# Ebola Information Released for Water and Wastewater Utilities



## matt267 PE (Oct 14, 2014)

For those in the water/wastewater industries:

http://www.tpomag.com/online_exclusives/2014/10/ebola_information_released_for_water_and_wastewater_utilities



> Because of Ebola’s fragility when separated from its host, bodily fluids flushed by an infected person would not contaminate the water supply.* Researchers believe Ebola survives in water for only a matter of minutes*. This is because water does not provide the same environment as our bodily fluids, which have higher salt concentrations. Once in water, the host cell will take in water in an attempt to equalize the osmotic pressure, causing the cells to swell and burst, thus killing the virus.


Hopefully they're right.


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## buffalo (Oct 14, 2014)

Yes, probably very unlikely. But there is evidence that viral diseases such as polio and hepatitis are transmitted through (sewage) polluted water.


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## roadwreck (Oct 14, 2014)

The rational side of me says "that makes sense" but the tin foil hat wearing part of me says "of course they are going to tell us that, just think of the panic it would cause if they said anything different".

hmy:


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## matt267 PE (Oct 14, 2014)

If they're wrong/lying, I'm going to want more than a tin foil hat to do field work.


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## engineergurl (Oct 14, 2014)

It can be transmitted in a mans seamen after he recovers from it for like 2 months?


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## roadwreck (Oct 14, 2014)

engineergurl said:


> It can be transmitted in a mans seamen after he recovers from it for like 2 months?


I heard 3 months.


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## matt267 PE (Oct 14, 2014)

roadwreck said:


> engineergurl said:
> 
> 
> > It can be transmitted in a mans seamen after he recovers from it for like 2 months?
> ...


luckily my day job won't put me at risk there...


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## roadwreck (Oct 14, 2014)

matt267 said:


> roadwreck said:
> 
> 
> > engineergurl said:
> ...


And since I'm married there is no real danger of transmitting it at home either.


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## matt267 PE (Oct 14, 2014)

^ ouch.....


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## Road Guy (Oct 14, 2014)

I hope we can all travel to Dallas to piss on the grave of the SOB who brought this shit here one day..


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## matt267 PE (Oct 14, 2014)

was he buried or incinerated cremated?


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## snickerd3 (Oct 14, 2014)

i heard he was to be cremated


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## NJmike PE (Oct 14, 2014)

roadwreck said:


> matt267 said:
> 
> 
> > roadwreck said:
> ...


he's right though


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## matt267 PE (Oct 15, 2014)

http://www.npr.org/blogs/goatsandsoda/2014/09/12/346114454/how-do-you-catch-ebola-by-air-sweat-or-water



> *Can Ebola be spread through a drop of water or carried through the water system?*
> 
> "[The virus] will not remain for a long time in the water," Gonzalez says. "It's not a very rich medium to protect the virus."
> 
> ...


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## Dleg (Oct 16, 2014)

I need more assurances than these. I have done my own research (dangerous, I know) and just because a virus is enveloped, does not mean that it won't survive very long in water or the environment. There are other enveloped viruses (herpes being one) that have been shown to persist for days in water and sewage, according to a WHO document (look it up). Every virus is different in its ability to persist - there does not seem to be any general rule, other than yes, a non-enveloped virus does tend to persist longer than an enveloped virus, but that doesn't mean raw sewage is safe right outside the bowl. Unless these talking heads have actual survival data for Ebola Guinea (which I heard today it is now being called), then I think it's irresponsible to make such blanket statements based on nothing but conjecture centered on the general type of virus. Maybe there's more to it than that, but if so, they need to be more clear about it.

Further, I have heard through professional channels that current guidance is to disinfect within the toilet bowl with a strong bleach solution (0.5%) and hold it for a certain contact time (not sure on the time-temperature relation) prior to flushing. If you work in this industry, keep your eyes out for changing/new guidance. If there's anything to be learned from this outbreak so far, is that it is better to be safe than sorry.


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## matt267 PE (Oct 17, 2014)

I don't raw sewage right from the bowl will ever be considered safe.


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## matt267 PE (Oct 17, 2014)

Here are some additional articles concerning wastewater. They all seem to be saying the same thing and are all likely using the same sources. :dunno:

http://www.onsiteinstaller.com/blog/2014/10/has_the_ebola_scare_spread_to_the_septic_sector



> Researchers believe that Ebola survives in water for only a matter of minutes. This is because water does not provide the same environment as our bodily fluids, which have higher salt concentrations.


They are not saying which "researchers" nor are they quoting any specific studies.

http://www.wrwa.org/ebola-in-drinking-water-and-wastewater-treatment/



> Like the AIDS virus and SARS virus, Ebola is a very fragile organism and can only survive in a human body. All of the infections that have occurred in the US have been from contacting bodily fluids directly. The Ebola virus will only survive outside of the human body for a few minutes, which means that if the virus was to enter the waste stream it will die almost immediately. By using normal safety precautions around the wastewater plant, operators should not be exposed to any viable Ebola virus. As always care must be taken to avoid other infections, so continued use of gloves, safety glasses and lots of hand washing is recommended.


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## Dleg (Oct 17, 2014)

TPO Magazine (the source of the article quoted at the head of this thread) is now stepping away from their initial report, but not retracting it. AWWA is reporting that they have questions, too, and that EPA and CDC are looking into it and will be issuing a joint statement soon.

From the TPO editor's blog:



> We know you’re concerned, but it’s time to put Ebola into perspective.
> 
> Ebola is a horrible disease. Its arrival on this country’s shores is frightening and is a reason for deep concern for our health care system. Its spread must be prevented.
> 
> ...


My thoughts: wait until EPA and CDC issue their joint guidance before speculating too much. I agree that the original response by both WERF and CDC was short on "fact" and long on assumptions. I also agree that there is an excellent history of wastewater workers being protected by current PPE and countermeasures. But I don't agree that someone can cite the lack of sewer-transmitted AIDS or cholera outbreaks as their justification in this matter, without doing some research that is specific to the Ebola virus. AIDS patients don't bleed out into the toilet. Cholera is only in sewage if there are people that are sick with it, and we generally don't have cholera in the US population these days. Specific research into Ebola virus survival and transmission in sewage is (hopefully) being done now, and then we will know more.


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## matt267 PE (Oct 18, 2014)

Thanks for the update Dleg.


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## Dleg (Oct 18, 2014)

Another (and perhaps more professional) update from WaterReuse Association:

http://www.watereuse.org/node/3461



> CDC Preparing Ebola Guidance for Wastewater Sector Workers
> 
> 
> To address the concerns and questions from the water sector, many water and public health organizations, including the WateReuse Association and Research Foundation, have been seeking reliable and credible information on Ebola. While *currently* there is limited data on the fate and transport of Ebola in wastewater collection systems, developing protective precautions is prudent. To that end, these organizations have been in contact and conversation with appropriate federal agencies on the issue of wastewater worker safety and the inactivation of Ebola by wastewater treatment processes.
> ...


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## NJmike PE (Oct 18, 2014)

While it's promising that the topic is being discussed, it is still vague. I hope they can quickly learn the fate of Ebola and wastewater.


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## Dleg (Nov 7, 2014)

WEF held a webinar on Ebola and wastewater worker safety on November 4, featuring several experts including folks from the CDC who worked on the upcoming guidance (still not available).

A recording of the webconference can be accessed here, along with a copy of the slides:

http://www.wef.org/EbolaWastewaterConcerns/

Short summary: several national meetings of experts have occurred, in which many of the same concerns above were brought up. The previous information that Ebola will only survive a few minutes in water is not thought to be supported well enough to be relied upon. There is basically very little data on the survival of Ebola in the environment, and so the thought is that it is better to take precautions. The microbiologists do not think it is very likely that Ebola presents much of a hazard in the wastewater environment, but the panel notes that in all of the U.S. cases so far, the hospitals have required disinfection in the toilet prior to flushing, or in one case, camping toilets were used instead to keep the wastewater out of the sewer and into the solid waste stream, destined for incineration.

It's a good overall webcast in that it deals with the overall topics of disease transmission in wastewater and proper worker PPE., but it's a little long (1:40 almost) and full of a lot of unknowns. The CDC says the wastewater guidance is finished and approved, but is held up because it links to another guidance document that is still under review.


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## wilheldp_PE (Nov 7, 2014)

How delightfully last week. Who the hell cares about Ebola any more?

I'm only partially kidding. The media seem to have gotten completely distracted by the election, so they now need a new crisis du jour to whip up a furor over. Maybe they'll get lucky, and the Ferguson, MO cop will get acquitted soon.


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## matt267 PE (Nov 8, 2014)

Yeah, the media don't seem to care anymore. But, there is an entire industry of wastewater operators who do care. Dleg, thanks for the update on this.


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## Dleg (Nov 9, 2014)

I know this issue has been good for me and the utility industry here, because we have been really complacent on PPE and there are plenty of other dangerous pathogens in sewage. I know one person in my organization who swears half the sewer staff have hepatitis. This whole Ebola scare and the new PPE rules (which are anticipated to be the same as ordinary sewer PPE) is a fantastic oportunity to get everyone's attention, not only to wear the stuff but to also allow the utility staff to purchase it.


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## Road Guy (Nov 10, 2014)

It should amaze me that Sewer workers would either not have or not wear protective clothing, including masks while going anywhere near the inside of a treatment plant??

I don't know what the rule is but I can only imagine there are tons of things floating around and in the air that can do horribly bad things to your body..


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## Dleg (Nov 11, 2014)

I can't speak too much for mainland practices, but I don't think you will see much PPE on treatment plant workers, especially.

I know from experience, that after a face-full of aerator mist I will almost always get sick a few days later. Usually a sore throat. I try to avoid that, now. The last one was a sewer cleaning job, I risked looking into the manhole to see if the return flow was clear yet. Got a faceful of diluted raw sewage mist, and came down with a mild cold a few days later. (I won't do that again)


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## matt267 PE (Nov 11, 2014)

Think of it as an inoculation.


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## Dleg (Dec 1, 2014)

CDC finally released its guidance a few days ago. As expected, it is basically just standard sewer worker PPE. In fact, it appears identical to non-Ebola sewer worker PPE (by my memory - I could be wrong).

http://www.cdc.gov/vhf/Ebola/Prevention/Handling-Sewage.html

Here it is, in case anyone is still interested:



> Interim Guidance for Managers and Workers Handling Untreated Sewage from Individuals with Ebola in the United States
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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