What is a fair price for a land development design?

[meaty_matt P.E.]

Basic subdivision design.

PLS provides all survey. Prop line, contours, monuments , resource areas, etc.

I do the layout, road design, drain design, details, etc more or less the entire plan set for submission for a Definitive Subdivision.

What would a fair price be for my engineering services for a 4-6 lot subdivision. Just for design and draft. Meeting and such would be additional.

Cheers!

 

[Sapper PE LS]

How many hours will it take you to do the work? If you can't immediately answer that question, then you probably shouldn't be doing the job, because you don't have enough experience to accurately estimate the length of time it will take to do the work.

Multiply hours to do the job times your rate. I think it is reasonable to bill out at about $150 per hour. That's your fee. Then you negotiate from there.

 

[John QPE]

Really depends, are you doing this on the side or is this for your company? Flat fee or Time and materials?

Any permitting?

 

[meaty_matt P.E.]

John , its on the side. I don't stamp it, just design and hand off. No overhead. I can do a typical small subdivision of say half dozen lots in 45-55 hrs. And have been charging flat rate of $2000-$3000 for the last 10 yrs. Not sure if I'm keeping up with the times with that rate (roughly $50/hr) or if it matters that I received a license last year (even though 80% of jobs I'm not stamping).

 

[John QPE]

Sounds about right for what you are doing. While it is well below standard billing rates for firms with overheads, it is on par with basement jobs.

I've been doing stormwater like this forever, $50.00 hour, minimum $2K for basin design per township and NPDES regs, storm drain sizing, stormwater management report, 1 revision.

 

[roadwreck]

Wow Sap is that how you estimate a job? Rate x hours. What a novel idea...

Pro Tip: Sarcasm towards the Admins is generally not appreciated.

 

[meaty_matt P.E.]

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[meaty_matt P.E.]

Sounds about right for what you are doing. While it is well below standard billing rates for firms with overheads, it is on par with basement jobs.

I've been doing stormwater like this forever, $50.00 hour, minimum $2K for basin design per township and NPDES regs, storm drain sizing, stormwater management report, 1 revision.

Thanks!

 

[John QPE]

You need to get a feel for who you work for as well. I do a lot of work for the same Architects and LA firms ...sometimes a stormwater design literally takes an hour, then write the report, make out really well. Sometimes its a little more involved, may take like 20 hours, so you make out a little less. It's all about finding the right minimum fee, that will get you a decent return that will cover the bigger jobs.

I would never go below the $2K mark, ever. When I price stuff in the firm that threshold is $6K. There is just a definite price, that I feel you can not go below. You need to protect your trade, and still make it worth your time.

 

[meaty_matt P.E.]

^ Great advice thanks.

 

[bradlelf]

average rate for your market/hr (say 150$+/-) for project work & 10% project management. Do not forget O&E insurance; even if you are not sealing there i still liability.

Or again you can do it per unit ... like 1,000/single family or 500/townhouse ... whatever your market value is.

Dont forget about permiting like NPDES, utilities, ACOE 404 permitting.

 

[miloc]

average rate for your market/hr (say 150$+/-) for project work & 10% project management. Do not forget O&E insurance; even if you are not sealing there i still liability.

Or again you can do it per unit ... like 1,000/single family or 500/townhouse ... whatever your market value is.

Dont forget about permiting like NPDES, utilities, ACOE 404 permitting.

Bradlelf, you have a very good point about the insurance. Do you know where can I get a O&E insurance and how much it might be?

Thanks.

 

[bradlelf]

Your O&E insurance should be roughly 3 times your risk (or so Ive been told); some developers require a minimum level like $1 million.

I have $100K+ policy as professional liability insurance as a rider on my home policy; something like $10 /year add on.

You can get O&E from most any insurance agency. You typically have two choices ... monthly/yearly or per project. You can roll the per project cost right into your proposal.

Try travelers or one of these:

http://www.hiscox.com/small-business-insurance/errors-and-omissions-insurance/e-and-o-coverage/

http://www.nationwide.com/business-errors-and-omissions-insurance.jsp

https://www.geico.com/getaquote/professional-liability-insurance/

I have what is called "dollar one" defense ... which means I dont pay anything in the event of the claim.So the O&E carrier pays the attorney fees and settlement.

The other option is like regular insurance where you pay the first 5 or 10K of the settlement and fees. Read the fine print ... dollar one defense is better since you are rolling it into the proposal cost. Get the best; dont loose your house.

 

[miloc]

Your O&E insurance should be roughly 3 times your risk (or so Ive been told); some developers require a minimum level like $1 million.

I have $100K+ policy as professional liability insurance as a rider on my home policy; something like $10 /year add on.

You can get O&E from most any insurance agency. You typically have two choices ... monthly/yearly or per project. You can roll the per project cost right into your proposal.

Try travelers or one of these:

http://www.hiscox.com/small-business-insurance/errors-and-omissions-insurance/e-and-o-coverage/

http://www.nationwide.com/business-errors-and-omissions-insurance.jsp

https://www.geico.com/getaquote/professional-liability-insurance/

I have what is called "dollar one" defense ... which means I dont pay anything in the event of the claim.So the O&E carrier pays the attorney fees and settlement.

The other option is like regular insurance where you pay the first 5 or 10K of the settlement and fees. Read the fine print ... dollar one defense is better since you are rolling it into the proposal cost. Get the best; dont loose your house.

Here's the cheapest quote. Maybe it is that high because I do business in NJ and NY? I think I will get the Professional Liability. $500 per year. Still much cheaper when compared with a car insurance.

Thank you for requesting a quote from Hiscox through our partners, GEICO. We specialize in insuring businesses like yours and customize coverage to the specific risks in your industry. Below is a summary of your quote.

Professional Liability : $504.50

• Claims against you for negligence, even if you haven’t made a mistake
• Awarded damages and defense costs, up to your policy limit
• Services delivered by all staff, including temporary employees
• Bodily injury and property damage resulting from your professional services is covered up to the policy limit
• Pollution liability claims covered up to $200,000
• Asbestos liability claims covered up to $200,000
• FHA/OSHA/ADA regulatory proceedings coverage up to $5,000
• Administrative hearing coverage up to $5,000

Limits/Deductibles selected:

• $1,000,000 per occurrence / $1,000,000 aggregate
• $500 deductible

General Liability : $353.15

• Damage to someone else’s property (including $100,000 per rented space)
• Injury to a third party, including related medical expenses
• Actions of your staff, including temporary employees
• Claims of personal injury including libel and slander
• Includes optional terrorism coverage

Limits/Deductibles selected:

• $1,000,000 per occurrence / $2,000,000 aggregate
• No deductible to pay on claims

Your total price: $857.65