14 Questions

[Dleg]

We've got a recent MIT grad making about $35k here.... It doesn't do you any good to go to a big-name school if your ambitions are to move back home and stay there, taking whatever job you can get.

 

[Supe]

We've got a recent MIT grad making about $35k here.... It doesn't do you any good to go to a big-name school if your ambitions are to move back home and stay there, taking whatever job you can get.

After a stint at MIT, that's about all you can afford.

 

[navyasw02]

We've got a recent MIT grad making about $35k here.... It doesn't do you any good to go to a big-name school if your ambitions are to move back home and stay there, taking whatever job you can get.

After a stint at MIT, that's about all you can afford.

The guy probably has a degree in English from MIT (Who does that?!?!?)

 

[Dleg]

I'm finding the poll results interesting, especially the large number of people responding that passing the PE (or FE) exam did not have any positive effect on their career.

Seriously? I did not get a raise when I passed the PE, but it really did change everything in terms of respect, doors opened, jobs offered, etc. My PE license has been the best thing I have ever done for my career, aside from performing the work itself.

 

[navyasw02]

I'm finding the poll results interesting, especially the large number of people responding that passing the PE (or FE) exam did not have any positive effect on their career.
Seriously? I did not get a raise when I passed the PE, but it really did change everything in terms of respect, doors opened, jobs offered, etc. My PE license has been the best thing I have ever done for my career, aside from performing the work itself.

I think there needs to be a subquestion on that asking if you work in an exempt field. Being military I dont need a PE and I dont get any career benefits for getting my PE. I did it for myself so I can feel that I can work in the engineering field and legitimately call myself an engineer. That's not to say that non PE's aren't engineers, but I feel that being a non licensed PE is similar (but not quite equal) to being a lawyer or doctor without a license.

 

[cableguy]

I can only think of one engineer in my company (of 400+ employees) that has a masters' degree. So it's not valued here at all IMO. And I think that's sad.

I've contemplated getting mine, something like Engineering Management. But there'd be no payback with my company, and I really don't want to relocate (Waco isn't exactly a hub for jobs for utility Power EE's). Most (decent, real, credible) programs cost around $800-$1000 per credit hour, and my company reimburses up to $2250 per year. Do the math...

I'd have responded completely different to this survey 6 months ago. Started a new job in August, it really put wind back in my sails. I was getting a bit bored, not learning a lot, not real enthusiastic... now I can't wait to get to work again and learn something new daily. It was good to change directions a bit in my career.

 

[Dexman PE]

Id imagine theres a fair bit of stagnation with several people out there. Theyve been "happy to be employed" for so long theyve lost a fair amount of the enjoyment they had in years past. Now that the economy is improving a little, people are becoming a little more adventureous and looking for new work. I would think that in a few years the numbers would look a little more promising.

 

[GDIklz]

So can a simple job swap within your profession refresh your interest and reduce stagnation?

 

[Dleg]

^Absolutely. I am in the process of changing jobs, and I can't hardly believe how excited I am to be starting on something else, even though I know I'm going from a job I could do with one hand tied behind my back, 2 hours a week, to one that I am going to have to be putting in 60 hour weeks just to get up to speed.

I'm finding the poll results interesting, especially the large number of people responding that passing the PE (or FE) exam did not have any positive effect on their career.
Seriously? I did not get a raise when I passed the PE, but it really did change everything in terms of respect, doors opened, jobs offered, etc. My PE license has been the best thing I have ever done for my career, aside from performing the work itself.

I think there needs to be a subquestion on that asking if you work in an exempt field. Being military I dont need a PE and I dont get any career benefits for getting my PE. I did it for myself so I can feel that I can work in the engineering field and legitimately call myself an engineer. That's not to say that non PE's aren't engineers, but I feel that being a non licensed PE is similar (but not quite equal) to being a lawyer or doctor without a license.

I wouldn't say that at all. You may not see it now, but I can tell you for sure that when anyone from the military tells me they were an "engineer" I automatically doubt them. I have run into several former military "engineers" who turned out to not even have degrees, but some sort of job title that made them engineers. You put PE after your name, all doubt is removed, and you get automatic respect (doubled, really, because of the military service).

 

[cableguy]

^Absolutely. I am in the process of changing jobs, and I can't hardly believe how excited I am to be starting on something else, even though I know I'm going from a job I could do with one hand tied behind my back, 2 hours a week, to one that I am going to have to be putting in 60 hour weeks just to get up to speed.

100%. I was good at my old job (SCADA engineer). So good I had plenty of time on my hands that frequently, I'd get kinda bored and have to find stuff to do. That was OK for a while. But it wasn't leading me anywhere career wise. My boss was about 5 years older than me, so no real chance for promotion in to his position. Plus I was separated from the main part of the company, tucked away in an outlying building.

Now I moved in to substation electrical design department. Mainstream engineering at our company. It's different from what I was doing, but not far removed (I had to look at substation design prints in the old job). Now I'm the one designing the prints. Doing the relay settings. Looking at fault records. Learning all kinds of new tricks. I'm mid-career (40), and it's been a very refreshing change. I'm up to my neck in work and really enjoying it. Still walking out the door at 5pm though.

 

[navyasw02]

I'm finding the poll results interesting, especially the large number of people responding that passing the PE (or FE) exam did not have any positive effect on their career.
Seriously? I did not get a raise when I passed the PE, but it really did change everything in terms of respect, doors opened, jobs offered, etc. My PE license has been the best thing I have ever done for my career, aside from performing the work itself.

I think there needs to be a subquestion on that asking if you work in an exempt field. Being military I dont need a PE and I dont get any career benefits for getting my PE. I did it for myself so I can feel that I can work in the engineering field and legitimately call myself an engineer. That's not to say that non PE's aren't engineers, but I feel that being a non licensed PE is similar (but not quite equal) to being a lawyer or doctor without a license.

I wouldn't say that at all. You may not see it now, but I can tell you for sure that when anyone from the military tells me they were an "engineer" I automatically doubt them. I have run into several former military "engineers" who turned out to not even have degrees, but some sort of job title that made them engineers. You put PE after your name, all doubt is removed, and you get automatic respect (doubled, really, because of the military service).

I know what you mean. Every ship has an engineer who could be an english major who just happens to have that job. It doesn't mean he turns wrenches and designs or repairs things, but he's in charge of the folks that maintain the propulsion system. I'm not saying that's an easy job because it's not and it's the most important one to get the ship underway, but you can have absolutely previous formal education on engineering principles and still be very competent in that job.

My case is a little different, I'm an Engineering Duty Officer (EDO) which is actual engineering from ship maintenance and repair to new construction. The Navy even sends me to grad school for a MS in engineering. My perspective of military engineer is different from what you're talking about because I've shifted mindsets a bit when I transitioned from submarines into EDO.

Edit: Navy shipboard engineering is surprisingly limited in what ship's company can do. To be honest, most mechanics are really plumbers. Ship's maintenance for steam plants is basically valve repacking, pump maintenance, and things like that. More and more things are subcontracted to outside maintenance techs or primary vendors such as any kind of reduction gear maintenance. It's not like the WWII movies where guys can go back and make a part and save the ship.

 

[Dleg]

^I'm not even sure what I'm talking about. In both cases I know of, the guys claiming to be engineers were enlisted guys in the Army, and were portraying themselves as "engineers" in the civilian world, years after getting out. One got himself and his program in a bit of trouble with the federal funding agencies that supported them, once they found out he was not, in fact, a degreed engineer. Had to leave the job, in fact. Last I heard, he is still calling himself an engineer, but for a private construction firm.

 

[navyasw02]

^I'm not even sure what I'm talking about. In both cases I know of, the guys claiming to be engineers were enlisted guys in the Army, and were portraying themselves as "engineers" in the civilian world, years after getting out. One got himself and his program in a bit of trouble with the federal funding agencies that supported them, once they found out he was not, in fact, a degreed engineer. Had to leave the job, in fact. Last I heard, he is still calling himself an engineer, but for a private construction firm.

I dont know much about Army engineering. I'm guessing since he didnt have a degree he was either the equivalent of a Mechanic or a Construction worker on civil engineering projects.

The Navy is a little better with that at least. I dont think you'd find anybody other than an officer calling themselves an engineer based on what I described before. If you do and they're not officers, they're immediately full of ****. On the nuclear side, officers get substantial training. First there's a 6 month nuclear power school which is classroom based watered down engineering that is shot through a firehose, then another 6 months of learning how to stand watch on a real reactor plant, then a few years on a boat qualifying and standing watch, then a four hour written exam and oral exams with the Navy's nuclear power office. At the end you've got a guy who is certified by the Navy and DOE.

 

[benbo]

I dont know much about Army engineering.

I know absolutely zero about anything military. But I do know in Full Metal Jacket the DI said that engineers went out and looked for mines. I think that was the Marine Corps, and something tells me the movie was probably not exactly 100% accurate.

 

[Dleg]

SapperPE should know the answer, and also what jobs these guys may have had in the Army, that apparently led them to believe they were engineers, in the same sense that we are engineers.

 

[Freon]

I lived this on the inside. Navy CEC officers, the Seabees are almost all degreed engineers. (David Robinson, the basket player, is a notable exception - He was a math major at USNA.) I was in a meeting with our "Corps-Level Engineer Officer", a English Major from a school with two cardinal directions in it's name. He had a grand plan to provide electricity to a town in Iraq and he summonded the Navy Captain who ran the Mobile Construction Regiment to get the plan started. (The Navy Captain was a PE in Civil Engineering.) The Chief of Staff for the Corps-level command asked me to sit in on the meeting, and my boss OKed it. After the "Engineer Officer" laid out his plan I told him it would not work and it was unsafe. He responded by telling me I did not know what I was talking about and he was the General's "expert" on engineeering matters. Then I handed my PE card to the Navy Captain, who handed it to the "Engineer officer" and stated "I ain't building that. Major Freon has the highest electrical engineering creditentials in this command. We'll get together and design something that will work." I am not on the "Engineer Officer's" Christmas card list. He also was sent home a month later after another run in with the good SeaBee Captain.

Navy ASW, are you at NPS?

 

[navyasw02]

I lived this on the inside. Navy CEC officers, the Seabees are almost all degreed engineers. (David Robinson, the basket player, is a notable exception - He was a math major at USNA.) I was in a meeting with our "Corps-Level Engineer Officer", a English Major from a school with two cardinal directions in it's name. He had a grand plan to provide electricity to a town in Iraq and he summonded the Navy Captain who ran the Mobile Construction Regiment to get the plan started. (The Navy Captain was a PE in Civil Engineering.) The Chief of Staff for the Corps-level command asked me to sit in on the meeting, and my boss OKed it. After the "Engineer Officer" laid out his plan I told him it would not work and it was unsafe. He responded by telling me I did not kinow what I was talking about and he was the General's "expert" on engineeering matters. Then I handed my PE card to the Navy Captain, who handed it to the "Engineer officer" and stated "I ain't building that. Major Freon has the highest electrical engineering creditentials in this command. We'll get together and design something that will work." I am not on the "Engineer Officer's" Christmas card list. He also was sent home a month later after another run in with the good SeaBee Captain.
Navy ASW, are you at NPS?

Yes, at NPS, for a few more weeks anyway.

 

[Freon]

I graduated in 97 from the EE program. Are you in the TSSE program? I am still the only Marine to complete it.

 

[navyasw02]

I graduated in 97 from the EE program. Are you in the TSSE program? I am still the only Marine to complete it.

Cool, we dont have many Marines go through the engineering dept. I'm doing TSSE and it is probably a lot different than when you did it. Its supposed to be a good mix of technical majors, but it is now mostly MEs with a few SE guys and no EEs at all in recent years.

 

[Freon]

If you see Bob Ashton, ask him about "The Beast of Bullard Hall".

I was on the '96 project, my interest was more on land equipment, but a smooth-talking Professor hooked me. It was a great experience.