It was built in the 30's. Is the movement you're seeing cumulative for the last 90 years or has the house been "repaired" before only to move again? If it's the latter then it's likely an extensive and expensive repair to do correctly which is why it hasn't been fixed before. 130k might go pretty quickly if you repair the foundation and then start systematically start repairing the interior and exterior finishes. Look closely and understand what you're getting if you decide to proceed with this one.
Buying a home with foundation damage
- Thread starter Jaylaw_PE
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Excellent points, and along the lines of where I was going above. Summed up my thoughts exactly.
Capt Worley PE
Run silent, run deep
The question was answered. It wasn't what you wanted to hear.
Maybe what you want to hear isn't the answer at all.
ok gentlemen. met with my SE at lunch today.
basically, the garage is an addition and the slab is sinking at the back and pulling the whole thing off the house. the back stairs that were sinking were also an after-the-fact addition, and are not supported by the house's foundation so they are basically just sitting on dirt.
These issues can be solved by jacking up the garage slab with piers and mudjacking the back steps. (according to my guy).
All for the grand total of about $25,000.
HOWEVER,
we noticed a few other things that i hadn't picked up beforehand, such as some definite bowing inward of the foundation walls on the OTHER side of the house. Due to the age of the house ~75 years, the foundation material is basically stone and crappy mortar. This means that if you place piers, you can only stabilize, not actually lift the foundation, lest you want it to crumble. This means it would require piers ALL THE WAY around the house, with a 'connecting strap' to avoid sinking in between piers. The cost for this? An ADDITIONAL $30,000
Of course this doesn't include patching the brick, walls, fixing cracks, leveling floors, or of course, any cosmetic fixes. We could probably be talking another 50-70k for all of that.
While i was there i noticed the house across the street did sell this week, for $149,000 more than this house was listed at. Doing all the math with the required repairs, it adds up to something like ~105-120k, which would still put us in the range of 30k ahead is the home was purchased at list price (and NO SURPRISES Came up during construction! yeah right)
At this point, after having had ~48 hours to consider it, i'm leaning towards NOT making an offer on this house, but haven't made a final decision yet. Need to review with my wife tonight, but since she is in the medical field, she generally leaves this kind of stuff up to me. While it looks like it could be a chance to get a great deal, it could also lead to a big headache and i don't think we want to deal with a project of this size on our first home.
I have pics of the house and some of the issues i will try to upload shortly!!!
thanks for all your help, and at the very least i found this a useful exercise in analyzing homes as i am still very interested in this neighborhood!
basically, the garage is an addition and the slab is sinking at the back and pulling the whole thing off the house. the back stairs that were sinking were also an after-the-fact addition, and are not supported by the house's foundation so they are basically just sitting on dirt.
These issues can be solved by jacking up the garage slab with piers and mudjacking the back steps. (according to my guy).
All for the grand total of about $25,000.
HOWEVER,
we noticed a few other things that i hadn't picked up beforehand, such as some definite bowing inward of the foundation walls on the OTHER side of the house. Due to the age of the house ~75 years, the foundation material is basically stone and crappy mortar. This means that if you place piers, you can only stabilize, not actually lift the foundation, lest you want it to crumble. This means it would require piers ALL THE WAY around the house, with a 'connecting strap' to avoid sinking in between piers. The cost for this? An ADDITIONAL $30,000
Of course this doesn't include patching the brick, walls, fixing cracks, leveling floors, or of course, any cosmetic fixes. We could probably be talking another 50-70k for all of that.
While i was there i noticed the house across the street did sell this week, for $149,000 more than this house was listed at. Doing all the math with the required repairs, it adds up to something like ~105-120k, which would still put us in the range of 30k ahead is the home was purchased at list price (and NO SURPRISES Came up during construction! yeah right)
At this point, after having had ~48 hours to consider it, i'm leaning towards NOT making an offer on this house, but haven't made a final decision yet. Need to review with my wife tonight, but since she is in the medical field, she generally leaves this kind of stuff up to me. While it looks like it could be a chance to get a great deal, it could also lead to a big headache and i don't think we want to deal with a project of this size on our first home.
I have pics of the house and some of the issues i will try to upload shortly!!!
thanks for all your help, and at the very least i found this a useful exercise in analyzing homes as i am still very interested in this neighborhood!
Capt Worley PE
Run silent, run deep
You forgot to take the estimates and double them.
I think your $50-70k estimate is probably on the low side for the cosmetics. Heck, I know two-room remodels that cost that much. Again, all those estimates are based on no further "surprises". Be sure to factor in permit costs, potential utility rework, etc.
Dexman PE PMP
Internationally PMP'n his PE-ness
And those costs assume it's done right the first time.
this guy is setting the new standard for bitter!
Road Guy
Well-known member
My 2 cents....
I fix a lot of road-way & bridge type sink holes, settlement issues, drainage failures, etc at work and the one thing they all have in common is that the only way you can really find out what was the cause of the sinkhole or settlement, is to take a large piece of equipment and dig a large hole and see what is causing the problem. Obviously to do this your going to cause some damage to the structure above ground in the process. I wouldn't trust the residential equivalent of helical piers without knowing that there wasnt a spring or some other cause of the void creating the problem to begin with
Sure you could get some flow able fill at $350/CY and poke it in the ground and hope it fills all the voids but even that is not a garuntee.. We've done this on failed bridge approach slabs to get by a year or two but it always ends up the same thing, large trac hoe, large hole, bust up everything and replace..
I am very curious though and would like to see some pictures of the problem, maybe its not as bad as being described? I enjoy a good fixer upper also but digging next to a house, shoring, etc? I think that would be too much for me.. Have you tried making a lower offer on the one that is $30K out of your price range?
I fix a lot of road-way & bridge type sink holes, settlement issues, drainage failures, etc at work and the one thing they all have in common is that the only way you can really find out what was the cause of the sinkhole or settlement, is to take a large piece of equipment and dig a large hole and see what is causing the problem. Obviously to do this your going to cause some damage to the structure above ground in the process. I wouldn't trust the residential equivalent of helical piers without knowing that there wasnt a spring or some other cause of the void creating the problem to begin with
Sure you could get some flow able fill at $350/CY and poke it in the ground and hope it fills all the voids but even that is not a garuntee.. We've done this on failed bridge approach slabs to get by a year or two but it always ends up the same thing, large trac hoe, large hole, bust up everything and replace..
I am very curious though and would like to see some pictures of the problem, maybe its not as bad as being described? I enjoy a good fixer upper also but digging next to a house, shoring, etc? I think that would be too much for me.. Have you tried making a lower offer on the one that is $30K out of your price range?
ptatohed
Licenced to Spell
ptatohed
Licenced to Spell
Huh? Are there supposed to be pics?
Road Guy
Well-known member
That is a cool looking house but I think there have got to be some major issues going on near where the garage was added.
Honestly, the only way I would touch it if I was willing to hire an engineer or gasp architect with this type experience have them draw up plans and specs and then bid the job out to see how much it would actually cost to repair, add 30% to whatever the bid is for contingency. Personally I would also talk to someone at the county/ city who deals with building permits and see how close the house would qualify for being condemned first though.. I know it sucks to keep bringing up all the cons but I'd imagine that whomever issues the building permits is gonna require the entire structure to be brought up to current code when you apply for the building permit/ demo permit. Thinking back I would talk to your county / city building department first before going any further.
If you just had tons of money and wanted to do a cool project I would say go at it, but for us normal folks I would have to pass, even though it is a reallly cool looking style of house..
Honestly, the only way I would touch it if I was willing to hire an engineer or gasp architect with this type experience have them draw up plans and specs and then bid the job out to see how much it would actually cost to repair, add 30% to whatever the bid is for contingency. Personally I would also talk to someone at the county/ city who deals with building permits and see how close the house would qualify for being condemned first though.. I know it sucks to keep bringing up all the cons but I'd imagine that whomever issues the building permits is gonna require the entire structure to be brought up to current code when you apply for the building permit/ demo permit. Thinking back I would talk to your county / city building department first before going any further.
If you just had tons of money and wanted to do a cool project I would say go at it, but for us normal folks I would have to pass, even though it is a reallly cool looking style of house..
Dexman PE PMP
Internationally PMP'n his PE-ness
In the Wash Park area of Denver (very similar age/size/style), this house would go for $500k plus...
ptatohed
Licenced to Spell
Ah, I can see the pics from my home computer now. Nice looking house (from the front).
I guess I shouldn't be surprised having grown up in Fairfield County, CT. At least it serves as a reminder of why I moved south!
Capt Worley PE
Run silent, run deep
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