AE PE April 2011

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:laugh:
OH MY GOD, all that reference material...you even took an Scale with you!
I even used that scale solving a problem adding power triangles to avoid the trig calcs ;) !

What I found funny is - I really did use almost everything at least once, and you could pretty easily tell who was taking the AE PE in the crowd because we were the pack mules carrying crates/shelves/mini-libraries around in some form or fashion. I was shocked to see most other disciplines only came with a small backpack or box with fraction of the reference materials... I guess it illustrates the AE PE is very much focused on breadth? I didn't even bring the full list of recommended references in the PPofE exam booklet =).

Hope all this helps others since there's so little real materials to go off of :) !

 
Following is the tail-end of a PM conversation I had recently... probably might help someone else out there and Brian agreed he'd be okay with posting this publicly ;) :

Nickarus,
Thanks for your quick and informative reply.

Quick question, did you have to make much use of "Nick's Plumbing Book"? Were there many plumbing questions on the exam? I thought that was a good idea to make your own book based on college notes, but I don't have such a background. Nor do I have experience practicing plumbing.

I have bought the PP&E study guide and I will study it as close as you recommend. I do want to get the majority of reference materials as well. So did you buy all of the reference materials that you mentioned on your list? Wasn't that expensive? I am hoping to find some at the library and to photocopy crucial sections. What do you think?

Thanks again!

Brian

Hey Brian,

"Nick's Plumbing Book" is something I didn't use much in the exam, though much of its contents are in my day-to-day memory. What I did use I think could be found in the IPC/IMC as well.

The distribution of the exam you'll take so far as subject matter goes is probably a toss up, but like the practice exam I think mine was pretty evenly divided between HVAC, plumbing, electrical power/lighting, structural, envelope construction, and construction practices/miscellaneous stuff. No one discipline or area of subject matter stood out as dominant.

I bought a number of these texts back in college, but didn't buy much in preparation for the PE... I borrowed all of the wood structural references from a friend, and much of the NFPA/International code series/ASHRAE texts were simply borrowed from colleagues at work and our code library at work.

Photocopying key sections for each reference sounds great and is better than nothing, but my impression is that the exam is set up in part to test your familiarity with what's covered in the recommended references... sometimes the trick is not to know a 20 step process to determine the flow rate through a pipe given tons of pertinent/irrelevant variables, but rather to know there's a table in the IPC that makes it a 1-step process.

 
huh....first I've ever heard of a Architectural Engineering PE. Tried reading about it online, but I can't figure out what they do exactly.

 
huh....first I've ever heard of a Architectural Engineering PE. Tried reading about it online, but I can't figure out what they do exactly.
I can't answer for everybody's job description or motivations, but I can share my personal perspective/thoughts: AE PE's are generally individuals who are (A) working somewhere in the building construction industry and (B) who are to some extent "cross-discipline" in practice.

The AE PE exam is unique in that each question is specific/applicable to engineering within the commercial building/construction industry.

Our engineering design and skillsets are not limited to any single discipline. I can run loads, size HVAC/plumbing equipment, pipe/duct everything up, select and lay out lighting fixtures power/telecomm outlets, draw up risers and control schematics for all trades, and assemble the specs. I'm versed in NEC, common building codes, energy and ventilation standards, and so forth. That said, I do not touch structural with a 39.5ft pole, except on rare occasions where a quick reference to my steel manual can provide general guidance.

In practice, I will cover all MEP trades for smaller projects, but will commonly split the work with one or more other designers for larger/complex projects. For example, I'll take on the role of "the electrical" a given project and focus on that piece of the pie, allowing me to devote more time and attention to afford a more complex design. The trades I pick up for any given project varies with the individual(s) I'm working with and what holes need to be filled.

An AE PE is likely NOT designing utility power plants or chiller internals. We're not sealing drawings for a suspension bridge. There are projects in the broader building/construction industry that do require a specialist, and it's on us (as with every PE) to follow the NSPE code of ethics and only seal/sign items falling under our area of competence.

Our cross-discipline background definitely helps us in certain aspects including energy modeling, project management, CA, and design coordination meetings.

I recall from my job-hunt years ago that some employers actually discourage cross-discipline experience/practice in all or part of their workforce ("you're either mechanical OR electrical"). I suppose in such an environment/culture you'd have an uphill battle to pursue or even consider a multi-discipline license. If you reside or do most of your work in one of the states who doesn't yet recognize the AE PE, I could see that turning you away as well.

I don't have the life-experience yet to know how everything might turn out, but I anticipate my past and on-going cross-discipline CA/project management experience one day will not hurt my chances at climbing to an upper management role.

Again, this is just one young PE's view of the situation. I'm certain individual experiences and circumstances drive others to pursue the AE PE (or not), but for me it seems the best fit as it's the exam whose contents most closely match my actual areas of competence and practice, in addition to my future career goals. I live & work in a state which recognizes the AE PE, which I suppose helps from a marketing perspective, but I continue to design for projects all over the country in states who do and don't recognize the AE PE (in which case an ME and/or EE in our office can review and seal my work).

As an aside: I've noted through wikipedia that the term "Architectural engineering" means very different things as you cross borders into other countries - I gather building engineering of all disciplines and general architecture practice can be one and the same thing in Japan, for example.

 
Sounds like a move for architecture go back to Master Builder Status. In hindsight it also looks like a Jack of all trades role. Is it possible to have expertise in all fields?

I have a degree in architecture, and have been getting experience at it, but I've also been doing alot of what you describe the past 3 years. Some of it in an Engineering firm setting, and most of it on a military installation setting.

I never knew it could be considered architectural engineering.

While at the same time, I'm learning and studying how contracts work, meeting with contractors, negotiating pricing, determining risks, understanding how bonding, substantial completion, final completion, project closeout, time frames for deliverable, cost estimating, and on and on. I'm taking the A.R.E. as we speak.

Interestingly, I took on my current job, thinking it was an architect position, when in fact it's an architectural engineering position. So now I know thanks to this board. Very few architects out there that I meet have a technical background.

At the same time, I do have to argue that the engineers do have a tendency to make things look horrific. I guess that's why army bases have a bad reputation - they've been planned and designed by engineers for way too long.

 
I have not enough time to prepare for my examine. so i have to squeeze time to study.

 
Wow, it's great to hear from someone! How long have you been studying for the exam? I guess that I started in late September. I've been mostly studying MEP from the M&E Equipment for Buildings book up to this point. How about you? Have you found a good study technique?

Anyways, are you also an AE like me? From where and when did you graduate? I was Penn State AE '02.

Brian

 
huh....first I've ever heard of a Architectural Engineering PE. Tried reading about it online, but I can't figure out what they do exactly.
Double-check your state's statutes and/or rules.

Arizona has a specific definition for what Architectural Engineering entails.

I am also attempting to get my AE PE license, and it seems to be relatively easy since I'm already an architect. Someone at the state board mentioned that architects typically get involved in all disciplines. Not that that is the prerequisite, but since AE PE is still relatively new, they're reviewing everyone's qualifications on a case-by-case basis.

Especially with those individuals who have no college experience.

 
To date here is a list of the study materials I researched and have bought. Some of them came form the list pf references in the A/E Principles and Practices.

  • PE Mechanical: HVAC and Refrigeration Sample Questions and Solutions
  • Principles and Practice of Engineering Architectural Engineering Sample Questions and Solutions
  • Standard Handbook of Architectural Engineering
  • 2012 International Building Code
  • 2012 International Mechanical Code
  • National Electrical Code 2008 (National Fire Protection Association)
  • Mechanical and Electrical Equipment for Buildings
  • Civil engineering reference manual
  • 4 ASHRAE HANDBOOKS 84-91 IP EDITION 1984 Systems1986 Refrigeration1989 Fundamentals1991 Applications

I feel confident I have decent basis of reference materials.

BKeefer01 is interested in an online study group using this forum. If Bartlett J wants to join, you are more than welcome.

At this point, I am reviewing the sample ??? to determine where I need to concentrate. Structural and Electrical are my key areas to focus on for now.

 
Questions for previous test takers!

In the practice exam book, there are some questions such as 107, 505, and 506 that depend on excerpts/tables from the various resource books of the AEI-published resource list (most commonly found seems to be ASCE 7).

My first question is whether the excerpts/tables are printed along with the problem on the actual exam just as it is in the practice exam book. Or do we have to make sure to bring all of the reference books with us and the question on the actual exam will only make reference to the book without printing the excerpt? I ask this because I was wondering if I really have to track down and bring all of the books on the reference list.

My second question....So does this mean that, for example, you brought the entire ASCE 7 manual with you to the exam or just a few photocopied excerpts.

Brian

 
What did you do to study for the structural portion of the exam? It's my weakest area so I'd like to focus on that.

Has anyone looked into purchasing the NCEES Civil Structural Practice problems?

This is what I get for specializing in Environmental when I studied my AE degree....haha.

 
Please don't read this if you plan to go through the Principles and Practice of Engineering book all at once like a practice exam.

But I'm sorry, I don't understand and reservedly disagree with the answer found in the back of this book for problem #108:

108. The term for the ratio of the Luminance leaving a surface area to the illuminance arriving on the surface is:

a. Exitance

b. Transmittance Factor

c. Luminance Factor

d. Luminous Flux

Option d deals with the amount of emanating from a source, so that is out.

My first thought is that the answer was exitance, which is a measure of light leaving a surface. But then I realized that it wasn't a ratio of leaving to arriving luminance. Still quite unsure, I deduced it might have to be either transmittance or luminance factor. The problem is that the word "leaving" is quite ambiguous and even though I have checked the answer in the back of the book to be c, I can't explain why.

Does any have sound logic on this issue that will help me gain confidence to move past this problem?

 
Sounds like a poorly worded question honestly. "C" is a ratio under ideal circumstances, and that's not specified in the quesiton; whereas "A" is more defined as the ability to emit radiation. "C" would be the "most correct" answer, albeit the question is flawed.

Simply my 2 cents, nothing more.

 
I'd also recommend "simplified engineering for architects and builders, 11th ed." and "foundation design, principles and practices, 2nd ed.". Almost every structural problem in the AEI practice exam I could find a reference for in the simplified text.

- Dave

Philadelphia, PA

(taking NY AE PE)

 
Anyone out there have any insight into this question? I see what they're doing, but wanted to understand better why they calculate the area the way they did.

Thanks,

- Dave

Philadelphia, PA

 
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