# Mechanical PE



## Shanks

I thought the board will be flooded with posts when it comes back online...looks like y'all are busy celebrating already or may be mourning like me.....the morning was breeze for me and I believe I did well on it but my depth (MD) was somewhat brutal for me...for sure tougher than NCEES sample exam. I find my last attempt to be easier (and yet I failed), so not much hopeful for this time....too early to say if I am ready for my third attempt yet...


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## heath014

Everyone I spoke with told me the sample exams were right on. I used the 2001 nad 2008 sample exams as a guide and I thought the PE was much, much harder!

I am 100% sure I did not pass. I'm going to take a break for a few weeks and then back to the books!


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## gaidox

Yup. I think the morning portion was on par with the ncees sample exam. But the thermal fluids depth in the afternoon (in my opinion) was way difficult and time consuming (compare to ncees sample). I did expect it to be difficult but still shocked on doing it on actual. Did'nt have time to finish in the afternoon and guessed about 6. Hour before afternoon deadline, ive already have headache and dragging myself to continue solving..I feel 50/50 on it (passing/failing).


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## cjnj

gaidox said:


> Yup. I think the morning portion was on par with the ncees sample exam. But the thermal fluids depth in the afternoon (in my opinion) was way difficult and time consuming (compare to ncees sample). I did expect it to be difficult but still shocked on doing it on actual. Did'nt have time to finish in the afternoon and guessed about 6. Hour before afternoon deadline, ive already have headache and dragging myself to continue solving..I feel 50/50 on it (passing/failing).



Yes I am in the same boat. took (Thermal and Fluid) could not finish in time. let's wait and watch.


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## matkenmd

Morning was a breeze. I'm not sure about the afternoon. It was harder then the AM for sure, but I may have pulled it off. Not sure. The vibration stuff gave me trouble since I didn't study it as much as I should have. I found the NCEES prep material pretty accurate and useful. I don't want to wait for results for the next 2 months.


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## kkelley

I thought the actual exam was definitely similar in difficulty to the practice exams...but it did seem a bit more difficult - I don't remember any "freebie" answers...I had to look up something on each question. I flew through the practice exam morning session and I had just enough time to finish the actual morning exam. In the afternoon I took the HVAC - it wasn't terrible, but it was no walk in the park, either. I hate to speculate so I'll just keep holding my breath until I get my results. Overall - it's just hard to be prepared for absolutely everything and, of course, they always find the stuff you aren't totally comfortable with!


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## Shanks

Heath014 - The depth (MD) in October 2009 was pretty well in-line with NCEES sample exam ...I guess that's why everyone agreed that NCEES is a good comparison...well not this time....I was pounding with headache in morning exam but that aspirin helped and I managed to finish AM 30minutes early and I was able to get the answer for about 3-4 problems....but for PM, getting the right answer was a problem, which for whatever reason I didn't get for quite a few problems...unfortunately in a few I didn't have any clue....


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## mechgirl

I finished the morning with an hour to spare, which was about the same rate on the sample exam. Machine design is my weakest subject and that hit me pretty hard, but I still felt like I got the correct answers. I felt pretty confident and had that hour to review my work. The afternoon was much harder, just because I was so pressed for time. I think I skipped 2-3 problems during the test, and finished w/ about a half hour left to go finish those problems. I realized at the end that I hadn't filled in an answer circle, so I was checking that question and filling in the answer during the last minute. I certainly didn't have a block of time to review work.

For pass or fail, I think it could go either way. When I left the exam, I thought I'd failed, but the more I think of it, the more I think "I could have passed, after all I can miss at least 20 problems." I did feel pretty good about a lot of the questions. When I came home that night, I wrote down what I could remember (won't share!) so I could reference it to study again. I'm glad I did that right away, because now I can't remember much from the test.

I'm in a pretty small town. There less than 20 test-takers. I think about 15. I was the only mechanical, and I don't think there were any electrical. The rest were pretty evenly split between civil and structural. I heard several folks saying that they had taken the test before, some multiple times. OH, I really hope I don't have to take it again!

Spent this weekend organizing and spring cleaning. This week, I'm leaving to go on a shopping vacation w/ my Mom. When I get back, I think I"ll spend a few hours on Saturdays keeping things fresh, just in case.


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## Bman

I thought the morning went alright, I wouldn't call it a breeze, but I think I did alright. The afternoon HVAC was a lot more difficult than the sample or the SMS in my opinion.... I was sure I failed when I left, but after thinking about it I felt a little better, at this point I think it could go either way..... I'm not going to study at all until I find out I failed, I need some time off to relax if I end up having to retake it.


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## gaidox

I felt the opposite to you mechgirl..the more I think about it, the more I feel less on passing..

I've already discovered two mistakes in the morning.

I'm hoping also not to take this thing again so I'm hoping what I've did was enough to make it through. My boss expected me to pass this one so I hope I do.

I've finished the morning with more than 1 hour and used it all to re-check all and tried to work on two un-answered q's. I feel good on 32, 50/50 on 6 (with 2 mistakes already discovered), and 2 educated guess.

I'm actually expecting the afternoon to be hard so my focus during lunchbreak is to at least solve and feel good with 20 or more. The afternoon was indeed tough..after doing 28 problems and 1 hour before deadline, I've already have headache but continued to solve more. I feel good on 22, 50/50 on 12, and guessed on 6.

Overall, I feel 50/50 on passing. I think have a shot if my afternoon really did 22+..

I feel it could go either way..

Right now, I'm planning not to think about it much (just like I did in EIT).

Afterall, 13 weeks of wait here in california will wear me down if I do.


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## Steveo

Same here with regards to MD depth. Was struggling with the clock not to far out of the gate, got a bit flustered (although I swore I wouldn't...), finished pretty much right on time and had no time to look back at my "best guess for now and return later" questions, for which there were many. Not feeling good about my chances. Morning was not too bad, however. Perhaps that'll save me.

My biggest problem was not being physically prepared. I was way behind my study schedule due to travel for work (and yes, MERM has logged some serious frequent flyer miles over the past few months). Took the week prior to the exam off work to catch up, all 12 hour days, minimum for 7 striaght, including Thrus the 15th (maybe 8 hrs) - I was mentally and physically drained come 8 am the 16th. In fact I was having difficulty reading and filling out the answer sheet before starting the afternoon session I was so wasted. I found it very difficult to focus and was getting frantic way too early. Despite my own problems, I found it very challanging in general, but certainly doable, although I dont think I did it. Fingers crossed though. Gonna take a month off and start preparing for Oct (and hopefully stop preparing come July!!)


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## JoeysVee

Good luck everyone! I know the waiting sucks but it will be worth it!


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## regulator

gaidox said:


> morning portion was on par with the ncees sample exam. But the thermal fluids depth in the afternoon (in my opinion) was way difficult and time consuming (compare to ncees sample).


+1

I'll be interested in the results


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## Firefly

Looks like everyone else is about the same as me. To help you get an idea where I'm coming from...I took T&amp;F Depth.

I felt like the morning was very representative of the 2008 sample. I even recognized "the traps". I finished an hour early (same as sample) went to the RR and relaxed for a couple of minutes. Came back and knocked out a couple I had questions on. I felt very good about the morning.

Since I felt good about the AM, I knew I was going to get it once the PM started. I underestimated. I worked the problems I could do in about 2 hours (20 of them). I came back and knocked out another 6 or so. The last 15 or so, I didn't feel good about. I probably guessed on 8.

Felt terrible about PM, but (misery loves company) it appears that I am the same as most of y'all! 

Thanks again for the help, a huge weight has been lifted. I'm celebrating by going to Tampa to watch Jimmy Buffett on Saturday!!!


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## cammies

i agree with most of you, i thought the morning went really well and had lots of time to check my answers. was feeling good going into the afternoon (HVAC)....and WHAM. i don't know why, but i felt like i was knocked totally off-guard by most of the questions. i was expecting a few bizarre questions, but it seemed like a majority were asking strange things that i had never heard of before. i think i ended up finding most the answers (used my ashrae reference books a lot), but overall i felt very defeated by the end. i really don't want to go through that again :-\


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## Bman

cammies said:


> i agree with most of you, i thought the morning went really well and had lots of time to check my answers. was feeling good going into the afternoon (HVAC)....and WHAM. i don't know why, but i felt like i was knocked totally off-guard by most of the questions. i was expecting a few bizarre questions, but it seemed like a majority were asking strange things that i had never heard of before. i think i ended up finding most the answers (used my ashrae reference books a lot), but overall i felt very defeated by the end. i really don't want to go through that again :-\


I would agree with this. I felt like the questions in the afternoon were a lot more complex than any of the practice questions I had worked including the SMS and 2008 NCEES exam. Some of the questions I thought I knew how to solve, but I just couldn't get a correct answer. On a couple questions I was coming out right in the middle of two answers, so I just had to make an educated guess as to which was right. I also thought I was prepared enough to weed through the given information to find what I needed to solve the problems, but there was a lot more info given on the test than I had seen in the practice problems, so I found myself doubting that the problem was so simple as to only need say 2 of 10 pieces of given information... I'm glad its over for now! At this point, I am hoping for the best, but expecting the worst...


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## buick455

I passed the exam last Fall but I took the exam three times and I felt the last three exams were progressively harder starting in the Fall of 2008. For most, the morning is easier but for me (MD) it was about a wash. It seam the ones that report the morning was easy were those that took the fluids/thermal/HVAC depth vs. the MD depth as there is not as much in the way of MD in the morning.

I just missed my second attempt last spring with a 68 (65 was my first attempt) and I passed the exam last Fall and I think the afternoon saved me. I studied about 300 hours for each attempt so you would think I would gain more than a few points each time so I truly believe the exam is getting harder.

Note: I think the NCEES practice exams are a good test for the morning but the real deal is usually somewhat harder for the afternoon. That is why for the last attempt I did not work the NCEES problems and just worked the longer Lindeburg problems as they maybe longer but step you through the process better that those of the NCEES. In addition they are not going to throw 100% cookbook type problems at you so you have to think out of the box when studying, i.e. what if they changed the problem in this way.


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## gaidox

Yup. I did expect it to be really hard on afternoon since everybody I know keep telling me its harder than ncees for depth portion (for T&amp;F).

I did focus my depth portion more on Lindeburg and SMS but I felt that the afternoon was harder than those. Most of the problems are upgrades or more complicated of what I normally encounter and I think encountering it the first time (there) was time consuming since I try to figured it out what to do.

Some I came up with the answer and some the answer is in the middle of choices or bit far from it..Did'nt have time to redo or recheck or even finish..so I just hope for the best..but in the meantime, need to relax and enjoy the break.


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## Shanks

buick455 said:


> I passed the exam last Fall but I took the exam three times and I felt the last three exams were progressively harder starting in the Fall of 2008. For most, the morning is easier but for me (MD) it was about a wash. It seam the ones that report the morning was easy were those that took the fluids/thermal/HVAC depth vs. the MD depth as there is not as much in the way of MD in the morning.


I agree. I appeared in Fall 2009 and felt MD depth was tougher. The morning wasn't easy either for me last time because most of the questions were from HVAC and T&amp;F. I realized my weakness area and worked on those along with my strength. I believe that made a lot of difference and morning didn't take much toll this time. Though it looks like I wasn't prepared enough for my (MD) Depth. If I don't pass then my focus will be more on depth than breadth with a pray that morning doesn't get any tougher!


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## dlaxer

buick455 said:


> I passed the exam last Fall but I took the exam three times and I felt the last three exams were progressively harder starting in the Fall of 2008. For most, the morning is easier but for me (MD) it was about a wash. It seam the ones that report the morning was easy were those that took the fluids/thermal/HVAC depth vs. the MD depth as there is not as much in the way of MD in the morning.
> I just missed my second attempt last spring with a 68 (65 was my first attempt) and I passed the exam last Fall and I think the afternoon saved me. I studied about 300 hours for each attempt so you would think I would gain more than a few points each time so I truly believe the exam is getting harder.
> 
> Note: I think the NCEES practice exams are a good test for the morning but the real deal is usually somewhat harder for the afternoon. That is why for the last attempt I did not work the NCEES problems and just worked the longer Lindeburg problems as they maybe longer but step you through the process better that those of the NCEES. In addition they are not going to throw 100% cookbook type problems at you so you have to think out of the box when studying, i.e. what if they changed the problem in this way.


Not to get off topic here, but I have seen a few of you mention in this thread and others that "I just missed passing and got a 68, 69 or 65"...etc. This was my first time taking the exam in April, but I was just wondering what exactly that means when you say you didn't pass and got a 68. A 68 is 54 correct questions (which is pretty good...) Does your failure notice tell you what the passing score was for that test, or do you always need 56 or more correct answers to pass?

Thanks-


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## Bman

I thought the morning was pretty fairly split between the three depths. T&amp;F and HVAC have a lot of similarities though, so it probably seems easier for us. MD is definitely my weakest area and those problems took a toll on me. There were 2 MD questions in the morning that I had to just guess on because I didn't have a clue.


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## HokieME

I felt really good about the morning, but only after about 2 hours. At first, I thought "this is so much harder than the NCEES practice exam" but after about 2 hours, I realized I had almost 30 answered. I finished about a half hour early so I had the chance to go back and check my work. The proctors, though, were having a big long conversation about 5 feet from me during the morning session, and I could hear them even with my ear plugs in. I kept looking at them, trying to get their attention, but they didn't see me. Finally, another proctor came over there and told them to be quiet.

Fast forward to the afternoon session, which I knew would be difficult. I took mechanical design depth. I was working along, slowly, and I went to fill in an answer on my answer sheet and my answer sheet was GONE. I, obviously, had it earlier since I had filled out my name, etc. So, I started looking through my MERM to see if maybe it got stuck in there. I looked around the floor to see if maybe it had fallen off the table. Finally, I called a proctor over and told him I couldn't find my answer sheet. He looked at the table and saw the EES questionnaire sitting on my desk, picked it up and said "oh, I must have taken your answer sheet." He goes back to his table and has to search through the stack of questionnaires and finally finds my answer sheet. Meanwhile, I'm not working on any problems because I'm panicking. He brings it back, pats me on the back and says "sorry about that." Clearly oblivious to the fact that I'm almost in tears and my heart is pounding so hard I can't even read the next question. I finally calmed down, but that rattled the heck out of me.

So, all that to say, I have no idea if I passed or failed. I feel good about the morning, but bad about the afternoon. If I failed, I will be so angry. I'm not saying I wouldn't have had a freak out moment in the afternoon, but spending several precious minutes trying to find my answer sheet because the proctor took it contributed to my freak out moment for sure.


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## Shanks

[No message]


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## chaocl

HokieME said:


> I felt really good about the morning, but only after about 2 hours. At first, I thought "this is so much harder than the NCEES practice exam" but after about 2 hours, I realized I had almost 30 answered. I finished about a half hour early so I had the chance to go back and check my work. The proctors, though, were having a big long conversation about 5 feet from me during the morning session, and I could hear them even with my ear plugs in. I kept looking at them, trying to get their attention, but they didn't see me. Finally, another proctor came over there and told them to be quiet.
> Fast forward to the afternoon session, which I knew would be difficult. I took mechanical design depth. I was working along, slowly, and I went to fill in an answer on my answer sheet and my answer sheet was GONE. I, obviously, had it earlier since I had filled out my name, etc. So, I started looking through my MERM to see if maybe it got stuck in there. I looked around the floor to see if maybe it had fallen off the table. Finally, I called a proctor over and told him I couldn't find my answer sheet. He looked at the table and saw the EES questionnaire sitting on my desk, picked it up and said "oh, I must have taken your answer sheet." He goes back to his table and has to search through the stack of questionnaires and finally finds my answer sheet. Meanwhile, I'm not working on any problems because I'm panicking. He brings it back, pats me on the back and says "sorry about that." Clearly oblivious to the fact that I'm almost in tears and my heart is pounding so hard I can't even read the next question. I finally calmed down, but that rattled the heck out of me.
> 
> So, all that to say, I have no idea if I passed or failed. I feel good about the morning, but bad about the afternoon. If I failed, I will be so angry. I'm not saying I wouldn't have had a freak out moment in the afternoon, but spending several precious minutes trying to find my answer sheet because the proctor took it contributed to my freak out moment for sure.



I spent almost a year now and do all of the samples...Lindenberg samples, 101 question, problem set, MERM, 6 mintue for all 3 disciplines, 2001 and 2008 NCEE samples for all 3 disciplines, Kaplan samples for 3 disciplines, old samples and handbook. (I study day and night 7 days a week in last 3 months + I study almost 800+ hrs in the first try)

What can we do???


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## Slemory

I’m glad (but not really glad) to hear others had a similar experience to the one I had. I thought the morning session was very fair, although I realized immediately afterwards that I missed a couple of problems. I still think I did ok. I went in to the afternoon T&amp;F session feeling pretty confident, but afterwards I wanted to commit suicide. It was tough, but not impossible. Despite that, I’m pretty sure I tanked it.

NCEES, please have mercy on us.


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## gaidox

chaocl said:


> HokieME said:
> 
> 
> 
> I felt really good about the morning, but only after about 2 hours. At first, I thought "this is so much harder than the NCEES practice exam" but after about 2 hours, I realized I had almost 30 answered. I finished about a half hour early so I had the chance to go back and check my work. The proctors, though, were having a big long conversation about 5 feet from me during the morning session, and I could hear them even with my ear plugs in. I kept looking at them, trying to get their attention, but they didn't see me. Finally, another proctor came over there and told them to be quiet.
> Fast forward to the afternoon session, which I knew would be difficult. I took mechanical design depth. I was working along, slowly, and I went to fill in an answer on my answer sheet and my answer sheet was GONE. I, obviously, had it earlier since I had filled out my name, etc. So, I started looking through my MERM to see if maybe it got stuck in there. I looked around the floor to see if maybe it had fallen off the table. Finally, I called a proctor over and told him I couldn't find my answer sheet. He looked at the table and saw the EES questionnaire sitting on my desk, picked it up and said "oh, I must have taken your answer sheet." He goes back to his table and has to search through the stack of questionnaires and finally finds my answer sheet. Meanwhile, I'm not working on any problems because I'm panicking. He brings it back, pats me on the back and says "sorry about that." Clearly oblivious to the fact that I'm almost in tears and my heart is pounding so hard I can't even read the next question. I finally calmed down, but that rattled the heck out of me.
> 
> So, all that to say, I have no idea if I passed or failed. I feel good about the morning, but bad about the afternoon. If I failed, I will be so angry. I'm not saying I wouldn't have had a freak out moment in the afternoon, but spending several precious minutes trying to find my answer sheet because the proctor took it contributed to my freak out moment for sure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So that is why I was saying that who ever guess more correct answers in the afternoon will pass. I was thinking a 12 year old kid can did better than us.
> 
> I spent almost a year now and do most of the samples...Lindenberg samples, 101 question, problem set, MERM, 6 mintue for all 3 disciplines, 2001 and 2008 NCEE samples for all 3 disciplines, Kaplan samples for 3 disciplines, old samples and handbook. (I study day and night 7 days a week in last 3 months + I study almost 800+ hrs in the first try)
> 
> What can we do???
Click to expand...

Pray and hope..i guess..

I think beside hardwork..we still need some "luck" that at that time (exam) we pulled out something we dont know, or we somehow encounter most of what we've studied, or we correctly guess the answers...

But it looks you really grind it all to pass..hope you pass it this time..

so are we..

hope for the best..


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## buick455

Not to get off topic here, but I have seen a few of you mention in this thread and others that "I just missed passing and got a 68, 69 or 65"...etc. This was my first time taking the exam in April, but I was just wondering what exactly that means when you say you didn't pass and got a 68. A 68 is 54 correct questions (which is pretty good...) Does your failure notice tell you what the passing score was for that test, or do you always need 56 or more correct answers to pass?

Thanks-


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## HokieME

Does anyone else have the problem of seeing the entire world as an engineering problem? I pour myself a glass of ice water the other day and when condensation appeared on a portion of the outside of the glass, I started thinking about heat transfer coefficients and surface temperatures and relative humidity!


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## ChemORME

I took the HVAC afternoon - I felt the morning was on par with the sample exams and felt good going into the afternoon, like I was well prepared. Then...the afternoon! It was definitely much more difficult than I expected and I struggled on many more problems that I had during my preparation - several more guesses than I had in the morning session. A friend of mine who took the ME depth had exactly the reverse opinion (which mimics what I'm hearing here).

But hey - at least I know I'm free until I get my results back - and I'm optimistic that I passed at this point...we'll see! 

Oh - forgot to mention - the books that I took were (* denotes used)

*MERM

MERM Prob Solns

*SMS HVAC

SMS T&amp;F

*HVAC Equations/Data/Rules of Thumb

*Keenan &amp; Keyes Steam Tables

*ASHRAE Books (pretty sure I used all four of them - Fundamentals pretty heavily)

*Psych Charts (ones I printed off the web)

*Mark's Handbook

*NCEES 2001 Sample Exam

NCEES 2008 Sample Exam

Lindeberg Sample Exam

Anyhow - thanks to everyone for their support and postings - it was helpful in my preparations...now time for the waiting game!


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## randy

HokieME said:


> Does anyone else have the problem of seeing the entire world as an engineering problem? I pour myself a glass of ice water the other day and when condensation appeared on a portion of the outside of the glass, I started thinking about heat transfer coefficients and surface temperatures and relative humidity!


LOL...That's me! It has been driving my wife nuts for the past 3 days!! I think I was finally able to turn it off in my head last night when I finally had a good night's sleep for the first time in a quite a while. 9 1/2 hours....and could've went more but had to go to work.


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## jldavis2

"Since I felt good about the AM, I knew I was going to get it once the PM started. I underestimated. I worked the problems I could do in about 2 hours (20 of them). I came back and knocked out another 6 or so. The last 15 or so, I didn't feel good about. I probably guessed on 8. "

Ditto here, except my first pass took close to 3hrs. Heat Transfer (my nemesis) came out in force. Fortunately I stuck to my strategy and skipped those problems and gave myself every opportunity to answer easier/quicker problems. But I still probably had 10 complete or partial guesses in afternoon.

Just glad that the dreams of enthalpies, coefficients, and HHP have as of last night finally ended - for now....


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## chme

I thought the exam was tough overall when compared with the sample NCEES exam. Some questions were way too hard for me. I used MERM, MED-Shigley, NCEES Sample Exam, Machinery Handbook and Mark's Handbook as a reference material. MERM and Machinery Handbook came in very handy every time. I also printed out index of MERM and MED separately in a three ring binder and it was very useful for quick look-ups.

I have mixed feelings about the results and every time I think about how I did in the exam, it makes me feel more and more nervous about the results. A month and half wait now....keeling my fingers crossed...

Wish this exam was computer-based!

Good luck everyone!


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## Rob8rich

This was my third consecutive attempt. I am in Texas, so I was given my grades, and a diagnostic from NCEES, which everyone who fails receives. My discipline is Mechanical and my afternoon was Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems for all three exams.

My first attempt was April 2009 and my grade was a 63 (humbling). My second attempt was Oct 2009 and my grade was 69 (ouch). Using the grades, the NCEES diagnostics, and the NCEES exam specifications, I was able to see exactly how many right/wrong answers I had for each category. This also allowed me to know my "raw score" and the factor used to compute the "adjusted score."

Last week's exam was similar in difficulty level to the April 2009 exam, in my opinion. I seemed to breeze through the morning, and the afternoon was another killer (congratulations NCEES, you have outdone yourselves again).

I think I passed this time, but we shall see.

I still awake every night, then spend several hours tossing and turning, half asleep and half awake. I dream of solving problems, or struggling through problems, from the exam. This has happened each time after the test. About two weeks of broken sleep, dreaming of problems. This too shall pass, then I can return to a normal life for six weeks, until the results come back.

I pray that I passed. I hope that I passed. (I hope and pray that we all did)


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## cityeng

I felt terrible about the afternoon, I am glad in a miserable sort of way that I am not the only one. I felt like I worked about 25 on each morning and afternoon(T&amp;F). mabey it was enough with lucky guesses to get me through this time. I really dont want to take this a third time.


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## Shanks

It's good to be back home


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## Kephart P.E.

matkenmd said:


> Morning was a breeze. I'm not sure about the afternoon. It was harder then the AM for sure, but I may have pulled it off. Not sure. The vibration stuff gave me trouble since I didn't study it as much as I should have. I found the NCEES prep material pretty accurate and useful. I don't want to wait for results for the next 2 months.


Took it a year ago, same feelings, barely got answers for the afternoon. Passed first time.


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## dneva

ChemORME said:


> I took the HVAC afternoon - I felt the morning was on par with the sample exams and felt good going into the afternoon, like I was well prepared. Then...the afternoon! It was definitely much more difficult than I expected and I struggled on many more problems that I had during my preparation - several more guesses than I had in the morning session. A friend of mine who took the ME depth had exactly the reverse opinion (which mimics what I'm hearing here).
> But hey - at least I know I'm free until I get my results back - and I'm optimistic that I passed at this point...we'll see!
> 
> Oh - forgot to mention - the books that I took were (* denotes used)
> 
> *MERM
> 
> MERM Prob Solns
> 
> *SMS HVAC
> 
> SMS T&amp;F
> 
> *HVAC Equations/Data/Rules of Thumb
> 
> *Keenan &amp; Keyes Steam Tables
> 
> *ASHRAE Books (pretty sure I used all four of them - Fundamentals pretty heavily)
> 
> *Psych Charts (ones I printed off the web)
> 
> *Mark's Handbook
> 
> *NCEES 2001 Sample Exam
> 
> NCEES 2008 Sample Exam
> 
> Lindeberg Sample Exam
> 
> Anyhow - thanks to everyone for their support and postings - it was helpful in my preparations...now time for the waiting game!


Thanks for providing the books you used. I'll be taking the Mechanical PE next time, hopefully after I get my results from the Civil PE.


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## dneva

Rob8rich said:


> This was my third consecutive attempt. I am in Texas, so I was given my grades, and a diagnostic from NCEES, which everyone who fails receives. My discipline is Mechanical and my afternoon was Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems for all three exams.
> My first attempt was April 2009 and my grade was a 63 (humbling). My second attempt was Oct 2009 and my grade was 69 (ouch). Using the grades, the NCEES diagnostics, and the NCEES exam specifications, I was able to see exactly how many right/wrong answers I had for each category. This also allowed me to know my "raw score" and the factor used to compute the "adjusted score."
> 
> Last week's exam was similar in difficulty level to the April 2009 exam, in my opinion. I seemed to breeze through the morning, and the afternoon was another killer (congratulations NCEES, you have outdone yourselves again).
> 
> I think I passed this time, but we shall see.
> 
> I still awake every night, then spend several hours tossing and turning, half asleep and half awake. I dream of solving problems, or struggling through problems, from the exam. This has happened each time after the test. About two weeks of broken sleep, dreaming of problems. This too shall pass, then I can return to a normal life for six weeks, until the results come back.
> 
> I pray that I passed. I hope that I passed. (I hope and pray that we all did)



How many problems correct when you got a 69?


----------



## Rob8rich

dneva said:


> Rob8rich said:
> 
> 
> 
> This was my third consecutive attempt. I am in Texas, so I was given my grades, and a diagnostic from NCEES, which everyone who fails receives. My discipline is Mechanical and my afternoon was Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems for all three exams.
> My first attempt was April 2009 and my grade was a 63 (humbling). My second attempt was Oct 2009 and my grade was 69 (ouch). Using the grades, the NCEES diagnostics, and the NCEES exam specifications, I was able to see exactly how many right/wrong answers I had for each category. This also allowed me to know my "raw score" and the factor used to compute the "adjusted score."
> 
> Last week's exam was similar in difficulty level to the April 2009 exam, in my opinion. I seemed to breeze through the morning, and the afternoon was another killer (congratulations NCEES, you have outdone yourselves again).
> 
> I think I passed this time, but we shall see.
> 
> I still awake every night, then spend several hours tossing and turning, half asleep and half awake. I dream of solving problems, or struggling through problems, from the exam. This has happened each time after the test. About two weeks of broken sleep, dreaming of problems. This too shall pass, then I can return to a normal life for six weeks, until the results come back.
> 
> I pray that I passed. I hope that I passed. (I hope and pray that we all did)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many problems correct when you got a 69?
Click to expand...



I had 21 of 40 correct in the morning, and 24 of 40 in the afternoon. Totals for the exam was 45 of 80 correct. That computes to 1.53 points per correct answer.

1.53 x 45 = 69

This is only valid for the Mechanical - Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems, given in October, 2009.

FYI- for the April, 2009 exam I had 43/80 correct. The factor for that exam was 1.465 x 43 = 63.


----------



## Shanks

When I took exam in October 2009 (MD Depth), I found 1.5 to be an average multiplier. Had I got 2 more problems, I would have passed and I hope that I got that many (~47) correct this time....


----------



## chaocl

Shanks said:


> When I took exam in October 2009 (MD Depth), I found 1.5 to be an average multiplier. Had I got 2 more problems, I would have passed and I hope that I got that many (~47) correct this time....


I think you will pass this time with 47/80. I guess if you can get around 18 to 20 in the afternoon this time that you should be safe.


----------



## Shanks

Thanks chaocl ...I am guessing that I got 30 in AM and around 20 in PM ...it'll be tight again for this year...but I hope that the score falls on the +ve side


----------



## Rob8rich

Now that I have been through the exam cycle for four consecutive times (once for FE then three times for PE), I have a different perspective.

I know that about 60% of the MEs pass on the first try. But many examinees, for many different reasons, do not.

I think it is a two year task to learn the material well enough to pass. If you make it in less time, then great. But you keep testing until you've learned it well enough to pass. They don't just give the PE title away to anyone!

Good luck! (one examinee told me that luck is for the unprepared, ... well yes, but luck does apply to all the guesses)

RR


----------



## ecoli946

I found the morning to be really easy, much easier than I thought. I think I passed because of the morning. Probably 90% morning/70% in the afternoon.

This was my third time. Twice back in the 90's and finally after 14 years, I tried again. this time all multiple choice, which is a completely different strategy than studying for essay type.

Spent 400+ hours. Used Lindeburg's newest addition. New edition has a lot of new stuff. I did all 500 problems in the practice book, I did all the six-minute questions from 3 module. I took both ncees sample exam and did 80%. I took Lindeburg's practice exam and only did 55%. I was worried, but the exam was very similiar to ncees sample exam.

If you don't do well in the morning section, you won't have a chance to pass because you need all the points in the morning because afternoon is time consuming and trickier.

Here's my rule of thumb on hours studying :

200-300 = probably 65-70%

300-400 = probably 70-75%

400+ = probably 75-80%

So if you want to feel good after the exam, study 400+.

Also I brought a seat cushion, and that helped a lot because the chairs were so low, it was ridiculous. The cushion added some height so I wouldn't feel like a midget.

I also studied all three module so I could pass the afternoon module. Don't have an area of weakness, that will kill you.

Read Lindeburg at least 2 times thoroughly. The 2nd time, you should be writing bunch of notes.


----------



## Shanks

ecoli946 said:


> I found the morning to be really easy, much easier than I thought. I think I passed because of the morning. Probably 90% morning/70% in the afternoon.
> This was my third time. Twice back in the 90's and finally after 14 years, I tried again. this time all multiple choice, which is a completely different strategy than studying for essay type.
> 
> Spent 400+ hours. Used Lindeburg's newest addition. New edition has a lot of new stuff. I did all 500 problems in the practice book, I did all the six-minute questions from 3 module. I took both ncees sample exam and did 80%. I took Lindeburg's practice exam and only did 55%. I was worried, but the exam was very similiar to ncees sample exam.
> 
> If you don't do well in the morning section, you won't have a chance to pass because you need all the points in the morning because afternoon is time consuming and trickier.
> 
> Here's my rule of thumb on hours studying :
> 
> 200-300 = probably 65-70%
> 
> 300-400 = probably 70-75%
> 
> 400+ = probably 75-80%
> 
> So if you want to feel good after the exam, study 400+.
> 
> Also I brought a seat cushion, and that helped a lot because the chairs were so low, it was ridiculous. The cushion added some height so I wouldn't feel like a midget.
> 
> I also studied all three module so I could pass the afternoon module. Don't have an area of weakness, that will kill you.
> 
> Read Lindeburg at least 2 times thoroughly. The 2nd time, you should be writing bunch of notes.


It seems like you'd a good plan on your last attempt and I've also started to believe that you can't take any topic lighter. I did on my first attempt and had hard time in AM. I focused more on my weakness and AM was comparatively better but if I don't get through this time then it'll be the time to focus more on my strength (PM).


----------



## chaocl

ecoli946 said:


> I found the morning to be really easy, much easier than I thought. I think I passed because of the morning. Probably 90% morning/70% in the afternoon.
> This was my third time. Twice back in the 90's and finally after 14 years, I tried again. this time all multiple choice, which is a completely different strategy than studying for essay type.
> 
> Spent 400+ hours. Used Lindeburg's newest addition. New edition has a lot of new stuff. I did all 500 problems in the practice book, I did all the six-minute questions from 3 module. I took both ncees sample exam and did 80%. I took Lindeburg's practice exam and only did 55%. I was worried, but the exam was very similiar to ncees sample exam.
> 
> If you don't do well in the morning section, you won't have a chance to pass because you need all the points in the morning because afternoon is time consuming and trickier.
> 
> Here's my rule of thumb on hours studying :
> 
> 200-300 = probably 65-70%
> 
> 300-400 = probably 70-75%
> 
> 400+ = probably 75-80%
> 
> So if you want to feel good after the exam, study 400+.
> 
> Also I brought a seat cushion, and that helped a lot because the chairs were so low, it was ridiculous. The cushion added some height so I wouldn't feel like a midget.
> 
> I also studied all three module so I could pass the afternoon module. Don't have an area of weakness, that will kill you.
> 
> Read Lindeburg at least 2 times thoroughly. The 2nd time, you should be writing bunch of notes.


You will pass the PE this time according to your study plan and your feeling about the AM/PM PE. 90% AM and 70% PM score will give you the PE license in 100%.

Congratulation to you :bananalama:


----------



## VJS

I took the exam week off and studied MERM mostly. I have seen discussions in this forum that 150-200 hrs is pretty good prep if you have the depth section topic fresh in the mind. I may have spent a total of about 60-80 hrs total in the month before exam. I am an analyst and use MD (incl. vibrations) in my day to day work with Marks, machinery's hdbk and that helped a LOT in the exam. i did not see use of MERM for more than 20 questions in the afternoon session.

I think I may have got about 35+/40 in morning and 32+/40 afternoon. Infact, I was slow in the morning and about 5 mins left to perform final check, but in the afternoon, i finished about 25 completed in 2hrs and had about 20 mins at the end. During re-check I had to change couple of answers and figured I had to guess three questions.

This is my first attempt and definitely would recommend having a strong base using Mark's hnbk. I answered most questions in afternoon MD section with it.

All the best to everyone, let us see how the final results go.


----------



## oluade PE

ecoli946 said:


> I found the morning to be really easy, much easier than I thought. I think I passed because of the morning. Probably 90% morning/70% in the afternoon.
> This was my third time. Twice back in the 90's and finally after 14 years, I tried again. this time all multiple choice, which is a completely different strategy than studying for essay type.
> 
> Spent 400+ hours. Used Lindeburg's newest addition. New edition has a lot of new stuff. I did all 500 problems in the practice book, I did all the six-minute questions from 3 module. I took both ncees sample exam and did 80%. I took Lindeburg's practice exam and only did 55%. I was worried, but the exam was very similiar to ncees sample exam.
> 
> If you don't do well in the morning section, you won't have a chance to pass because you need all the points in the morning because afternoon is time consuming and trickier.
> 
> Here's my rule of thumb on hours studying :
> 
> 200-300 = probably 65-70%
> 
> 300-400 = probably 70-75%
> 
> 400+ = probably 75-80%
> 
> So if you want to feel good after the exam, study 400+.
> 
> Also I brought a seat cushion, and that helped a lot because the chairs were so low, it was ridiculous. The cushion added some height so I wouldn't feel like a midget.
> 
> I also studied all three module so I could pass the afternoon module. Don't have an area of weakness, that will kill you.
> 
> Read Lindeburg at least 2 times thoroughly. The 2nd time, you should be writing bunch of notes.




On an average, 400+ hours of study will translate to how many months of study. Also, it seems that (47-48)/80 will get somone a license.

Thanks


----------



## Kephart P.E.

"Also, it seems that (47-48)/80 will get somone a license."

That seems pretty resonable, I only had to take the PE once, but I was pretty sure I got around 55 correct which 55/80= 68% so without a curve or factor I don't pass.

Also someone commented that you don't want to have any weakness which I mostly agree with, but I had definite weaknesses going into the exam. I think the key is to know your depth stuff forwards and backwards and be able to get all the easy questions from your weak areas. I didn't know many of the subjects from MD, but I could at least work the easier stuff to get a correct answer.

The last piece of advice I would give is that I think the Lindeburgh Sample Exam is worthless to take as a test, it is really hard, but try using it to develop your skills as a guesser. Basically read the hard questions and without really doing any work take 30 seconds and narrow your choices down to 2 possibilities. I think this ability gave me a couple of questions I did not actually know how to work.


----------



## benbo

> I had 21 of 40 correct in the morning, and 24 of 40 in the afternoon. Totals for the exam was 45 of 80 correct. That computes to 1.53 points per correct answer.
> 1.53 x 45 = 69
> 
> This is only valid for the Mechanical - Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems, given in October, 2009.
> 
> FYI- for the April, 2009 exam I had 43/80 correct. The factor for that exam was 1.465 x 43 = 63.


Good grief. Where in the world does it say there is a linear relationship between these scores? I have seen people with wide ranges of scores all get a 69. I wish people would not just assume things. Do so at your own risk.



> I think you will pass this time with 47/80.


Forget it. Anybody who cares, do not count on this. I have seen many, many people on many different exams with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. You are highly unlikely to pass with this score.


----------



## chaocl

benbo said:


> I think you will pass this time with 47/80.
> 
> 
> 
> Forget it. Anybody who cares, do not count on this. I have seen many, many people on many different exams with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. You are highly unlikely to pass with this score.
Click to expand...

I know that pass the PE with 47/80 is not true but I just want to bring the hope to people.

Very Important: If we do fail the exam with that percentage scores (47/80 to 55/80) that we just need to take the test again and again, study harder and harder or try different methods of studying. Don't think about what I said about the passing score.


----------



## benbo

chaocl said:


> benbo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you will pass this time with 47/80.
> 
> 
> 
> Forget it. Anybody who cares, do not count on this. I have seen many, many people on many different exams with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. You are highly unlikely to pass with this score.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know that pass the PE with 47/80 is not true but I just want to bring the hope to people.
> 
> Very Important: If we do fail the exam with that percentage scores (47/80 to 55/80) that we just need to take the test again and again, study harder and harder or try different methods of studying. Don't think about what I said about the passing score.
Click to expand...

That's good and very true. I also want to bring hope to people. I have no doubt that anybody on here who has an engineering degree and works in engineering can pass that test if they study and persevere.

And they will do it with a score closer to 70% than 60%.


----------



## chaocl

I do understand that most engineers that study so hard and couldn't pass. That is why I also said study in different methods than last time.

I took the T&amp;F in both time that I took PE exam.

First try - I start study from April 2009 until the day before the exam of Oct, 2009. I study whole MERM and sample problems in the other book, Lienberg sample for T&amp;F, old MERM edition for the T&amp;F, 2 Old NCEEs samples (they are not in multple choice), 6 mins soluation for T&amp;F, and NCEES 2001 sample. My total study time is more than 700 hours. On the regular day that I study during workdays in the afternoon and the last two month I also study on the weekends. However, I still fail the exam (not even closed)....I end up only score 15/40 in the morning (got only 12% for MD) and 20/40 in the afternoon... I don't know why my morning is that bad? I guess it is because I travel from NY to CA for the exam and the time difference cause my performance or I ran to the exam site in 20 minutes and carry my books also (I am so tired and sweat my t-shirt just there few minutes before the exam start). But after few days of thinking that I am not 100% sure about the questions because I am not too familar with them. During my study that if I am getting the answer by guessing correct that I just don't pay a lot of attention to time. Because the study time period is to long (7 months) I kind forget the beginning sections. I rely too much on the the MERM for the answer and sometimes I couldn't get it afterward. From that time that I set up my study plan and study "smart" for my second try.

Second try - (I got my fail result by 1/25/2010 for the 1st try) so I give myself few days of refresh time and start study by 2/1/2010 for the sencond try. I know the time is less this time so I study day and night on everyday (even the weekend) until the exam day. I study the problems only on the MERM and skip the math, and end sections but I do study the electricty and economic. I highly recommand study before you sleep because when I sleep that I imaging my mind has a blackboard and I wrote down every important formulas and things to remeber on that imaging blackboard. (It helps me a lot because the next week or so I can still remeber the formula by heart)...I print all the important table on several sheet and write important formula regard to those tables there (I did for all three disciplines). I fully understand what I know on those sheet that I wrote. (because I was thinkng it is not point that you bring something that you don't familiar with). Most people will think that if I wrote down all formula in the sheet why don't I just rely on the MERM? My answer is no, because a lot of MERM formula looks very different but they actually the same..because of the converstion, different inputs or asking differently...it is a hard work to clear that and put all important foumula on the sheet...The power cycle that I study a lot with the graphs, effiecny (all different with motor,pumps,turbines,mechanical, and etc...some of them used in different position when you apply them and they are not always in one side when you do the calculation). The thermal and fluid is ok because I am study that everyday because my work....I also print out all those table with G,E,thermal expansion,poisson's ratio, yield strengths, etc on the same paper with important formula that will relate to each other. Also you need to know the important stuff that cause them can use relate to each other.(MERM won't tell you)...plus I book my flight and hotel a day before the exam so I don't need to be very rush to get to the exam site. I choose a different exam site because the one I had in Oct, 2009 is not very convience for me.

People are saying why you have to spent so many time on all 3 disciplines? I said it is because I did so bad on the first try on MD and HVAC. Also some of the sections that relate to each other. I study all 3 disciplines when I prepared my exam. I used MERM, MERM problems set, 2001 NCEES (3 disciplines), 2008 NCEES (3 disciplines), 6 mins solution (3 disciplines), Linderbrg samples (3 disciplines), "Kaplan samples (3 disciplines)--give me a lot of idea of study!!!becaue they have 1 problems all appear on the 3 afternoon disciplines and asking different stuff" and 101 ME problems. I didn't study the old samples because that is different than the real exam. Every question that I used heart and remeber everything with it and study beyond this problem that related to others.

I will have my exam result by Mid July, 2010 and by that time I will know my study method is right or need more improvment. I have a lot of small methods that I haven't list out yet because it might take another couple paragraphs.

It is hard to finish reading every sentance that I wrote but it is really my experience for this time or my last time.


----------



## benbo

chaocl said:


> It is hard to finish reading every sentance that I wrote but it is really my experience for this time or my last time.


Good luck! Keep at it and you will pass.


----------



## oluade PE

benbo said:


> I had 21 of 40 correct in the morning, and 24 of 40 in the afternoon. Totals for the exam was 45 of 80 correct. That computes to 1.53 points per correct answer.
> 1.53 x 45 = 69
> 
> This is only valid for the Mechanical - Thermal &amp; Fluids Systems, given in October, 2009.
> 
> FYI- for the April, 2009 exam I had 43/80 correct. The factor for that exam was 1.465 x 43 = 63.
> 
> 
> 
> Good grief. Where in the world does it say there is a linear relationship between these scores? I have seen people with wide ranges of scores all get a 69. I wish people would not just assume things. Do so at your own risk.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think you will pass this time with 47/80.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Forget it. Anybody who cares, do not count on this. I have seen many, many people on many different exams with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. You are highly unlikely to pass with this score.
Click to expand...


With 1.5 as a mutiplier for the year in question, it is likely that 47/80 (1.5x47=70.7=Pass). This is related to Mechanical. You are likely an Electrical

and the people you met with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. Did you ask them theri discipline and what was the multiplier

factor for the year?.


----------



## benbo

oluade said:


> With 1.5 as a mutiplier for the year in question, it is likely that 47/80 (1.5x47=70.7=Pass). This is related to Mechanical. You are likely an Electricaland the people you met with diagnostically computed scores well over 50 failing the test. Did you ask them theri discipline and what was the multiplier
> 
> factor for the year?.


Sigh. Show me any place, any single place where there is anything official about a so-called "multipler." This is something you made up. There is no such thing as a linear multiplier between the raw score and this computed score. Where do you get this notion? You understand the concept of linear and non-linear relationship?

Why in the world would NCEES guard the raw passing score like the nuclear codes, then give out results in Texas and Virginia that make it so easy to compute that a sixth grader could do it? It makes no sense.

It does not matter which test we are talking about. It has been true for several tests and it dispels the notion of any sort of linear multiplier. Multiple people post they have a scaled score of 69 on their report. Then they compute the raw score. People with 52, 53, 54, 55, and 56 ALL got the same 69. It is a fact, but I'm not going to search back through thousands of posts to find it.

I suspect that anybody who thinks they will pass any of these exams with less than 60% is in for a shock.


----------



## Dexman PE

I'm still curious as to what good knowing the cut score is. I took the exam over 2 years ago, and this is the 5th exam I've been a member of the boards, and this is the 5th exam where people argued about what the cutscore is, and this will probably be the 5th exam where everyone who passed will quickly forget they were even arguing this...

What if I told you in January that the April cut score would be 58/80, would you study differently? Would you approach the exam differently? Would it make the wait any different?

Think of it this way: Remember the multiple choice tests we would take back in school? You knew UP FRONT what constituted an A, B, C, D or an F score. You knew when you took the test how many questions there were. Honestly, how many of you KNEW what grade you got before the teacher handed the graded test back?

Seriously, there are better things to worry yourself with during this time. Go get a puppy.


----------



## Shanks

Dexman PE said:


> Seriously, there are better things to worry yourself with during this time. Go get a puppy.


Couldn't agree more...if I don't pass then I need all the energy for prep and it's gonna come from all the fun I am having now or will have for next 2-3 wks. Nobody prepares or sits in the exam with the focus of getting just the passing score, we all try to get as much as we can. The multiplier of 1.5 might be a wash but its just an interpretation of those who got their diagnostic reports. Till NCEES is the father of CIA, there is no way to prove or disprove it either, so believe or leave it!


----------



## benbo

> The multiplier of 1.5 might be a wash but its just an interpretation of those who got their diagnostic reports.


If "wash" means a ridiculously unfounded bunch of crap, that's true. Like I said, I have been reading these diagnostics and scaled scores on here (and the other board) for years. I have seen raw scores range over 5 points for a single scaled score. So I know it's a bunch of crap. And like I also said, I'm not going back to search up these posts. But people are entitled to believe a bunch of made up crap if they want.

If you think you will pass the PE exam with a 59%, have at it.

Why 1.5? Why not 1.49? Why not 1.51? How many decimal points for the magic multiplier? How do you round things in this made up world?

What is the exact equation that relates the raw score to the scaled score?

Is it S = MR , where R=raw, S=scaled and M=multiplier. So if I get all 80 correct I get 120?


----------



## Mike in Gastonia

benbo said:


> Is it S = MR , where R=raw, S=scaled and M=multiplier. So if I get all 80 correct I get 120?


That's what my boss's ex-wife's father told him when he helped with the exams 35 years ago. So it must be true today, right?

benbo, I'll give you major props for perseverance. You keep a pitchin', but they ain't a catchin'!


----------



## benbo

Mike in Gastonia said:


> benbo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is it S = MR , where R=raw, S=scaled and M=multiplier. So if I get all 80 correct I get 120?
> 
> 
> 
> That's what my boss's ex-wife's father told him when he helped with the exams 35 years ago. So it must be true today, right?
> 
> benbo, I'll give you major props for perseverance. You keep a pitchin', but they ain't a catchin'!
Click to expand...

Yes, for some reason I keep at it.

It doesn't really matter, nobody here really knows.

But I just don't think it's a good idea to assume that if you get a 69 it means you are only one question away. It can lead to complacency. If you want to believe all this other voodoo and witchcraft, it can't hurt as long as you prepare properly.


----------



## ecoli946

I'm not sure what all the fuss with cutscore. If you look at past cutscore from 2002-2004, for mechancial/electrical/chemical, the passing score is 70%. then they stopped posting it at the CA pels website. not one time did I see a cutscore below 70% except for traffic. Ncees says min is 70%. Don't get 55/80, you will not pass.


----------



## oluade PE

ecoli946 said:


> I'm not sure what all the fuss with cutscore. If you look at past cutscore from 2002-2004, for mechancial/electrical/chemical, the passing score is 70%. then they stopped posting it at the CA pels website. not one time did I see a cutscore below 70% except for traffic. Ncees says min is 70%. Don't get 55/80, you will not pass.



You are totally off the track with your assumption of 70% as pass mark. Look at the NCEES website that mentioned something

about cut score. Your interpretation of pass mark is base on the following equation Let X=your total score. to score 70%=pass=x/80x100. This is taotally wrong.


----------



## Dexman PE

:deadhorse:


----------



## benbo

oluade said:


> You are totally off the track with your assumption of 70% as pass mark. Look at the NCEES website that mentioned somethingabout cut score. Your interpretation of pass mark is base on the following equation Let X=your total score. to score 70%=pass=x/80x100. This is taotally wrong.


On this you are 100% correct.


----------



## benbo

Dexman PE said:


> :deadhorse:


And as far as beating the dead horse - this is about the fiftieth time that icon has been used on this subject, as well as the "Aw Jeez, not this sh*t again" image. It ain't gonna die. As long as people keep making stuff up, and as long as there are new people that beleive it, I won't be able to control myself.

They'll have to ban me.


----------



## Shanks

Don't forget about the assumptions/rumors (I saw somewhere on EB) that some of the questions are there just for experiments by NCEES and they might not be counted towards your final score. Again I would think # of those kinda questions would vary in every exam...

As far as complacency, I would think that if someone is trying for PE license, he/she is far beyond complacency in his/her career...


----------



## oluade PE

benbo said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> :deadhorse:
> 
> 
> 
> And as far as beating the dead horse - this is about the fiftieth time that icon has been used on this subject, as well as the "Aw Jeez, not this sh*t again" image. It ain't gonna die. As long as people keep making stuff up, and as long as there are new people that beleive it, I won't be able to control myself.
> 
> They'll have to ban me.
Click to expand...


i never knew this site b4 the examination. i came across the sie while serching through the web for any hint about pe result. Anyway, it has been fun comunicating and deliberating on isuues. Enjoy the remaining 3-4 weeks. a journey of 1000miles will one day come to pass.


----------



## benbo

Shanks said:


> Don't forget about the assumptions/rumors (I saw somewhere on EB) that some of the questions are there just for experiments by NCEES and they might not be counted towards your final score. Again I would think # of those kinda questions would vary in every exam...
> As far as complacency, I would think that if someone is trying for PE license, he/she is far beyond complacency in his/her career...


As far as I know there are not questions that are not counted towards your final score. But there are special questions that are part of a pool used for equating purposes. At least that's how I understand it, although I'll adfmit I could be wrong. It is explained on the NCEES website and elsewhere.

As far as the post-test review for ambiguous questions, I do not believe they throw out such questions, but rather give credit for more than one answer selection. Again, I think I read that somewhere, and that is how most test developers do it, but I'm not certain.

As far as complacency, don't kid yourself. Several years ago, everybody used to get this 0 to 70 score. I saw countless people posting "I got a 69, only one more question and I'm over the top." They would fail repeatedly, and you could tell they were not taking it seriously - they were certain they really just needed a little luck to get over that one question hump. Luckily, most states wised up and stopped giving out this meaningless score.


----------



## ecoli946

http://www.pels.ca.gov/applicants/ap02stats.shtml

check out the website and the cutscore that they had. This was 2002. Cutscore of 70 out of 100.

http://www.pels.ca.gov/applicants/ap05stats.shtml

This is April 2005. Cutscore is 70 out of 100. After April 2005, CA stopped showing cutscore.

How am I suppose to intrepret these?



oluade said:


> ecoli946 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not sure what all the fuss with cutscore. If you look at past cutscore from 2002-2004, for mechancial/electrical/chemical, the passing score is 70%. then they stopped posting it at the CA pels website. not one time did I see a cutscore below 70% except for traffic. Ncees says min is 70%. Don't get 55/80, you will not pass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You are totally off the track with your assumption of 70% as pass mark. Look at the NCEES website that mentioned something
> 
> about cut score. Your interpretation of pass mark is base on the following equation Let X=your total score. to score 70%=pass=x/80x100. This is taotally wrong.
Click to expand...


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## Kephart P.E.

It is sort of a waste of time to try and figure out how many correct answers you need to pass, however, I believe people have posted here before that somes states (Texas?) used to actually report a raw score. And the passing score changed each year.

I would be really shocked if the cutscore was actually at 56/80 for every test.


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## benbo

70 is a scaled score. It has nothing to do with a percent, or the cut score.

Did you take the SAT? Do you think that if you get a 750/800 it means you answered 750/800 question correctly, or that you got 750/800 = 93.75%. It does not.

This is the same thing. And this is the reason most sensible states stopped giving out this nonsensical score.

http://www.ncees.org/Exams/Scoring.php



> This becomes the passing score. NCEES does not publish passing scores because they change with each administration.


If every passing score was 70 do you think they would write this? Are they just lying? And California uses NCEES cut score.

From a more sinister source -

http://www.ppi2pass.com/ppi/PPIInfo_pg_myp...grade.html#pass



> What is the passing score for the PE exams? Beginning with the October 2005 administration, candidates will receive results of "Pass" or "Fail" only. Failing candidates will no longer receive a numerical score.
> 
> Does this mean I have to solve 70% of the questions correctly to pass the exam?
> 
> NO. Do not confuse the CONVERTED passing score of 70 with having to score 70% in order to pass. It's not possible to say what the exact percentage needed to pass is, because the raw passing score fluctuates with each administration of the exam. To add to the mystery, NCEES does not make the raw passing scores public.
> 
> So the CONVERTED passing score is always 70, even though the number of problems that I must solve to pass can go up and down?
> 
> YES.


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## Firefly

I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids

What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!


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## gaidox

Firefly said:


> I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids
> What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!


congrats man, you made it. congrats also to all who already passed (pe me april 2010). me i have to wait for 6 more weeks . .damn


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## chaocl

Firefly said:


> I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids
> What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!



congratulation! :mf_bounce8:


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## Shanks

Firefly said:


> I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids
> What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!


Congratulations firefly! I am expecting my results sometime next week. Which state you appeared in?


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## Firefly

South Carolina


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## Slemory

Firefly said:


> I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids
> What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!



Congrats! Me too! First time and just got the results by mail today (MS). But I know I had to pass by the skin of my teeth.


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## ChemORME

Slemory said:


> Firefly said:
> 
> 
> 
> I passed! First try! Thermal &amp; Fluids
> What a relief. Thanks for the wonderful guidance this board has provided!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats! Me too! First time and just got the results by mail today (MS). But I know I had to pass by the skin of my teeth.
Click to expand...

The good thing is that if you pass, you pass - it doesn't matter by how much! Now...where are my results again??? :mail-296:


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## VJS

VJS said:


> I took the exam week off and studied MERM mostly. I have seen discussions in this forum that 150-200 hrs is pretty good prep if you have the depth section topic fresh in the mind. I may have spent a total of about 60-80 hrs total in the month before exam. I am an analyst and use MD (incl. vibrations) in my day to day work with Marks, machinery's hdbk and that helped a LOT in the exam. i did not see use of MERM for more than 20 questions in the afternoon session.
> I think I may have got about 35+/40 in morning and 32+/40 afternoon. Infact, I was slow in the morning and about 5 mins left to perform final check, but in the afternoon, i finished about 25 completed in 2hrs and had about 20 mins at the end. During re-check I had to change couple of answers and figured I had to guess three questions.
> 
> This is my first attempt and definitely would recommend having a strong base using Mark's hnbk. I answered most questions in afternoon MD section with it.
> 
> All the best to everyone, let us see how the final results go.


I am replying to my own post. I passed, first try.


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## nashbmattPE

I passed mechanical HVAC North Carolina


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## Bean PE

I passed, ME-MD first try. My studying consisted of reading the MERM cover to cover (except for the math section) and tabbing a few things, then reading it again (skipping a few more sections this time) and working a couple problems, then starting the practice exam and saying "this is stupid, no friggin' way the real exam is this hard" and going skiing.

I had that book with me almost non-stop from January until the test, except (usually) when I'd go skiing, or really any weekends.


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## Bman

Glad to say I passed. Congrats to Firefly and Mechgirl; still routing for Shanks and anyone else who's waiting on results!


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## Oughtsix

I passed also. MD depth.

I got the email to recieve our results online, waited a while hoping NCEES still showed what areas we need improvement in. After all, I was already studying for October. Logged in and had the pdf sent. It showed up and fully expecting a "fail" I opened it and saw "passed". I said "that can't be right" and closed it, logged out, then logged back in and had them resend. Opened the second pdf and there it was again.. "passed". Hmmm. So I started reading down through it and when I saw "you must remit to the Ohio Board a $50 registraion fee" I new it had to be true! They wanted more money! I did indeed pass!! I went home and got drunk immediatley. Not really. I wanted to, but I didn't.

Thanks everyone for the great posts, especially Bman, gaidox, and BrainC. I did a lot of lurking and not much posting but I was on here everyday with you all. This was a great resource.


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## gaidox

Congrats man! Don't underestimate what you did..you deserve it.

Yet its nice to be pessimistic about the result then pass afterwards.

nice story too.


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## Steveo

Well, as planned I started studying for Oct 2010 exam a few weeks ago. But now stopping beacuse I PASSED!! didn;t think I'd ever get my results up here in MA...

ME MD depth

1st attempt


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## chaocl

chaocl said:


> I do understand that most engineers that study so hard and couldn't pass. That is why I also said study in different methods than last time.
> I took the T&amp;F in both time that I took PE exam.
> 
> First try - I start study from April 2009 until the day before the exam of Oct, 2009. I study whole MERM and sample problems in the other book, Lienberg sample for T&amp;F, old MERM edition for the T&amp;F, 2 Old NCEEs samples (they are not in multple choice), 6 mins soluation for T&amp;F, and NCEES 2001 sample. My total study time is more than 700 hours. On the regular day that I study during workdays in the afternoon and the last two month I also study on the weekends. However, I still fail the exam (not even closed)....I end up only score 15/40 in the morning (got only 12% for MD) and 20/40 in the afternoon... I don't know why my morning is that bad? I guess it is because I travel from NY to CA for the exam and the time difference cause my performance or I ran to the exam site in 20 minutes and carry my books also (I am so tired and sweat my t-shirt just there few minutes before the exam start). But after few days of thinking that I am not 100% sure about the questions because I am not too familar with them. During my study that if I am getting the answer by guessing correct that I just don't pay a lot of attention to time. Because the study time period is to long (7 months) I kind forget the beginning sections. I rely too much on the the MERM for the answer and sometimes I couldn't get it afterward. From that time that I set up my study plan and study "smart" for my second try.
> 
> Second try - (I got my fail result by 1/25/2010 for the 1st try) so I give myself few days of refresh time and start study by 2/1/2010 for the sencond try. I know the time is less this time so I study day and night on everyday (even the weekend) until the exam day. I study the problems only on the MERM and skip the math, and end sections but I do study the electricty and economic. I highly recommand study before you sleep because when I sleep that I imaging my mind has a blackboard and I wrote down every important formulas and things to remeber on that imaging blackboard. (It helps me a lot because the next week or so I can still remeber the formula by heart)...I print all the important table on several sheet and write important formula regard to those tables there (I did for all three disciplines). I fully understand what I know on those sheet that I wrote. (because I was thinkng it is not point that you bring something that you don't familiar with). Most people will think that if I wrote down all formula in the sheet why don't I just rely on the MERM? My answer is no, because a lot of MERM formula looks very different but they actually the same..because of the converstion, different inputs or asking differently...it is a hard work to clear that and put all important foumula on the sheet...The power cycle that I study a lot with the graphs, effiecny (all different with motor,pumps,turbines,mechanical, and etc...some of them used in different position when you apply them and they are not always in one side when you do the calculation). The thermal and fluid is ok because I am study that everyday because my work....I also print out all those table with G,E,thermal expansion,poisson's ratio, yield strengths, etc on the same paper with important formula that will relate to each other. Also you need to know the important stuff that cause them can use relate to each other.(MERM won't tell you)...plus I book my flight and hotel a day before the exam so I don't need to be very rush to get to the exam site. I choose a different exam site because the one I had in Oct, 2009 is not very convience for me.
> 
> People are saying why you have to spent so many time on all 3 disciplines? I said it is because I did so bad on the first try on MD and HVAC. Also some of the sections that relate to each other. I study all 3 disciplines when I prepared my exam. I used MERM, MERM problems set, 2001 NCEES (3 disciplines), 2008 NCEES (3 disciplines), 6 mins solution (3 disciplines), Linderbrg samples (3 disciplines), "Kaplan samples (3 disciplines)--give me a lot of idea of study!!!becaue they have 1 problems all appear on the 3 afternoon disciplines and asking different stuff" and 101 ME problems. I didn't study the old samples because that is different than the real exam. Every question that I used heart and remeber everything with it and study beyond this problem that related to others.
> 
> I will have my exam result by Mid July, 2010 and by that time I will know my study method is right or need more improvment. I have a lot of small methods that I haven't list out yet because it might take another couple paragraphs.
> 
> It is hard to finish reading every sentance that I wrote but it is really my experience for this time or my last time.


I didn't pass the test but I am better than the first try.

My first try - 14/40 AM; 18/40 PM

2nd try - 31/40 AM; 13/40 PM

I am going to try harder for my 3rd try. ( I score higher in the AM because I only knew the easy problem so I have to study in depth and still study the same to keep my AM)


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## MechGuy

chaocl said:


> I didn't pass the test but I am better than the first try.My first try - 14/40 AM; 18/40 PM
> 
> 2nd try - 31/40 AM; 13/40 PM
> 
> I am going to try harder for my 3rd try. ( I score higher in the AM because I only knew the easy problem so I have to study in depth and still study the same to keep my AM)



Sorry dude. You'll get em next time.


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## gaidox

sorry to hear that chaocl...try to ace it next time. i know you can do it.

we will be here for you if you need some support.


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## chaocl

Thanks, I will continue study!


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