Job search, 2 questions

Dexman PE · May 7, 2010

Got to thinking about this the other day while discussing with my wife the possibility of looking for another job:

1) Do you have to be unhappy with your current job to apply for another job?

2) At what point is it ok to talk with co-workers about them providing a job reference for you?

The reason I ask the first question is that right now I enjoy where I work, like the people I work with, the salary and benefits are ok (not fatty money, but my wife and I live comfortably). However, with the economy being the way it is I tend to keep a periodic eye on the area job postings just to see what's out there (specific civil engineering positions, typical pay ranges, etc). Well, over a month ago I came across a position which looked like it was written specifically for me. The work is entirely the part of engineering I enjoy (construction), the pay is better than I'm getting now, decent benefits, etc, so I applied (this is literally the first resume I have sent out since I started at my current job). I go in for my second interview on Monday.

The second question comes from the fact that I've only worked for 2 companies in my profession (plus a third for an internship). My first employer out of school was a heavy highway contractor and was there for just over 2 years, but have spent the last 5 years working for a consultant. This 5 years is the only design experience I have, and the position I applied for is looking for people with both construction as well as design/consulting experience. The only way I can have a reference for my design experience is to have a reference from my current employer. It's obviously too late to get my references together before I apply for anything. Do I wait until after the interview (normally when they start checking references)? Do I only provide references from some of my clients?

Thanks in advance for the advice.

pelaw · May 7, 2010

This is my 2 cents for what it's worth:

1) When doing anything, including change of job, there is only one question you have to ask yourself: Am I better off today than yesterday? or Will I be better off there than here?

To answer that question, there are two considerations: (1) pay, (2) professional development.

As to pay, it is relatively easy; do they pay more? If yes, you check the move box.

As to professional development, the question is whether the new job offers increasing responsibility--path to management. To that end, to advance in your career, the best way is to change jobs frequently--but not too frequently; like not every couple of months. This is beacuse corporations are usually set in their structure and there are too many candidates vying for few designated management spots within a corporation which are filled not too frequently. Yet, you want to advance at better pace. So as soon as you get enough experience, you should be looking for a higher paying position with more reposnsibility wherever it is open.

2)Never talk to anyone about your plans. Everyone is on need to know basis. When you need reference, that is when you ask for reference.

mizzoueng · May 7, 2010

1) Do you have to be unhappy with your current job to apply for another job?

No, the economy sucks major balls right now. As a consultant you need to keep you resume up to date and your options open. Sure there are good projects at your current job, but you should also see what is coming down the road. I had some friends that did not look more than 1 week ahead at a time and assumed works was "coming". When they got laid off due to lack of work they had to start from scratch. Any time you see a chance for advancement, more money (don't just base it on this), or something more along the lines of what you want to do, then seriously consider applying and looking around. You owe your current employer nothing, they will ****-can you as fast as they can when your usefullness either comes to an end or they can get a contractor or younger engineer to do the same thing.

2) At what point is it ok to talk with co-workers about them providing a job reference for you?

Right before you need the reference. If the company you are looking at needs references, tell them you will get them in a day and then notify your co-workers. Some you may trust well enough to warn far ahead of time, but sometimes people "change" when they think they will have a chance for advancement if they can get an edge on you with the boss.

For some reason my current employer was shocked that I was broadcasting my resume on the two major career sites. THere is no chance for advancement in my current position as the managers are in their early 40's and most managers do not advance until in their late 50's to high enough positions that they need wide sweeping promotions. Even then they tend to hire from the outside for these manager openings. Happens all the time. I still think the only sure fire way to get a higher paying job at whatever company you are at now is to leave and then come back 5-10 years later and demand it.

wilheldp_PE · May 9, 2010

I'm in a similar position. I wasn't really actively looking for work, but I almost never stop checking careerbuilder or craigslist for interesting opportunities. I submitted one resume because job sounded interesting about a month ago, and I just had my 2nd interview with them on Thursday.

If they ask for references, I will probably just provide them with my best references from the 2 jobs I had previous to my current employer, and explain to the place I'm interviewing with that I don't wish to alert my current employer to my job search at this time. If they have a real problem with it, I may change my opinion and gamble on getting the new job, but not until I have tried discussing it with the new place.

ElCid03 · May 9, 2010

wilheldp_PE said:
I'm in a similar position. I wasn't really actively looking for work, but I almost never stop checking careerbuilder or craigslist for interesting opportunities. I submitted one resume because job sounded interesting about a month ago, and I just had my 2nd interview with them on Thursday.
If they ask for references, I will probably just provide them with my best references from the 2 jobs I had previous to my current employer, and explain to the place I'm interviewing with that I don't wish to alert my current employer to my job search at this time. If they have a real problem with it, I may change my opinion and gamble on getting the new job, but not until I have tried discussing it with the new place.

I could not agree more. There is nothing wrong with keeping your ear to the ground.

Bean PE · Jun 3, 2010

Any time a move will make you better off (in that murky combination of the tangibles [money, vacation, career advancement] and intangibles [commute distance, job satisfaction, etc.]), go for it.

Discuss it only with people you trust absolutely to not rat you out. If that means no one at your current employer, then they don't get a reference from there - but having been there five years, I'm sure there's someone, either inside or outside the company who can vouch for you, and that you'd trust.