Like you are stating we need as much oil/gas to be produced in the US for the US. Regardless who the leader is - "wink, wink" type of enforcement of any regs on the books is destructive and wrong...since we have to eventually pay for all the screw-ups, essentially this is worse than socialism - no benefits from the profits, but pay when shit hits the fan. Regs are not my forte, but one could easily imagine some sort of common sense applied - back-up plans, funding for back-up plans, fail-safe design completed, sign-offs, redundancies, system monitoring....etc, versus what we have now - a git'er done mentality, where self-regulation doesn't work, especially when greed is the driving factor. Here, government does have a role, but has lost its upper-hand, probably due to all the lobbying & subsidizing of this industry.
Oil slick
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Chucktown PE
Well-known member
My point is the back up plans and the fail-safe design failed. No amount of regulation by some bureaucrat could have prevented this. And most would argue that the offshore oil/gas industry is highly regulated as is.
It's convenient to point the finger at BP because they're a big evil corporation and I'm sure their CEO made a lot of money last year. But don't you think that given the consequences they would have chosen to operate as carefully as possible.
To me, this is an impressive response considering their back up plans and fail-safe designs have failed and they don't have any other options available at the moment.
BP Response
Also, I think it's interesting to note that the White House released a statement late last week that said BP isn't doing anything without approval from BO's cabinet. Exactly what expertise do those morons have that would qualify them to "help"?
Chucktown PE
Well-known member
One more thing while I'm thinking about it. Has it ever occured to anyone that BP might not have had to drill in 5000 feet of water if the environmental whack jobs hadn't convinced our dipshit politicians that drilling shouldn't be allowed in the shallower waters of the Gulf. This forced the oil companies far offshore to the deeper waters. If this accident had happened in 500 feet of water, instead of 5000, it would have been taken care of long before now. In fact, it might well have never happened in the first place.
Similarly, if the environmental whack jobs hadn't convinced our dipshit politicians that drilling shouldn't be allowed in the shallower waters of the Atlantic Coast, this accident would have hasppened in 500 feet of water, instead of 5000.
Similarly, if the environmental whack jobs hadn't convinced our dipshit politicians that drilling shouldn't be allowed in the shallower waters of the Atlantic Coast, this accident would have hasppened in 500 feet of water, instead of 5000.
Am not going to be a chearleader for BP on this one, the fact that so many livelihoods are going to be ruined, probably for the second time, because someone along the line royally screwed up is wrong. I love gulf shrimp!! It tastes better than oil 
Chucktown PE
Well-known member
I'm not a chearleader for BP either, but to say that 'more government regulation would have prevented this' is assinine.
D
Dexman PE
I speak from experience that the big oil companies were moving into deeper water anyway, of their own accord, because that's where new oil is. The easy stuff is all gone, for the most part. It's an engineering challenge to drill and produce from deeper waters, and that's the exact kind of thing people like us strive for. And, as the price of oil goes up, these deeper reservoirs become more practical. Imagine the risks we will be taking when oil hits $200 a barrel.
Again, it is premature to be arguing over who is at fault and whether or not more or less regulation would have prevented this. It is not public yet what really happened.
Plus, the breaks for the oil industry go way back. Before Bush, before BO. One of the reasons the EPA regulations take up an entire shelf is because of all the specific, individual exemptions written into them for oil & gas, coal, and agricultural facilities. I've heard it said, and it's absolutely true, that we ALL share the blame in this, a little bit, at least. Lobbyists, congressmen, industry people, and every single one of us who drives a car or relies on plastics and other petroleum products.
The thing that bothered me the most about working in the oil field was my neighbors in Ventura, CA, on the beach. My oilfield roomates and I joined them once for a (illegal) bonfire and beers one night, and as soon as they found out we worked on the platforms that were visible from there, they gave us so much shit we had to leave. And those bastards were the ones making those platforms necessary - commuting to LA every day, driving SUVs. That's why I am 100% in favor of drilling in ANWAR. If you are going to live the lifestyle, you better accept the consequences. In my opinion, it's better that this spill happened in the Gulf of Mexico, than, say, off of Nigeria or Malaysia or something. Then it would have been nothing more than a tragic byline, quickly forgotten, where some other poor bastards who can barely afford to eat pay the price for our SUVs and modern conveniences have to deal with it.
It sucks and we need to find out what happened and, if necessary, punish any wrongdoing, but we should also be willing to accept our part in all of this, and future accidents.
wilheldp_PE
PE, LEED AP, SPAM KING
CNN's Breaking News story on it says this about the new capping procedure. No new word on the relief well.
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Master slacker
Something awesome.
The ROV is holding onto some swiss-cheesed box-looking thing right now. I have no idea what it is. :huh:
Master slacker
Something awesome.
Hybrids are a joke. They may not use as much gas, but the batteries aren't any better. When was the last time anyone used non-toxic disposal of batteries or even heard where all the battery material comes from?
Chucktown PE
Well-known member
Hybrids are a joke. They may not use as much gas, but the batteries aren't any better. When was the last time anyone used non-toxic disposal of batteries or even heard where all the battery material comes from?
There's actually some good reading material on where they mine the raw materials for the batteries. I think it's up in Canada. It has turned the land into a toxic waste dump.
Ble_PE
I need a beer.
I've stayed out of this conversation mostly because I have absolutely no idea how the leak should be stopped and I know that BP is doing whatever they can to stop this thing as quickly as possible. We all see how well that is going. I saw this article this morning and it seems like a plausible solution, but it involves the N-word (N meaning nuclear). What is everyone's thoughts on this?
Link to article.
Link to article.
Road Guy
Well-known member
considering obama cant make any decisions I doubt this one would ever get off the discussion table..
I wonder though if blowing the hell out of it would only make the oil leak bigger? Also it said the ruskies had to drill 4 miles and BP said they need until August to drill the relief wells...
I find it amusing that FX is running Armageddon so much during this well bust, you woudl think showing a cowboy happy oil drillers wouldnt be all the PC right now....
I wonder though if blowing the hell out of it would only make the oil leak bigger? Also it said the ruskies had to drill 4 miles and BP said they need until August to drill the relief wells...
I find it amusing that FX is running Armageddon so much during this well bust, you woudl think showing a cowboy happy oil drillers wouldnt be all the PC right now....
Road Guy
Well-known member
In reference to the suv driving Americans
Your right about the location though, a few months back a tanker got of course and ran into australias barrier reef and I don't think it even made CNN for more than 30 seconds
Your right about the location though, a few months back a tanker got of course and ran into australias barrier reef and I don't think it even made CNN for more than 30 seconds
Right. SUVs, priuses, they all use oil so basically it's the same thing. If we all drove Priuses we'd still need that same oil, maybe a few years later, but we'd still need it. Planes, ships, trains, asphalt, we're pretty heavily dependent on the stuff. Oil WILL run out, so sooner or later we're going to need to face that fact and develop some alternatives.
As a purely strategic measure, I would think the US (and the rest of the world, for that matter) would want to conserve oil for those uses like airplanes, for which no reasonable alternative exists. Switching to electric cars, or fuel cell cars, or something like that would seem to be an extremely good idea, but will not happen until it is too late, if only market forces are at play. If we just wait for the price of oil to make alternative fueled cars attractive, then will we have killed air travel?
As a purely strategic measure, I would think the US (and the rest of the world, for that matter) would want to conserve oil for those uses like airplanes, for which no reasonable alternative exists. Switching to electric cars, or fuel cell cars, or something like that would seem to be an extremely good idea, but will not happen until it is too late, if only market forces are at play. If we just wait for the price of oil to make alternative fueled cars attractive, then will we have killed air travel?
Master slacker
Something awesome.
Oil will NOT run out any time soon. Why does everyone assume that it will?
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