what a scaled score of 91 is for problems correct. Someone posted this scaled score. 69 cannot range from 47 to 55, this would make no logical sense if the scaled score can be reported up to 100. I do agree, there is no official document stating the correlation or the non-correlation. But I do believe there is one.

 

[benbo]

SMITHRJ40 received a 46 so a 50 is very plausible for being the passing score in the Civil-Structural Depth. Now a 50 for the Civil-Water Depth is not good enough to pass the exam. Now explain what a scaled score of 91 is for problems correct. Someone posted this scaled score. 69 cannot range from 47 to 55, this would make no logical sense if the scaled score can be reported up to 100. I do agree, there is no official document stating the correlation or the non-correlation. But I do believe there is one.

69 could very easily range wherever they want it to. All you know from SMTHRJ is that 46 isn't passing. Everything else is guesswork on your part. They don't have to comport with your idea of logic. But, like I said, I give up. Believe what you want.

However, for anyone else who missed the mark and actually cares about passing.

If you got 46/80 on the test, don't count on passing merely by picking off a couple more questions. 48/80 is really not likely to cut it. Neither is 50/80. You can pass, but you need to put in a little more work than that. I don't care what exam it is.

 

[Dark Knight]

I am not revealing my sources but I do know that the cut score is 48.

 

[sac_engineer]

I am not revealing my sources but I do know that the cut score is 48.

No way! You're telling me that you only need a raw score of 60% to pass the PE exam? Also, you need to consider the different depth exams and their level of difficulty compared to each other. There's no way that a single cut score can be assigned to all the exams.

 

[dneva]

I am not revealing my sources but I do know that the cut score is 48.

No way! You're telling me that you only need a raw score of 60% to pass the PE exam? Also, you need to consider the different depth exams and their level of difficulty compared to each other. There's no way that a single cut score can be assigned to all the exams.

48 may very well be the passing score for the Civil-Structural, but not the Civil-Water, Civil-Transportation, etc. 56 sounds more like the passing for the rest. I would not be surprised since the Structural Depth has been mentioned to be tough.

 

[dneva]

I am not revealing my sources but I do know that the cut score is 48.

I am assuming your are talking about the Civil-Structural taken this past October.

 

[adc]

I'm curious what kind of info they give in the diagnostic report if you fail, especially in Wa. state. Anyone want to post theirs??

No shame here. I've studied my *** off and this is my fourth fail. I work full time, have three kids, and was going to grad school and pregnant during my first two attempts.

My last two attempts I may have been suffering from pure disillusionment.

I will not give up. I've taken it four times in two years and will be registering to take it again this February. Here is my latest diagnostic report:

CT, Civil Exam, Structural PM

AM:

Construction 63

Geotechnical 75

Structural 100

Transportation 25

Water Resources and Environmental 62

PM:

Loadings 80

Analysis 20

Mechanics of Materials 80

Materials 80

Member Design 20

Design Criteria 40

Other Topics 40

I haven't done the math yet as to the number I got right yet. Just got my letter in the mail today and its Christmas...will get into all the details after the Holidays when I give a crap again.

Happy Holidays to all..and if at first (or second or third or fourth...) you don't succeed...TRY TRY AGAIN.

Wow I just took it for the third time in April. Reading this has give me a glimmer of hope. I might actually take it again if I fail this time.

 

[summit550]

The problem with using your diagnostic % to determine score is that the % is relative to the number of questions in that particular topic. A 50% in transpo breadth with 6 transpo questions equates to 3 questions right, a 100% in structural breadth with 3 structural questions equates to 3 questions right. With each being worth the same your actual points correct is 6 out of 9 (66.6%) but if you average the two %'s you'd come up with 75%. Bottom line, you can't determine points correct by averaging the %'s on the diagnostic.

 

[dneva]

The problem with using your diagnostic % to determine score is that the % is relative to the number of questions in that particular topic. A 50% in transpo breadth with 6 transpo questions equates to 3 questions right, a 100% in structural breadth with 3 structural questions equates to 3 questions right. With each being worth the same your actual points correct is 6 out of 9 (66.6%) but if you average the two %'s you'd come up with 75%. Bottom line, you can't determine points correct by averaging the %'s on the diagnostic.

Why not? The diagnostic is a direct correlation between the number of problems and problems one has correctly answered. You can calculate the number of correct problems by using the percentages given in the diagnostic. The scale score is another issue and it is open to interpretation.

 

[summit550]

The problem with using your diagnostic % to determine score is that the % is relative to the number of questions in that particular topic. A 50% in transpo breadth with 6 transpo questions equates to 3 questions right, a 100% in structural breadth with 3 structural questions equates to 3 questions right. With each being worth the same your actual points correct is 6 out of 9 (66.6%) but if you average the two %'s you'd come up with 75%. Bottom line, you can't determine points correct by averaging the %'s on the diagnostic.

Why not? The diagnostic is a direct correlation between the number of problems and problems one has correctly answered. You can calculate the number of correct problems by using the percentages given in the diagnostic. The scale score is another issue and it is open to interpretation.

Because you do not know the number of questions the % corresponds to.

 

[Dexman PE]

Go get a puppy. There are better things to debate than this drivel...

 

[oluade PE]

The problem with using your diagnostic % to determine score is that the % is relative to the number of questions in that particular topic. A 50% in transpo breadth with 6 transpo questions equates to 3 questions right, a 100% in structural breadth with 3 structural questions equates to 3 questions right. With each being worth the same your actual points correct is 6 out of 9 (66.6%) but if you average the two %'s you'd come up with 75%. Bottom line, you can't determine points correct by averaging the %'s on the diagnostic.

Why not? The diagnostic is a direct correlation between the number of problems and problems one has correctly answered. You can calculate the number of correct problems by using the percentages given in the diagnostic. The scale score is another issue and it is open to interpretation.

Because you do not know the number of questions the % corresponds to.

+1

 

[Paul S]

opcorn:

 

[smithrj40]

Hopefully I won't be using this forum again, I would like to see it active again though with diagnostic reports as people get them.

 

[PE-Hope]

Results for October 2009.

AM:

Construction 50

Geotech 38

Structural 50

Transportation 62

Water & Environment 50

PM:

Earthwork Construction Layout 0

Estimating Quantities & Cost 57

Construction Operations & Methods 67

Scheduling 86

Materials Quality Control and Production 50

Temporary Structures 60

Worker Health, Safety and Environment 100

Other Topics 25

Doing the analysis of the report, I got 43 correct answers (20 in AM and 23 in PM) out of 80. I believe that 56/80 should do it.

 

[smithrj40]

Results for October 2009.
AM:

Construction 50

Geotech 38

Structural 50

Transportation 62

Water & Environment 50

PM:

Earthwork Construction Layout 0

Estimating Quantities & Cost 57

Construction Operations & Methods 67

Scheduling 86

Materials Quality Control and Production 50

Temporary Structures 60

Worker Health, Safety and Environment 100

Other Topics 25

Doing the analysis of the report, I got 43 correct answers (20 in AM and 23 in PM) out of 80. I believe that 56/80 should do it.

Did you get a score, 67, 68, 69?