Old and in the way

[z06dustin]

Interesting article about experience and engineering. Not exactly what I've seen in my career thus far, but interesting none the less.

Definition 1 and 3 imply, sort of, that professionals follow their career for a very long time. Most doctors treat patients till they retire. Airline pilots might aspire to captain a 747 (or A380), but fly till they're 60. Engineers don't.

http://www.embedded.com/columns/embeddedpulse/57702644

 

[wilheldp_PE]

There's an engineer that sits next to me that is at least 80, has sever knee problems, and has had cancer twice. He still comes to work every day that he isn't at the doctor because he loves what he does. He is the second such engineer that I have encountered in my career. I hope I am never in that boat because I would much rather lead than do.

 

[Flyer_PE]

What's wrong with having a job that you like well enough that you'll drag yourself in to the office when you're 80? I've met a few engineers like him and I've never been sure if I should envy their happiness at work or pity them for their lack of a hobby.

I've seen the boat I'm going to do my dead level best to avoid. Working a job you don't like past age 70 supporting deadbeat live-in kids.

 

[EM_PS]

What's wrong with having a job that you like well enough that you'll drag yourself in to the office when you're 80? I've met a few engineers like him and I've never been sure if I should envy their happiness at work or pity them for their lack of a hobby.

Kinda like Joe Paterno or Bobby Bowden?

 

[wilheldp_PE]

What's wrong with having a job that you like well enough that you'll drag yourself in to the office when you're 80? I've met a few engineers like him and I've never been sure if I should envy their happiness at work or pity them for their lack of a hobby.
I've seen the boat I'm going to do my dead level best to avoid. Working a job you don't like past age 70 supporting deadbeat live-in kids.

I wasn't saying that there is anything wrong with it. I was just saying that I don't enjoy my job enough to do it for that long, and it is my dream to retire and play golf for my twilight years.

 

[ALBin517]

I had a boss 15 years ago who kept coming to work well past age eighty. He'd married his secretary. After that, he could not stand being at home because his old secretary was bossing him around.

Recently, I have talked to some old government employees who are afraid to retire. They could afford to quit as things are now but are concerned that they will retire and then their pensions will get cut to a wage they can't live on. So they keep going to work instead, just to be safe.

 

[Sschell]

My experience is that the really old engineers, and the guys fresh out of school are basically useless... I am only speaking from my personal experience, and do not mean to offend any old timers on the board, there are always exceptions... but from what I have seen, you want engineers between 26 and 46.

Again, I am speaking from my experience in my field!

 

[maryannette]

I disagree.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

I'm with mary on this one. I also think it is more the individual than the age.

 

[Sschell]

I hope that that is the case.

It is hard to not form generalizations when you see the same thing over and over...

Hopefully the idiots I have had the displeasure of working with are the exception.

 

[Supe]

Where I see age becoming detrimental in my company, is when they fall behind on industry standards/development and have a reluctance to embrace new methods of approaching a problem.

 

[Sschell]

stuck in their ways... exactly.

 

[maryannette]

I hope that that is the case.
It is hard to not form generalizations when you see the same thing over and over...

Hopefully the idiots I have had the displeasure of working with are the exception.

Maybe you're just too young to have seen a good sampling.

 

[Sschell]

^or my company is too stingy to shell out the $ for a good "experienced" engineer...

 

[Flyer_PE]

I'm with mary on this one. I also think it is more the individual than the age.

I concur. One of our clients has an engineer in his early 30s that has already decided he knows the best way to do everything. Conversely we have a guy in our company in his 60s that stays current and is always finding new ways to do things.

 

[Dleg]

I'm committed to working until I'm at least 62, and up to 72 if they'll let me. I've seen my parents and too many of their retired friends just sort of fade into doing nothing. I'd rather be working than doing nothing.

I've known some older engineers who are stuck in their ways, in a bad way, and some who are vibrant and excellent overall engineers, which is what I aspire to be when I get up there. Like someone said above, it's all dependent on the individual. But also on the organization they work for.

 

[z06dustin]

I'd like to think I will still be productive, engineering or not, at that age. In between keeping the damn kids off my lawn of course.

 

[TouchDown]

I have 3 kids, 2 of them girls whom I will have to pay for weddings, college, my wife stays at home, our retirement account is a joke after the stock market shrunk. I know some of that will come back...

But, I'll be working til I'm dead. My dad was gone at 52, so, I've learned that (to me) life is more than working hard at my job. I try to do my best with what time I have at work and then focus on my family. They will be the one's left really missing me once I'm gone.

Which really stinks, because, I'd be retired as soon as it is possible so I could do the things I really, truely find fulfilling (painting, music, travelling, family).

It all depends on your perspective. My perspective is more often that I have a Job, not a career. (Don't let my boss know that!).

As for capabilities, the generalities on the effectiveness of an engineer based on age is I think a pretty poor measure of a person's ability. I have met a lot of USELESS engineers who are across the age spectrum. Most of the well respected, mentor types I have known are almost all in their 40's and 50's. I think it does take time to gain experience and a sometimes it takes a willing ear to listen to their feedback. Even the younguns can sometimes have something to appreciate. There are always the newbies that are "young, dumb, and full of $@%^.". There is something that makes me appreciate those who are full of energy and spirit. They have yet to be beat down by the systems and years of negative conditioning that most of us have tolerated. Sometimes, they are the one's who question the status quo when others just accept it.

We all have something to learn from others around us. I lose respect for the engineer who isn't willing to listen to other's concerns, input, or feedback. Some may not think I'm genuine when I listen and then don't follow their feedback/suggestions... But, I do make an effort to respectfully see things from other's point of view.

I enjoy working with and around people, more than I do solving problems most days. The "field" is the place for me, and I can't tell you how many times some old "uneducated" operator has saved my ass from making a huge mistake by showing me what they know and what they've been through.

 

[MGX]

My first real job was in communications. I was shocked that the old farts were entirely up to date technologically. As my experience has increased more and more older engineers who don't fear technology are surfacing on my radar.

My favorite boss I ever worked for and mentor was up to date and yelled at me for using certain technologies or methods but carefully explained why and how to do things better since he'd seen it all and done it all before.

Many recently graduated engineers have come through the door and are just as quickly escorted out. I saw a noob correct the president of the company during a presentation; basically calling him a liar right in front of clients.

I'm just an engineering tech (taking the FE in Oct./ junior in BSCE) and the time I spend explaining things to engineers who should understand the theory is disheartening.

 

[Capt Worley PE]

I'll be working until I'm 68 or so, thanks to social security and time working requirements. That's how old my parents are now.

Of course, the house will be paid off then...