What references did you use for the Water Resources/Environmental PE Exam?

[DanHalen]

Recently I just got the bad news that no one ever wants to hear that I did not pass the WR/Env PE exam. Fortunately no one showed up with a hacksaw to chop off my arms, no one died, and the world is still turning. I live to fight another day!

What I learned through this whole process is I made a lot of mistakes and it's no wonder I didn't pass. I used the School of PE's class notes, took their review course, and studied my environmental engineering class notes, problems, and tests for college (they used the Davis & Cornwell textbook). The School of PE does an excellent job of trimming the fat and getting the point across but like what many others say and even SofPE you must study additional material. I did not do that. I had plans to study Six Minute Solutions and the NCEES study guide but ran out of time. Exam anxiety also didn't help and I was only able to get about 2 hours of sleep the night before the test.

This is what I studied and took with me to the exam:

• School of PE class notes (all five modules plus the bonus material)
• CERM (13th Edition)
• Introduction to Environmental Engineering by Davis & Cornwell

There were a handful of problems in CERM that I studied that was recommended by SofPE. I primarily used CERM as a reference and not much else.

From what most test takers are saying the following is highly recommended:

• CERM
• All-in-One by Goswami (both the practice problems book and the Exam Guide)
• Six Minute Solutions for Water Resources/Environmental
• NCEES Sample Questions and Solutions for Water Resources/Environmental
• School of PE class notes & workshop problems
• Introduction to Environmental Engineering by Davis & Cornwell

Some have suggested purchasing a copy of the Metcalf & Eddy book but I haven't seen much evidence saying that you will not pass if you don't have it. Most people that have it barely open it or don't use it at all. Correct me if I'm wrong.

There is a whole plethora out there about cut scores and how close people come to passing and I don't want to get involved in that. What I want to focus on is what did you study, specifically which problems did you study, and what references did you use that helped you pass? Did you create your own equation sheets? What would you tell someone who is about to take the exam for the very first time to study? NCEES does have an outline of the topics that are on the exam. The course outline is not accurate and shouldn't be relied on too much. I don't particularly trust it after taking this exam. I can give examples of how the outline is not accurate but not sure what the rules are (i.e. can I say what type of problems were on the exam vs what's on the NCEES outline)?

I assume that all problems in the SofPE notebooks, Six Minute Solutions for Water Resources/Environmental, and NCEES Sample Questions and Solutions for Water Resources/Environmental are all fair game unless someone has better insight. What about CERM, All-in-One Practice Problems, All-in-One Exam Guide, Davis & Cornwell, and any others you may have used? I know there has to be a winning combination of problems and references that will put most test takers over the hump.

 

[305Gurl]

All I can say is I also use the School of PE notes (took online class-much better in my opinion) and CERM and answered approximately 85% of the morning (took Transportation Depth). I brought in my college textbooks for all 5 discipline for the morning and that helped too. I worked six minutes "HARD" solutions and All in One textbook. I failed this exam twice before so I know how you feel--it will make you more hungry to pass, after the initial shock of failing. In the previous attempts, I scored well in the afternoon portion and did terribly on the morning exam. My strategy this time was to ace the morning which will give enough wiggle room to conquer the afternoon exam. I think I made about 34 correct in the morning and 31 to 32 correct in the afternoon (that I am sure of). I then made educated guesses on the remaining problems, something guessing the same letter consistently.

My advice, try to look at the diagnostic report and work hard on those weak area. Next exam try to get most of the problem correct in the am and work harder on the PM exam.

 

[DanHalen]

I did very well on the Transportation AM problems. Not so much on Geotech, Structures, and Construction. What problems did you look at in CERM and All-in-One (just the morning stuff)? Just like you I did well in the afternoon and terrible in the morning. My approach was that the SofPE notes would be enough for the AM questions and the Davis & Cornwell would be enough for the PM. Obviously that approach was wrong. I definitely need to work on the AM questions and keep the PM material fresh.

The really frustrating part about the exam that cost me big points is that I wasn't able to find the answers in any of the books I had for the qualitative type questions. I had CERM, Davis & Cornwell, SofPE notebooks, a water resources/environmental textbook (I can't remember the author) that I borrowed from a co-worker, and a dictionary. I thought this would have been overkill. It seemed like at least 1/3 of the entire exam was geared toward testing how familiar you are with your references, and was as simple as looking up an answer without a single calculation. The majority of those questions I couldn't answer because I was unable to find the answer in any of the books I had. I was only able to answer just a few questions by looking up the answers in CERM. Perhaps the All-in-One would have helped with those "look-up" morning questions where CERM came up short?

 

[305Gurl]

I did very well on the Transportation AM problems. Not so much on Geotech, Structures, and Construction. What problems did you look at in CERM and All-in-One (just the morning stuff)? Just like you I did well in the afternoon and terrible in the morning. My approach was that the SofPE notes would be enough for the AM questions and the Davis & Cornwell would be enough for the PM. Obviously that approach was wrong. I definitely need to work on the AM questions and keep the PM material fresh.

The really frustrating part about the exam that cost me big points is that I wasn't able to find the answers in any of the books I had for the qualitative type questions. I had CERM, Davis & Cornwell, SofPE notebooks, a water resources/environmental textbook (I can't remember the author) that I borrowed from a co-worker, and a dictionary. I thought this would have been overkill. It seemed like at least 1/3 of the entire exam was geared toward testing how familiar you are with your references, and was as simple as looking up an answer without a single calculation. The majority of those questions I couldn't answer because I was unable to find the answer in any of the books I had. I was only able to answer just a few questions by looking up the answers in CERM. Perhaps the All-in-One would have helped with those "look-up" morning questions where CERM came up short?

The morning conceptual questions are those that you either know from school, through experience practicing or you don't know them. You will not have enough time to go searching for these answers. I spent the last few months after failing the exam focusing on the fundamentals for each topic outlined in the NCEES Specification for the morning breath exam. I spend many hours and $$$ working and understanding these construction, Geotechnical Eng and Structural problems, Those were the same area that I struggled with on the exam too. I bought construction, survey, Geotech and a structural textbooks and read through each topic as outlined in the spec and didn't stop until I understood each concept. When I opened the exam last April, I found those conceptual questions very, very easy, this time around, as I actually went over similar matter in my textbooks. I was lacking in knowledge on my two previous attempts. I also made my own formula sheets which cuts the time searching references in half. This is what pushed me over the edge. I have all these book and will happily sell them to you for what I bough them for (very cheap). If you don't buy my books, just look for some good textbooks that cover these discipline well for the exam.

 

[daxx1313]

I’m studying for the October 2013 Env/Water PE exam here in California, and it will be my first time taking it. I’m hitting the books for 2-ish hours a night, and I have 127 days until the test so I have time. My issue is with the study materials that are out there. I’ve gone through the CERM water/env sections, NCEES practice exam and am currently struggling with the 6-min solutions. The 6-min sol problems seem to have an abundance of really obscure equations that I can’t find in any book.

So here’s my question, I have all my upper division course textbooks from college, CERM 10th and a hand-me-down of a coworker’s Cal Poly PE review course. Am I on the right track?

Should I stick with the 6-min sol/NCEES/CERM practice problems or go a different direction? Right now I’m NOWHERE near 6-min/problem, and I’m curious if these three sources are a good gauge of the actual problems I will face in the PE. Is there anything I can do to get through the problems quicker?

Any comments will be welcomed.

Thanks,

Daxx

 

[agni]

I did very well on the Transportation AM problems. Not so much on Geotech, Structures, and Construction. What problems did you look at in CERM and All-in-One (just the morning stuff)? Just like you I did well in the afternoon and terrible in the morning. My approach was that the SofPE notes would be enough for the AM questions and the Davis & Cornwell would be enough for the PM. Obviously that approach was wrong. I definitely need to work on the AM questions and keep the PM material fresh.

The really frustrating part about the exam that cost me big points is that I wasn't able to find the answers in any of the books I had for the qualitative type questions. I had CERM, Davis & Cornwell, SofPE notebooks, a water resources/environmental textbook (I can't remember the author) that I borrowed from a co-worker, and a dictionary. I thought this would have been overkill. It seemed like at least 1/3 of the entire exam was geared toward testing how familiar you are with your references, and was as simple as looking up an answer without a single calculation. The majority of those questions I couldn't answer because I was unable to find the answer in any of the books I had. I was only able to answer just a few questions by looking up the answers in CERM. Perhaps the All-in-One would have helped with those "look-up" morning questions where CERM came up short?

The morning conceptual questions are those that you either know from school, through experience practicing or you don't know them. You will not have enough time to go searching for these answers. I spent the last few months after failing the exam focusing on the fundamentals for each topic outlined in the NCEES Specification for the morning breath exam. I spend many hours and $$$ working and understanding these construction, Geotechnical Eng and Structural problems, Those were the same area that I struggled with on the exam too. I bought construction, survey, Geotech and a structural textbooks and read through each topic as outlined in the spec and didn't stop until I understood each concept. When I opened the exam last April, I found those conceptual questions very, very easy, this time around, as I actually went over similar matter in my textbooks. I was lacking in knowledge on my two previous attempts. I also made my own formula sheets which cuts the time searching references in half. This is what pushed me over the edge. I have all these book and will happily sell them to you for what I bough them for (very cheap). If you don't buy my books, just look for some good textbooks that cover these discipline well for the exam.

@305Gurl: What materials are you selling? I'm interested to find out about construction and geotech materials. Could you please PM or post here about the names and prices of these books?

 

[DanHalen]

There is already a really nice thread that deals with what books and you need which can be found here: http://engineerboards.com/index.php?showtopic=18130&hl=

There is a lot of truth to what 305Gurl is saying. Since May I have began going through my new references and studying Six Minute Solutions. Six Minute Solutions is really tough dax1313 because of the level of difficulty and I can tell you from experience those problems are way harder than anything you will see on the exam. Even with all the new references I have there are still plenty of problems that I cannot find the equations, variables, tables, etc. Just do the best you can, work through them, and ask for help on this forum if you need help. One thing that I did for the exam this past April was to create an equation sheet for the water/wastewater treatment section for the PM. My homemade equation sheet helped me to nearly ace those parts on the exam. You can easily create your own equation sheet from the equations used in Six Minute Solutions. They have been pretty decent about explaining what some of the variables are and what units they are expressed in. On the afternoon part of the exam I got raped on hydrology and water quality. There was way more "qualitative" type questions than I anticipated and since all I had was CERM and my School of PE notes I was pretty much a sitting duck. That was where I lost major points. On the exam that I took it seemed like almost half the exam was qualitative type questions. I would say that a third of them you can find easily by looking up the definition or looking at the glossary in CERM, another third of the problems might be something that I'm vaguely familiar with but can't find in CERM or my School of PE notebooks, and the last third were questions I had no idea how to answer.

This past March I started reading what others have done and what they recommended at the link I posted above. My confidence sank and I felt like I was going to be in trouble on the exam. If I could have withdrawn my application I would have and waited until October to take the exam. The School of PE provided a lot of problems and their notes are very helpful, but I feel like many others in that you need to do more than just study their problems and notes. Even in their review course their instructors encouraged and almost demanded that we study other materials. What would be nice is if they would give us a list and tell us what to study. If you are planning to go through the NCEES outline and study only those topics you need to be cautious about doing so. Compare that with what's in the front of your CERM and blend them together. That should be what you study. There were a few topics that I know well that were not on the NCEES outline but were on the exam. IMO, the NCEES outline is pretty useless. The outline in front of CERM is a bit more comprehensive and should help you trim the fat.

There is one tip I read on a thread somewhere that makes a lot of sense that I plan on following next time. Make a copy of all the indexes from the books you will take with you to the exam (you can download the CERM index for free on PPI's website) and put them in a separate binder. That will help to save time as time is really the number one enemy. I haven't finished doing that yet but will very soon. I plan to continue making my own equation sheets for each topic instead of just water/wastewater. I'm making copies of all the charts/tables that we used in our prep course and CERM (specifically things that I have used during the course of my studies) and combining that with the appropriate equations. The idea here is to save time by eliminating having to use two to three references to solve a single problem. A guy I work with done that and swears that is the only way to do it. He's a huge fan of Six Minute Solutions and has said many times that he would not have passed had he not gone through that book. I asked him if he still had a copy of his equation sheets and he said that he wasn't sure where they were. I think he wants me to go through the exercise of finding the equations and knowing what they mean which helps to enhance my understanding of the topic rather than just giving me his equation sheet. These are some of the tips and hard lessons that I have learned. Hopefully you will find some good tips and advice from my experience as well as some of the others. I can't thank those of you enough that have posted what worked/didn't work. Don't give up and remember it's only a test. No one is going to chop your arms off if you don't pass.

 

[daxx1313]

There is already a really nice thread that deals with what books and you need which can be found here: http://engineerboards.com/index.php?showtopic=18130&hl=

There is a lot of truth to what 305Gurl is saying. Since May I have began going through my new references and studying Six Minute Solutions. Six Minute Solutions is really tough dax1313 because of the level of difficulty and I can tell you from experience those problems are way harder than anything you will see on the exam. Even with all the new references I have there are still plenty of problems that I cannot find the equations, variables, tables, etc. Just do the best you can, work through them, and ask for help on this forum if you need help. One thing that I did for the exam this past April was to create an equation sheet for the water/wastewater treatment section for the PM. My homemade equation sheet helped me to nearly ace those parts on the exam. You can easily create your own equation sheet from the equations used in Six Minute Solutions. They have been pretty decent about explaining what some of the variables are and what units they are expressed in. On the afternoon part of the exam I got raped on hydrology and water quality. There was way more "qualitative" type questions than I anticipated and since all I had was CERM and my School of PE notes I was pretty much a sitting duck. That was where I lost major points. On the exam that I took it seemed like almost half the exam was qualitative type questions. I would say that a third of them you can find easily by looking up the definition or looking at the glossary in CERM, another third of the problems might be something that I'm vaguely familiar with but can't find in CERM or my School of PE notebooks, and the last third were questions I had no idea how to answer.

This past March I started reading what others have done and what they recommended at the link I posted above. My confidence sank and I felt like I was going to be in trouble on the exam. If I could have withdrawn my application I would have and waited until October to take the exam. The School of PE provided a lot of problems and their notes are very helpful, but I feel like many others in that you need to do more than just study their problems and notes. Even in their review course their instructors encouraged and almost demanded that we study other materials. What would be nice is if they would give us a list and tell us what to study. If you are planning to go through the NCEES outline and study only those topics you need to be cautious about doing so. Compare that with what's in the front of your CERM and blend them together. That should be what you study. There were a few topics that I know well that were not on the NCEES outline but were on the exam. IMO, the NCEES outline is pretty useless. The outline in front of CERM is a bit more comprehensive and should help you trim the fat.

There is one tip I read on a thread somewhere that makes a lot of sense that I plan on following next time. Make a copy of all the indexes from the books you will take with you to the exam (you can download the CERM index for free on PPI's website) and put them in a separate binder. That will help to save time as time is really the number one enemy. I haven't finished doing that yet but will very soon. I plan to continue making my own equation sheets for each topic instead of just water/wastewater. I'm making copies of all the charts/tables that we used in our prep course and CERM (specifically things that I have used during the course of my studies) and combining that with the appropriate equations. The idea here is to save time by eliminating having to use two to three references to solve a single problem. A guy I work with done that and swears that is the only way to do it. He's a huge fan of Six Minute Solutions and has said many times that he would not have passed had he not gone through that book. I asked him if he still had a copy of his equation sheets and he said that he wasn't sure where they were. I think he wants me to go through the exercise of finding the equations and knowing what they mean which helps to enhance my understanding of the topic rather than just giving me his equation sheet. These are some of the tips and hard lessons that I have learned. Hopefully you will find some good tips and advice from my experience as well as some of the others. I can't thank those of you enough that have posted what worked/didn't work. Don't give up and remember it's only a test. No one is going to chop your arms off if you don't pass.

Thanks! Someone else recommended that I make indexes of my books as well, but I didn't think anything of it. I'll definitely do it and use it in my studies.

D