Outsourcing article

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I have worked with low cost outsourcing in India and I am not worried. We send the redundant, simple problems there.
I found this reference interesting: http://www.nsf.gov/statistics/seind04/c3/c3h.htm
I'm not worried about it either. I think that this peaked about the time the high tech boom ended. I think that is what both of these articles are trying to say.

Actually, I'm just trying to rile people up because here are two articles about engineering, neither of which mentions the PE (or at least I didn't see it). And the first article, calls all sorts of people engineers. Of course I realize the article I posted was written by a bunch of grad students.

By the way, I think your experience in aerospace was a lot different than mine. I worked 12 years at Hughes Aircraft, and on projects with people from Lockheed and Rockwell, and knew a total of 1 PE. I knew a lot of PhDs though. But that was prior to 1994. Maybe things have changed a lot since then, or maybe it depends where you work, but I still don't see many defense or aerospace ads here in California asking for PE registration as a qualification.

 
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Good article. thanks Benbo. I had heard that many of the "engineers" in India and China do not actually have 4-year degrees, but it's nice to see some numbers.

 
I'm not worried about it either. I think that this peaked about the time the high tech boom ended. I think that is what both of these articles are trying to say.
Actually, I'm just trying to rile people up because here are two articles about engineering, neither of which mentions the PE (or at least I didn't see it). And the first article, calls all sorts of people engineers. Of course I realize the article I posted was written by a bunch of grad students.

By the way, I think your experience in aerospace was a lot different than mine. I worked 12 years at Hughes Aircraft, and on projects with people from Lockheed and Rockwell, and knew a total of 1 PE. I knew a lot of PhDs though. But that was prior to 1994. Maybe things have changed a lot since then, or maybe it depends where you work, but I still don't see many defense or aerospace ads here in California asking for PE registration as a qualification.
Definatly not required, but it gives you one more box to check on the old resume and if you look at the folks getting promoted to non-management leadership level engineering positions, I would say that the most of them have a PE or Phd. Have yet to run across both. Just my observations...

 
My father-in-law worked at disney, as a computer programmer, with Indians that had immigrated to the U.S. for the programming jobs. From what my FIL said, the outsourcing is causing resentment between the Indians that moved here and the younger ones that are taking away there jobs over there. Very Ironic...

 
I finally found the time to read this article. Very reassuring! I like the way the authors "split" the engineering disciplines:

Through our research, we have identified two main groups of engineering graduates:dynamic engineers and transactional engineers. Dynamic engineers are individuals

capable of abstract thinking and high-level problem solving using scientific knowledge.

These engineers thrive in teams, work well across international borders, have strong interpersonal skills, and are capable of translating technical engineering jargon into

common diction. Dynamic engineers lead innovation. The majority of dynamic

engineers have a minimum of a four-year engineering degree from nationally accredited

or highly regarded institutions.

Transactional engineers may possess engineering fundamentals, but not the

experience or expertise to apply this knowledge to larger problems. These individuals

are typically responsible for rote and repetitive tasks in the workforce. Transactional

engineers often receive associate, technician or diploma awards rather than a

bachelor’s degree. These subbaccalaureate degrees can be obtained in less than four

years, but more than one. Most highly accredited universities in China, India and the

United States stress the importance of a four-year education. For instance, master’s

programs within the United States typically will not admit students with three-year

bachelor’s degrees unless they have also completed a one-year post-graduate diploma

from an AIU- or an AICTE-approved institution. Subbaccalaureate degrees normally

are granted at lower-tier institutions that lack the research facilities, dedicated faculty

and budgets of accredited universities. Additionally, the quality of curricula varies

greatly at these institutions. Due to time and budgetary restrains, subbaccalaureate

programs are rarely capable of placing a strong emphasis on research, group work,

applied engineering, or interdisciplinary thinking.
This pretty much goes along with my observations. While there are possibly over 100 "engineers" presently working in my location, maybe only a dozen are registered PEs (ABET graduates), and the rest are foreign workers brought in to fill low-paying jobs. Having worked with or reviewed the work of nearly all of them at one time or another, a split was certainly apparent in my mind. The above classification system explains what I have observed very well.

 
bumped for relevance to "US engineerng degrees are easy" thread.

 
Transactional engineers... are they the same as technologists (people that do a two year certificate at a technical institute) or one step above a technologist?

 
Roughly speaking, yes. Read the article, though. I think that it also contends that all kinds of computer techs (such as network techs) are included in certain countries numbers when they report "engineering" graduates.

 
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Transactional engineers... are they the same as technologists (people that do a two year certificate at a technical institute) or one step above a technologist?
Mainly yes, but I work with some who can not perform their work with out engineering work instructions, standard work... what ever you want to call it and when a problem pops up that is not documented, they just hit a wall. I would call these folks transactional too.

As they say on Tiger and Pooh, "When you have a problem, THINK, THINK, THINK..." some just can't or don't want to.

 

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