# My Exam Experience (Thermo Fluids)



## Clydeman (Apr 11, 2011)

So I finished Friday feeling pretty frustrated overall (thermo fluids). I wish I would have walked away with a high level of confidence, but I did not.

I think I nailed the AM portion, but the PM portion was a different story. Unfortunately I was not able to think that clearly on the PM portion. In the end I guessed on 5 problems (which I never did on a practice exam). I feel the PM portion was much harder than sample exams. Maybe it is just being in a test situation that makes it seem more difficult. I think I probably got 35/40 in the morning. But in the afternoon it is really hard to say (20-30? maybe huge range I know).

I thought I was so prepared for this test. I put in over 400 hours of studying (I kept a calendar of my hours). I do not think any more studying would have helped me. Also I am not sure TF was the right choice. I think MD would have been a better choice. It looks to me like TF is the hardest of the three.

I honestly am not sure whether or not I passed.

Does anyone have any advice for how to deal with the wait? The weekend was painful. Studying has been so much a part of my life. It is hard to transition from studying so intensely to nothing. I think it is best to just not think about it (but I was not able to do that over the weekend). Maybe it just takes time?


----------



## snickerd3 (Apr 11, 2011)

post test blues is totally normal. What did you do before you studied? the wait gets easier then harder again right arounf 7.5 weeks.

stick around eb.com there are plenty of others in your shoes.


----------



## Relvinim (Apr 11, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> So I finished Friday feeling pretty frustrated overall (thermo fluids). I wish I would have walked away with a high level of confidence, but I did not.
> I think I nailed the AM portion, but the PM portion was a different story. Unfortunately I was not able to think that clearly on the PM portion. In the end I guessed on 5 problems (which I never did on a practice exam). I feel the PM portion was much harder than sample exams. Maybe it is just being in a test situation that makes it seem more difficult. I think I probably got 35/40 in the morning. But in the afternoon it is really hard to say (20-30? maybe huge range I know).
> 
> I thought I was so prepared for this test. I put in over 400 hours of studying (I kept a calendar of my hours). I do not think any more studying would have helped me. Also I am not sure TF was the right choice. I think MD would have been a better choice. It looks to me like TF is the hardest of the three.
> ...


You will probably obsess about the test for the next 4 weeks and then it will get easier. You will think back and convince yourself you did every problem wrong. At least I did. The hard part is two weeks before you expect the results to come out. THis board will be a madhouse and the anticipation will kill you. If you think you did that well in the morning and you prepared as much as you say you did...then my guess is you will be alright.

And enjoy the break from studying. My biggest fear of not passing was having to go through all that again!


----------



## Clydeman (Apr 11, 2011)

What is frustrating about much of my time studying was that I would guess at least 1/3 of my studying was unused. I think this test comes down partially to luck as regards to what is on the test.

Does the difficulty on the depth portion vary greatly from test to test?

As far as cracking the books again, I was contemplating it. Then I realized that the Oregon deadline for October is June 1 (it is July 31 in WA). I called OSBEELS and asked if that date was intentional (so that you have to wait a full year to retake), they said yes it is intentional. They said you can take it from another state. So unless the results come out really early (not likely) I will have to wait a full year if I did not pass. I applied as industry except and have no desire to go through the application process in another state.

Also to add to the fun, we in Oregon get to send in a 42 problem take home exam on ethics (which must be returned in 10 days)!


----------



## cydcarter (Apr 11, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> What is frustrating about much of my time studying was that I would guess at least 1/3 of my studying was unused. I think this test comes down partially to luck as regards to what is on the test.
> Does the difficulty on the depth portion vary greatly from test to test?
> 
> As far as cracking the books again, I was contemplating it. Then I realized that the Oregon deadline for October is June 1 (it is July 31 in WA). I called OSBEELS and asked if that date was intentional (so that you have to wait a full year to retake), they said yes it is intentional. They said you can take it from another state. So unless the results come out really early (not likely) I will have to wait a full year if I did not pass. I applied as industry except and have no desire to go through the application process in another state.
> ...


I can't speak for Oregon, but some states automatically offer you enrollment to the next exam if you failed, even if you don't find out until after the enrollment period ends. Some states accept that you are at their (or whatever validation companys) mercy to find out the results. Hopefully, that won't matter for you :dunno:

I don't know the specifics state-by-state.


----------



## Murdox (Apr 11, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> Also I am not sure TF was the right choice. I think MD would have been a better choice. It looks to me like TF is the hardest of the three.


Nathan - This is a pretty presumptuous statement... I think that each section is equally difficult, it just depends on what your supposed "expertise" is....

I took the Mechanical PE with the MD afternoon session and had the same experience. I thought I did very well on the morning section, but after the lunch break (which took an additional 45 mins due to the Proctors shuffling papers), I was really feeling fatigued. Then, upon getting into the afternoon session, I found the problems much more difficult than the morning. Talk about a gut-shot to my confidence... By the time I left the exam, I felt completely drained..

Like you, I'm really wondering if I did well enough to pass... Reading some of the other posts on the EB, I saw some people than had as much as 56/80 (70%) reported - FAIL. Oh man... really feeling my confidence shaken. But I suppose, no matter how I re-run the experience in my head, I can't change anything at this point. While I know myself to be a bit obsessive and won't let up, I keep telling myself to just cotinue to hold my breath without speculation.


----------



## Clydeman (Apr 11, 2011)

Murdox said:


> Nathan Satter said:
> 
> 
> > Also I am not sure TF was the right choice. I think MD would have been a better choice. It looks to me like TF is the hardest of the three.
> ...


I was not meaning to be presumptuous. I unfortunately do not have an expertise and can go either MD or TF. I might consider going MD route if I have to retake.

I too was suprised at how long everything took. We did not start the second session until 1:45. Our report time was 7:15. Talk about a long day!


----------



## Clydeman (Apr 11, 2011)

cydcarter said:


> Nathan Satter said:
> 
> 
> > What is frustrating about much of my time studying was that I would guess at least 1/3 of my studying was unused. I think this test comes down partially to luck as regards to what is on the test.
> ...


As I mentioned I called them this morning and asked why their deadline is June 1 and while Washington's is July 31. They confirmed that their intention is that in Oregon you have to wait one year or go apply to take it in another state. I think they changed the date to the much earlier June 1 deadline a few years back (so it is intentional).


----------



## cydcarter (Apr 12, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> As I mentioned I called them this morning and asked why their deadline is June 1 and while Washington's is July 31. They confirmed that their intention is that in Oregon you have to wait one year or go apply to take it in another state. I think they changed the date to the much earlier June 1 deadline a few years back (so it is intentional).


If true, and I have no reason to doubt you or your conversations, I find it strange. I don't know all of the details of the true cost of staging the exam, but I would have imagined the state would be better off allowing multiple re-takes in consecutive offerings. The test is equally as hard (atleast by the method of grading with NCEES) so it's not like a non-deserving person is going to pass until they possess the right knowledge. But with the fees they charge, I would have imagined the states saying "Come on and take it as much as you would want, 4-limit max and ASAP." It also likely creates more licensed professionals in their state since some people may end up taking it outside of their state and then choosing to not get reciprocity or whatever.

I am guessing their logic is they don't want people to take the exam and waste their time if they aren't atleast trying to pass it, but I don't know of anyone to ever sit just because they could. The EIT is a different story altogether on that, but not the PE...

Any thoughts?


----------



## RobertR (Apr 12, 2011)

The first time I took the test (T&amp;F), I knew I hadn't passed (I didn't spend enough time studying). But for October 2010, I was so well prepared that I felt confident. That confidence was boosted when I finished the AM portion 45 minutes early. I only needed to guess on 2 or 3 problems in the afternoon. The test did not seem particularly hard to me. I remember being told that the difficulty of the test seems to go in "cycles" for the three depth modules. I was told that the HVAC guys thought October 2010 was brutal, but T&amp;F guys felt good about it, which matches my experience. As for the difficulty of MD compared to T&amp;F, only you can answer that question. T&amp;F problems are easier for me. Which comes "naturally" to you?


----------



## Clydeman (Apr 12, 2011)

RobertR said:


> The first time I took the test (T&amp;F), I knew I hadn't passed (I didn't spend enough time studying). But for October 2010, I was so well prepared that I felt confident. That confidence was boosted when I finished the AM portion 45 minutes early. I only needed to guess on 2 or 3 problems in the afternoon. The test did not seem particularly hard to me. I remember being told that the difficulty of the test seems to go in "cycles" for the three depth modules. I was told that the HVAC guys thought October 2010 was brutal, but T&amp;F guys felt good about it, which matches my experience. As for the difficulty of MD compared to T&amp;F, only you can answer that question. T&amp;F problems are easier for me. Which comes "naturally" to you?


So the difficulty does come in waves? That is interesting. I have not heard from other guys that took TF this time around. Does that mean the cutoff scores changed dramatically (or do they remain the same)?

I thought I was well prepared as well. I think what I did not anticipate was how burned out I felt at the start of the pm portion (does not help that the pm portion did not start until 1:45!). I found that if it was not a problem that I had seen before and knew exactly how to go about solving I was not thinking clearly enough to solve.

I wish I finished the test with the level of confidence I felt after the am portion. I can only hope that my score in the am portion carries my pm portion.

My advice after taking this exam is to start off with problems you know and feel good about (mainly for the pm portion). I think I lost about 30 minutes at the beginning of the pm portion where I was in somewhat of a panicked state (raised heart rate and a ton of anxiety).


----------



## RobertR (Apr 12, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> RobertR said:
> 
> 
> > The first time I took the test (T&amp;F), I knew I hadn't passed (I didn't spend enough time studying). But for October 2010, I was so well prepared that I felt confident. That confidence was boosted when I finished the AM portion 45 minutes early. I only needed to guess on 2 or 3 problems in the afternoon. The test did not seem particularly hard to me. I remember being told that the difficulty of the test seems to go in "cycles" for the three depth modules. I was told that the HVAC guys thought October 2010 was brutal, but T&amp;F guys felt good about it, which matches my experience. As for the difficulty of MD compared to T&amp;F, only you can answer that question. T&amp;F problems are easier for me. Which comes "naturally" to you?
> ...


Doing the easy problems first is a commonly recommended technique. Another piece of advice is to NOT get stuck on a problem you just don't know how to do. It isn't worth it. Of course, if there are many such problems, you haven't studied enough.


----------



## Kephart P.E. (Apr 13, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> So I finished Friday feeling pretty frustrated overall (thermo fluids). I wish I would have walked away with a high level of confidence, but I did not.
> I think I nailed the AM portion, but the PM portion was a different story. Unfortunately I was not able to think that clearly on the PM portion. In the end I guessed on 5 problems (which I never did on a practice exam). I feel the PM portion was much harder than sample exams. Maybe it is just being in a test situation that makes it seem more difficult. I think I probably got 35/40 in the morning. But in the afternoon it is really hard to say (20-30? maybe huge range I know).
> 
> I thought I was so prepared for this test. I put in over 400 hours of studying (I kept a calendar of my hours). I do not think any more studying would have helped me. Also I am not sure TF was the right choice. I think MD would have been a better choice. It looks to me like TF is the hardest of the three.
> ...


I took the T/F a few years back and felt exactly the same way, nailed the morning the PM was difficult and I didn't have any time to spare. I passed the first time, but I also beat myself up pretty good in the wait for results. I think part of the issue is you only really remember the questions you struggled with.


----------



## Kephart P.E. (Apr 13, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> What is frustrating about much of my time studying was that I would guess at least 1/3 of my studying was unused. I think this test comes down partially to luck as regards to what is on the test.
> Does the difficulty on the depth portion vary greatly from test to test?
> 
> As far as cracking the books again, I was contemplating it. Then I realized that the Oregon deadline for October is June 1 (it is July 31 in WA). I called OSBEELS and asked if that date was intentional (so that you have to wait a full year to retake), they said yes it is intentional. They said you can take it from another state. So unless the results come out really early (not likely) I will have to wait a full year if I did not pass. I applied as industry except and have no desire to go through the application process in another state.
> ...



I am an Oregon resident but took the test in Washington intentionally after I got frustrated by OSBEELS during application. Washington is WAY easier to deal with, they only charge you $65 initially for the application, they post results by email and are one of the first reporting states.

All in all not going thru Oregon was a great decision. Also from reading the application, the industry exemption seemed easier to apply for in Washington than Oregon.

After passing I got an NCEES Record and applyed to Oregon on comity.


----------



## Clydeman (Apr 13, 2011)

Kephart P.E. said:


> Nathan Satter said:
> 
> 
> > What is frustrating about much of my time studying was that I would guess at least 1/3 of my studying was unused. I think this test comes down partially to luck as regards to what is on the test.
> ...


If I failed I will likely be going through Washington. I had no idea there was such a disparity regarding application fees. Oregon's was $350 and Washington's is $95 (I think).

I called them again yesterday just to be certain regarding the reasoning behind their early application deadline. The reason given was that in the past people would reapply not knowing whether or not they passed, then if they passed they had to refund their money. Apparently it is too much work to refund money? Heck I would give up the $95 reapplication fee gladly if it turned out I passed.

I counted around 140 people at Friday's test. Honestly how many people would reapply out of that many? How much work is that really?

Oh well it's not worth fighting. Sometimes I swear our state is the most backward of them all (ie our wonderful Oregon health plan)!


----------

