PE Structural Depth Failure - Advice?

[Phatso86]

I don't get why NCEES doesn't release more practice exams.

Or better yet, a year long review course. They would make so much money :huh:

 

[PowerStroke79_PE]

I don't get why NCEES doesn't release more practice exams.

Or better yet, a year long review course. They would make so much money :huh:

I think their practice exams are a blessing. Its the real thing, it is all parallel to what's in the exam. And while a course from them would probably be ideal, i think their is definitely a conflict of interest. IMO. 

 

[Lei]

1 hour ago, Lei said: six minute solution is a must!!!!! 从我的 iPhone 发送，使用 Tapatalk

Six minute solutions is a good resource for making sure you understand concepts.  However, the problems are way more in depth than what you will see on the exam. I'd recommend the NCEES practice exam for a more realistic view on what problems on the exam will look like.

To gain confidence for the real problem. I feel more prepared especially after throughly study of six minute solution.

从我的 iPhone 发送，使用 Tapatalk

 

[samopuddles]

Firstly, I copied this over from the Civil Engineering PE Exam: Structural forum, to see if anyone here has any advice. I wrote this last Thursday, and right now, I am thinking I will likely enroll in the EET breadth and depth courses, but would still love to hear anyone else's tips for passing this exam come April 2017.

Hi all,

So I'm sadly reporting that I did not pass the civil PE structural depth exam this time. It was my second time taking it, first being in April of this year. I'm at a bit of a loss as to what to do for my third time around (I refuse to give up!).

Here is my background for my first exam, followed by its diagnostic:

I self-studied using the CERM, the CERM's accompanying practice problems, and NCEES practice exams. I probably spent somewhere around 150 or 200 hours studying, starting at the end of January and going through the first week of April. To start, I studied mostly on weekends for 6-8 hours Saturday and Sunday. Once I was one month out, I started studying 2-3 hours after work three or four work nights as well, usually taking Friday night off before hitting the books again with the weekend schedule. I also had to peel off a few days on weekends to study for the CA state specific seismic and surveying exams. This was definitely detrimental to my time devoted to studying my depth. That can clearly be  seen in the diagnostic, I think.

April 2016 diagnostic:

 View attachment 9041

A little more background: walking out of the exam in the spring, I thought I had passed. When I got my results, I was pretty much at a loss as to how I had bombed the Design and Details of Structures: Component design and detailing section so atrociously. Though obviously, I was subpar in actually all of the afternoon (and many of the morning) sections. That particular section definitely stuck out to me the most. 

For October 2016, I decided I probably hadn't studied enough on my own, and definitely didn't focus enough on my depth topics. I decided to take the live online PPI Civil PE review course for a few different reasons. Firstly, I thought it might do me better to have more structure to my studying. Secondly, my coworker recommended it as he had taken this course (same instructor) and passed on his first try. Thirdly, I really liked the guarantee. As the course came to a close, I thought it had been good for the morning section, but rather lacking for the depth. I should have known that to begin with, as it is not advertised as being for the specific depths and instead devotes one or maybe two classes at most to each depth topic. Anyway, I completed all the homework and the PPI practice exam (and so fulfilled the requirements for the guarantee), did not divvy any time off of the state exams (I had passed seismic and decided to save studying for surveying until the week after the PE exam). I also worked additional PPI practice problems (120 solved problems, primarily in the structural depth) and NCEES practice exams again. I completed the NCEES practice exams in 4-hour chunks for morning and depth, to simulate the test itself. I thought I was pretty much as well-prepared for the PE exam as I could have reasonably been.

This is my diagnostics report this time:

View attachment 9044\

As can be seen, overall, I did significantly worse (in terms of absolute scores) in the morning and 33% better in the afternoon. I much improved my score in the depth topic I bombed in April (though I still came up short), but this time suffered a rather crushing defeat in Analysis of Structures: Loads and load applications (which I had previously done much better in). I am noticeably supbar in the morning sections also, which is a little perplexing to me because I felt I studied them about as much as I did the first time around. Though, I do remember thinking the Hydraulics & Hydrology and Geometrics questions being more complicated compared to what they were in April. I ended up with a score of 45 this time, compared to 46 in April.

I guess I'm just at a bit of a loss as to how to attack this exam for April 2017. I think I would like to do a review course again, but perhaps on demand this time. I think having structured instruction is very helpful for me, as I'm not as good of a self-teacher/reviewer. I am not tied to PPI because of the guarantee, as I don't know that it would prepare me significantly better by doing it again. I've read great things here about EET, but I don't know if I would then sign up for the breadth and depth both, just the breadth, or just the depth (though I think just the depth would be the least likely option). For materials, I feel I was pretty well covered... Having studied with the CERM, PPI practice problems, the PPI practice exam, PPI's Civil Engineering Solved Problems, and various other practice problems as well as the NCEES practice exams. But I have heard great things about the EET binders that are provided to course takers. To both exams, I brought with me the CERM, my PPI course notes, the PPI Structural Depth for the PE Exam Reference Manual, as well as various codes (basically all recommended codes besides OSHA, PCI, and AASHTO). 

Does anyone have any advice? When I compare my diagnostics, I basically just kind of see two different people taking the exam, and don't really know how to proceed.

Thanks so much for any help you can provide! I really, really appreciate it. I am determined to pass in April 2017!

My advice to you is to first figure out why you're doing so poorly on the questions. Buy the NCEES practice exam if you don't already have it, block out 9 hours on a Saturday, and really take the test. No peeking at answers, no cheating, turn off the phone, 1 hour for lunch, small desk, crate underneath. Really be true and take it in the four hours. Make sure you are showing your work as much as possible without taking too long. Then, go back and see why you are missing the problems. Are you making simple mistakes too frequently? Do you genuinely not understand the concepts? Did you get a 64/80 and you just freeze up when you're actually doing the real deal?

Studying for the test is not doing it for you, you need to be more pragmatic and attack the parts of the test that you can do well on. I put in a lot of time as well (200+ hours) and while I passed, I am pretty sure I barely passed. I don't do any design for work so it was basically starting from scratch/fresh out of college as far as the exam knew. I didn't pretend for even a moment that I was going to do well on the afternoon so I studied like mad on the morning stuff to make sure I walked out of the first 4 hours with at least 36 questions right. Maybe that strategy will work for you, maybe it won't.

Figure out why you are missing so many and come up with a plan. Most of us would have no problem helping you out to devise a plan if we have a little bit more diagnostic info on how you're doing than just the number right/wrong.

 

[leggo PE]

Thanks for the advice, everyone!

It may be overkill, but I have enrolled in EET's breadth and depth on-demand sections, and have gotten my hands on some new-to-me practice problems. 

I feel like in my previous times studying, I perhaps did not spend enough time really hammering out the problems myself, without looking at the answers. I also feel I need to put more confidence in myself, which I think I am lacking in. I know I can pass this exam, I know I have the support of my company, and I know that I am valued for what I contribute. I need to apply all of this knowledge to the fact that I will pass this exam. I know what to expect, so I will be doing problems and revisiting this thread in the future once I have more input on what I am finding I have trouble with in my studies.

 

[wow]

I took it back in Oct 2011 but my advice is simply not to overthink the problems.  Best example problems were the NCEES sample exam questions.  Never had the CERM, just the Goswami book.  Never been a big studier, just some logical reasoning and know where to find everything in the books.  Just keep a level head and I think you'll do fine.

 

[leggo PE]

Thanks, @wow! I do tend to be an overthinker sometimes. I'm taking the EET's course right now, which is helping me to realize that most problems are not trying to trick you, and that if you are able to understand the problem, you have a good chance of solving it.

 

[leggo PE]

Well, I have completed EET's breadth and depth classes! Though I'm not done with my studies.

These classes turned out to be much, much more of a commitment than my PPI class had been. Particularly the structural depth class, with what seemed like 12+ hours of recordings a week plus hundreds of practice problems. I took their simulated exam last weekend, and did well enough on the breadth section, but struggled a bit on the depth.

Whether it is good or not, the whole class did not do well on the depth exam, and I was about 1 question or so above the average. The instructors did mention to us after the fact that the exam we had been given was likely more complex overall than the PE exam will be, which is something I agree with based on some of the questions that were on this simulated exam. That being said, they were definitely excellent practice problems and have shown me what I need to focus on in my last days of studies before the exam next Friday.

The binders are excellent resources, and multiple times I have wished I had them at work with me (I have been keeping them at home due to their shear size). I plan to bring my CERM with me in addition to these binders, but hope to use these binders and the codes as my primary resources for the exam. The more familiar I make myself with these binders, the better.

This weekend, I'll be doing NCEES practice problems, and tabbing even more.

Next Friday's the day! I am feeling good. Plan to study until next Thursday, when all I want to do is go for a run, eat a good dinner, and get a good night's sleep!

 

[leggo PE]

I guess I never updated this, but I did indeed pass on my third try.

If anyone who failed is interested, there are some good bits of advice from people in this thread. Of course, feel free to post your own thread too.

 

[Spencer The G]

Take EET Structural Review and CONSOLIDATE YOUR RESOURCES.  I had my favorite sections of far too many books on my first attempt.  The EET binder was my go-to and then I double-checked my preferred references if time allowed.  

I went into the exam wishing that I had spent less time learning the concepts in such serious depth and more time on practice questions.  Having studied for this exam forever, I answered 30+ of the the morning questions without any references at all.  I'd imagine that you'll hit the same point on the next round!

@Mangano do you know where we can find practice PE civil with structural depth exams that will be similar to the NCEES exam? On the NCEES website there is only one civil PE with structural depth practice exam..

-thanks!