Time to end affirmative action?

[Dleg]

So now that an African American man has made it to the ultimate position of power in the United States, on his own merits, do you think it is now time to stop affirmative action, at least in terms of race?

I put this question to my very liberal, feminist New York attorney cubicle mate and was very surprised to hear her say that she thinks it is time to stop affirmative action.

I think Obama's victory is as clear a signal as any that affirmative action should be stopped - any and all hiring or procurement of government services and goods should be based purely on a person's or firm's individual merits, with no extra credit given for minority status. I feel the same way about gender-based affirmative action, but unfortunately we don't have a female VP to point to as good reason.

How about you?

:unitedstates:

 

[SSmith]

Interesting question...

I'd like a world where affirmative action isn't needed, but the reality is that a Harvard graduate from one of the country's political capital won an election as an opposing party to one of the most unpopular presidents in recorded history.

If anything, I'd really like for this to inspire those people who would rely on affirmative action otherwise to lean more on self merit.

 

[Flyer_PE]

It should have been stopped long ago. It actually fosters the exact thing it is supposed to counter. A minority in the work place has to prove that he/she got the job on merit rather than a quota. Affirmative action actually handicaps the very people it is supposed to help.

 

[IlPadrino]

Affirmative Action was *never* a good idea... it is simply WRONG to give anyone publicly acknowledged preferential treatment for anything other than ability.

We've still got a ways to go before the mainstream stops "seeing" race (I think there's nothing wrong with seeing color!) but we're making progress.

The U.S. Navy has started on a bold path that many may find misguided: Diversity focus that ensures the pool for Admirals (i..e the Captains that are in zone for selection to Admiral) is representative of the American population's minority distribution by 2037. Some organizations within the Navy are saying they can meet that "quota" sooner - maybe in as little as a few years. That doesn't seem likely unless affirmative action is put into the promotion process (even if informally).

 

[SSmith]

The U.S. Navy has started on a bold path that many may find misguided: Diversity focus that ensures the pool for Admirals (i..e the Captains that are in zone for selection to Admiral) is representative of the American population's minority distribution by 2037. Some organizations within the Navy are saying they can meet that "quota" sooner - maybe in as little as a few years. That doesn't seem likely unless affirmative action is put into the promotion process (even if informally).

I would think a better choice would be a minority distribution that matches the officer corps composition instead of the entire minority distribution of the American population. *shrug* Bottom line is that if this is really a problem, then we have too many Generals/Admirals today.

 

[Road Guy]

That is a question I have, and there is not an easy way to ask this question without sounding “mean” but now that we have a minority as our president, will those minority groups who often look to blame other people for their problems be motivated by this feat to better themselves through education, increased personal responsibility, and job training or will they expect it to be “given.”

Success , comes before work, only in the dictionary.

 

[RIP - VTEnviro]

Success , comes before work, only in the dictionary.

I dig that line!

I think the idea of encouraging a fair and open marketplace is a good one but the practice ends up rewarding unqualified individuals at someone else's expense. It encourages people to ride in on their coat tails instead of their merits.

 

[benbo]

It's too bad they can't do it in a way that rewards overcoming adversity. There is no reason the doctor's kid next door whould get a benefit because he's African American, and some first generation Asian kid living in the inner city should be punished.

 

[DVINNY]

It should have been stopped long ago.

Amen.

 

[MGX]

Haven't several large universities already stopped affirmative action?

 

[MA_PE]

Affirmative Action was *never* a good idea... it is simply WRONG to give anyone publicly acknowledged preferential treatment for anything other than ability.
We've still got a ways to go before the mainstream stops "seeing" race (I think there's nothing wrong with seeing color!) but we're making progress.

The U.S. Navy has started on a bold path that many may find misguided: Diversity focus that ensures the pool for Admirals (i..e the Captains that are in zone for selection to Admiral) is representative of the American population's minority distribution by 2037. Some organizations within the Navy are saying they can meet that "quota" sooner - maybe in as little as a few years. That doesn't seem likely unless affirmative action is put into the promotion process (even if informally).

In other words "affirmative action" = DISCRIMINATION. I agree completely and it should have been stopped long ago.

 

[Supe]

Haven't several large universities already stopped affirmative action?

In regards to "quotas" or school issued minority scholarships, yes (well, SUPPOSEDLY in regards to the quotas).

Can you imagine the uproar we'd hear about if there was something like a caucasian scholarship fund?

Affirmative action has NEVER made any sense to me. Equality through segregation. Go figure.

 

[wilheldp_PE]

Colorado and Nebraska voted to end affirmative action at the state level. It passed in Nebraska, not in Colorado.

 

[Wolverine]

How about "Affirmative Action = Soft Bigotry" ?

To me, Affirmative Action says that 'those people' are not good enough, smart enough, qualified enough to get there on their own, so us smart people have to help make it 'more equal' for them.

I posed this to a liberal friend one time after she said we have to help 'those people'. "Those people"!?! Why do you think we need to help 'those people', unless you believe that 'those people' are somehow inferior? If I were minority, I would be greatly offended and tell them to shove their affirmative action up where the sun don't shine.

 

[P.E. Luchion]

That is a question I have, and there is not an easy way to ask this question without sounding “mean” but now that we have a minority as our president, will minority groups be motivated by this feat to better themselves through education, increased personal responsibility, and job training or will they expect it to be “given.”
Success , comes before work, only in the dictionary.

I am LATINO;

You cant tell me I didnt work my ass off to achieve my BS in Mechanical Engineering, affirmative action does not give you a degree. It provides you a

opportunity and a chance to be successful and through hard work you can achieve the success.

Its been proven over and over again once u get rid of affirmative action there is a dramatic decline in minority students entering universities. It happened at my alma mater.

Should I have not been allowed to attend my school because I grew up in a terrible school system. I was lucky enough to be given a chance to be successful and I seized that moment.

Until education( elementary, junior high school, and high school) is on a even plain in white america and minority america, affirmative action should continue.

Until you personally see the difference in the quality of education between these communities you should not be so quick to want to stop affirmative action.

Im sure SOME of you on here cringe or are nervous or honestly afraid that we have a black president.

As I said earlier once we are on a even plain in free education I would agree on removing affirmative action.

 

[EM_PS]

Haven't several large universities already stopped affirmative action?

Yeah, last electional year (06 i believe), UofM (Michigan) was required by a passed proposal to end affirmative action practices. It didn't.

I think a court order was required to get the 'Harvard of the midwest' to comply w/ the people of the State of Michigan's democratic desire. University @ssholes.

 

[TXengrChickPE]

I have a problem with affirmative action in the workplace. Jobs and promotions should be based on merit, period.

I think that affirmative action in EDUCATION is probably still necessary. But, it should not be based on race. It should be based on income. I haven't spent a lot of time thinking this out. I don't know where the money should come from... but here's a rough idea of what I'd like to see for post-high school education:

Full, or almost full, scholarships for kids from low-income families to attend JUNIOR college, where they can spend a year or two "catching up" to the students who graduated from good high schools. At that point, they can apply to transfer to a 4-year college or university if they want to. In addition, full scholarships to the lowest-income students who are accepted to colleges and universities. But, the applications should be processed entirely on merit, and THEN looked at in regards to financial need. I think this combination could "level the playing field" for students who came from crappy schools without the need for colleges to lower their standards for admission.

I also think that there is still a need for "special" programs for grade school and high school girls wanting to explore math and science. The reason is that girls and boys learn differently, and girls (especially pre-teen thru early teenage) are unlikely to join male-dominated activities like rocket clubs.

 

[Polysloman]

I am LATINO;
You cant tell me I didnt work my ass off to achieve my BS in Mechanical Engineering, affirmative action does not give you a degree. It provides you a

opportunity and a chance to be successful and through hard work you can achieve the success.

Its been proven over and over again once u get rid of affirmative action there is a dramatic decline in minority students entering universities. It happened at my alma mater.

Should I have not been allowed to attend my school because I grew up in a terrible school system. I was lucky enough to be given a chance to be successful and I seized that moment.

Until education( elementary, junior high school, and high school) is on a even plain in white america and minority america, affirmative action should continue.

Until you personally see the difference in the quality of education between these communities you should not be so quick to want to stop affirmative action.

Im sure SOME of you on here cringe or are nervous or honestly afraid that we have a black president.

As I said earlier once we are on a even plain in free education I would agree on removing affirmative action.

I agree with you and I'm not latino. If the shoe was on the other foot those against would feel different. Read Brown vs Board of Education or the history of the segrated south. When whites are the minority in the US we'll be looking for the same opportunity...

Any one that wants to trade senseless killings and slavery for Affirmative Action is free to do so...be careful what you wish for.

 

[MA_PE]

Until education( elementary, junior high school, and high school) is on a even plain in white america and minority america, affirmative action should continue.

Quality of education and community conditions in any area are very much a function of the residents of that community. This notion of "even" is BS. As soon as people care about thier kids education and the kids are taught to respect the educators and the educational system then things will improve. Throwing tax money at it or mandating preferential treatment based on race is not the answer. There is a fair amount of that already.

Face facts - Affluent communities (irrespective of race) WILL have better conditions because the PEOPLE donate time and money to improve thier schools and they are active in thier kids educations. This cannot be fixed by legislature.

For example, when my kids were in grammar school the PTO got together and provided the time (volunteers) and money (through fundraisers) to make improvements to the local school playground. No sooner was the new equipment erected then, the people across town complained that our school had better play yard facilities and they wanted new equipmennt. Of course these folks didn't want to organize fundraiser and would never consider giving up a weekend to work for nothing in a public school yard, that's the City's job.

This has nothing to do with race: demographics maybe, but not race. the sooner people of all races make that distinction the better we all will be.

 

[Road Guy]

I am LATINO;
You cant tell me I didnt work my ass off to achieve my BS in Mechanical Engineering, affirmative action does not give you a degree. It provides you a

opportunity and a chance to be successful and through hard work you can achieve the success.

Its been proven over and over again once u get rid of affirmative action there is a dramatic decline in minority students entering universities. It happened at my alma mater.

Should I have not been allowed to attend my school because I grew up in a terrible school system. I was lucky enough to be given a chance to be successful and I seized that moment.

Until education( elementary, junior high school, and high school) is on a even plain in white america and minority america, affirmative action should continue.

Until you personally see the difference in the quality of education between these communities you should not be so quick to want to stop affirmative action.

Im sure SOME of you on here cringe or are nervous or honestly afraid that we have a black president.

As I said earlier once we are on a even plain in free education I would agree on removing affirmative action.

I think your missing my point.........

but you dont have to be black,latino, asian, poor, etc to have to overcome challenges to get an education. I spent 8 years in the Army (active and reserve) to pay for my college degree, I dont see why anyone esle cant do the same.