# Help on upcoming car purchase



## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

My wife and I are thinking about trading in our current car, a 2012 Lexus CT 200h, and purchasing a new one.

The primary reasons for getting the new car are:

1. With mini-Ram here it's not as comfortable in a smaller car. Quite often when we go out we pick up my parents, or hers, so it becomes at least 5 people. As you can imagine, in the current car, that's a tight fit. Also we do mini road trips a couple times a year (drive to NH, VT, OH) and it's a pain in the a$$ for everyone in a tiny car. We're looking for a non-minivan capable of seating 7.

2. My wife's military and often has to lug quite a bit of gear around. Again, with this in mind, we need more compartment space available.

We're currently thinking of either the 2016 Ford Explorer Limited or the 2016 Highlander. My preference is for the Ford. My wife's preference is the Highlander.

Have you had experience with either of these before? Which you would recommend and why? Any tips for getting the best deal from the dealership? Also, thinking about getting the all-weather mats from the dealer. Should I get it or just order the weathertech ones instead?


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## P-E (Jun 16, 2015)

I see. What you need is a pinzgauer. I hear you can pick one up on the cheap.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

If options 1 and 2 fall through I'll keep that in mind P-E.


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## P-E (Jun 16, 2015)

Given your choices I'd pick the highlander based on the name alone. "There can be only one"


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 16, 2015)

For negotiating a car purchase, you must negotiate all aspects of the purchase (purchase price, down payment, trade in, term, and interest rate) instead of only just the monthly payment. All too often the sales associate will only work on the monthly payment which can end up adversely affecting your total out of pocket expense and severely put you in the red for any potential "exit strategy" down the road if you need to get rid of it sooner than expected later. Know what your monthly limits are and negotiate the components individually to get there. Do not be afraid to walk away from a deal, even if you've been there for several hours. It's a game of attrition and they are counting on you to give up and just accept what they present.

Start with the down payment and trade in value. Know what you have available and what your car is worth. Do not budge from these numbers.

Then negotiate the purchase price of the car. Know what the MSRP is and what the dealer bought it for. It is not out of the question to have the dealership write off costs for options you don't want. You are compromising on accepting a car that is not outfitted the way you want, you should not have to pay for it.

Know your credit score and what that means to the bank. If the dealership does not offer you a good interest rate, look for other banks. Talk to your bank about pre-qualifying. Look at opening a dummy checking account with a credit union as they tend to offer the best rates to members.

Check the math on your monthly payments versus duration of the loan. Monthly payment may be only $50 difference between a 4yr and a 6yr loan, but the total out of pocket can be significantly higher if you take the term out too long.

Last but not least, test drive the car you intend to purchase. Do not accept a test drive of one and purchase a different one even if they are "similarly equipped". It's amazing how much just a few options will effect the feel of a car.


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## YMZ PE (Jun 16, 2015)

While minivans have an image problem, they really are the best option for transporting more than 4 people around. The third row in an SUV will always be tiny and a pain to get to to buckle in the little ones, and the storage is limited.

I gave in and got a Sienna a few months ago and it's been wonderful. It drives like a sedan, the kids love it and I constantly get compliments from coworkers that though their wives would never allow them to purchase a minivan, they love how it's so much roomier and utilitarian than their SUVs. YMMV since I prefer function over flashiness, and I own my identity as a soccer MILF.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

Thanks Dex. I won't be financing it through the dealer, it'll be through USAA. I'll see what the dealer offers but I seriously doubt they can beat what I have.

I've driven the 2015 Ford Explorer Limited and liked it. I'll be doing a test drive of the 2016 this weekend. I haven't driven the Highlander but will if we end up going that way.

YMZ, I have no problems with getting a minivan. It's actually my wife who's against it. I'm more interested in cost/function over appearances but haven't been able to argue her out of it.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 16, 2015)

To expand on the "game of attrition" aspect, beat them at their own game. End of the week/month tends to put more pressure on the sales team to meet quotas or goals, or the salesman may be trying to play "catchup" just for his own personal paycheck.

At the micro level, go into the dealership later in the afternoon (after 4-5pm). This can lead to a long work day for the salesman &amp; management as most who work the closing shift have already been there a few hours. They hope to leave when the dealership closes (typically 8-9pm), but if you push it even 30 min past that they can get very forgiving because they just want to go home.

Their big push will be the emotional side. They want you to love the car. If you fall in love with it, you start to get very forgiving on your end. It's why I was ok with a 9% interest rate when I purchased my Camaro (which I later re-fi'ed to under 5%)

(BTW, I used to work in a car dealership. I've learned their tricks.)


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

USAA is giving me under 3% which I doubt I'd get anywhere else.

Awesome advice on the timing though. I'll definitely have to keep it in mind. Unfortunately we'd like to get this done this weekend since we have an upcoming brake change on our current car. I was hoping to trade it in before I have to shell out $600 - 700 on getting the brakes done.


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## engineergurl (Jun 16, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> USAA is giving me under 3% which I doubt I'd get anywhere else.
> 
> Awesome advice on the timing though. I'll definitely have to keep it in mind. Unfortunately we'd like to get this done this weekend since we have an upcoming brake change on our current car. I was hoping to trade it in before I have to shell out $600 - 700 on getting the brakes done.




we got our Mazda at 0% for 36 months, which was better than what USAA offered... just saying, dealerships love military members.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

Whoa, I'll have to ask about that. If you don't mind, what was the rate after 36 months?


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## engineergurl (Jun 16, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> Whoa, I'll have to ask about that. If you don't mind, what was the rate after 36 months?




I don't know, we paid it off in 34 or 35 months... but I do think you had to pay back interest if it wasn't paid off by then...


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

Ahh drat. No way we're paying off a Ford in that time. I'll let you guys know what happens!


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## Lumber Jim (Jun 16, 2015)

I agree with everything Dex said except for writing off options that you don't want. All I could think of was going into a Chevy dealership and throwing a fit that they don't have EcoBoost engines and demanding a price reduction because of it.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 16, 2015)

I'm talking more like a sun roof or "upgraded" wheels with the argument in price. I doubt you can really argue much when you want a yellow car and end up buying red.


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## csb (Jun 16, 2015)




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## Ship Wreck PE (Jun 16, 2015)

Don't forget to be prepared for a high pressure salesman trying to sell you gap insurance, extended warranty, and life time oil changes. If you want it, fine, but don't let them talk you into a hundred bucks more a month on something you don't need.


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## mudpuppy (Jun 16, 2015)

Ship Wreck PE said:


> Don't forget to be prepared for a high pressure salesman trying to sell you gap insurance, extended warranty, and life time oil changes. If you want it, fine, but don't let them talk you into a hundred bucks more a month on something you don't need.




This is often the "business manager" and this is where they really make their money. When I refused all that crap the guy called me stupid... I almost walked away because of that, but didn't really want to give up the 0% for 6 years financing I was getting, and they were the only dealer within hundreds of miles that had the car I wanted.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 16, 2015)

0% for 6 years?! How'd you manage that?


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## mudpuppy (Jun 16, 2015)

It was a one week deal GM offered in 2006 when they were heading toward bankruptcy.


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## engineergurl (Jun 16, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> Ahh drat. No way we're paying off a Ford in that time. I'll let you guys know what happens!




not sure what meme would fit here, but ummm


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## YMZ PE (Jun 16, 2015)




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## ALBin517 (Jun 17, 2015)

If you are going with a Pinzgauer, go with the six-wheel version. Don't go halfway.


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Ram,

There is some good advice above. Remember Consumer Reports is your bible. Check their scores and recommendations for all vehicles in the segment you are interested in. Don't just go by initial cost of the vehicle. Go by 'cost of ownership' which includes fuel, insurance, maintenance/repairs, resale value, etc. Also, since you have a family, check the crash ratings. Lastly, in my humble opinion, I'd recommend something car-based, not truck-based, for comfort. Good luck.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

^^^ Most SUV's are car based anymore due to the comfort. Only truck based ones are the "full size" SUV's like Tahoe, Expedition, etc.


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## Ship Wreck PE (Jun 22, 2015)

My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.


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## engineergurl (Jun 22, 2015)

Ship Wreck PE said:


> My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.




excuse me?


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## Road Guy (Jun 22, 2015)

I really wish I had gotten a Toyota Sequoia with the second row of seats as captains chairs.￼


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## NJmike PE (Jun 22, 2015)

engineergurl said:


> Ship Wreck PE said:
> 
> 
> > My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.
> ...


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Ship Wreck PE said:


> My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.


I'd be very happy to challenge your truck with my Turbo Audi S4 or Supercharged Nissan Maxima on any drag strip or road course. 4 doors, mid-twenties MPG, over 300 HP, speed, handling, creature comforts such as heated leather seats. Oh, and did I mention two car seats in the rear?


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## engineergurl (Jun 22, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> Ship Wreck PE said:
> 
> 
> > My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.
> ...



but where do you put your deer meat?


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## Ship Wreck PE (Jun 22, 2015)

Let's hook up bumpers.


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

engineergurl said:


> ptatohed said:
> 
> 
> > Ship Wreck PE said:
> ...


I've never had to worry about that one. But on the occasions I do need a 'truck' (moving, Home Depot runs, etc.), I have a $300 4'x8' Harbor Freight trailer I hook up to my daily driver ('03 Acura TL).


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## NJmike PE (Jun 22, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> engineergurl said:
> 
> 
> > ptatohed said:
> ...


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> Ship Wreck PE said:
> 
> 
> > My truck is comfy. Cars are for girls.
> ...


300 hp, how cute.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 22, 2015)

Ended up going with the Ford Explorer Limited. Thanks for all the input everyone!


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> ptatohed said:
> 
> 
> > Ship Wreck PE said:
> ...


What HP is a good number to you?

Well, there may be plenty of cars that come from the factory with more HP (especially today), but I take pride in my "earned" 300 HP. Especially with the Maxima. With the S4, I haven't done as much. I added intake, a turbo-back exhaust, and a Stage 2 tune to the ECU. I haven't dyno'd him but 250 stock crank HP + about 75-100 for my mods = ~350 crank HP - drivetrain losses (6MT) =~300HP wheel HP. Actually, probably high 200s. But the Maxima, is a true dyno'd 318 WHP (and 307 WTQ, I believe). Which is pretty good considering my 4th generation Maxima came with only 190 crank HP (~150 WHP - 4AT). So, I have more than doubled his WHP.  Vortech supercharger, with 2.87" pulley, water-air aftercooler, headers, headers-back exhaust, lightened pulleys, etc. And I have done some serious weight reduction. I got him down to about 3,000lb. So it's a decent power-weight ratio.


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## knight1fox3 (Jun 22, 2015)

Do I also get to participate on said drag strip or road course?


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

knight1fox3 said:


> Do I also get to participate on said drag strip or road course?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


lol, NO! - you'd cream us. Dude, I commend you for your [email protected] kf. I am way too big of a pu$$y to get on one of those.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

2010 Camaro 2SS/RS.

6.2l V8, with intake, headers, ported throttle body, high-flow cats &amp; catback exhaust, dyno-tuned to 419 rwhp/419 tq. Assuming 20% losses, I'm at 525 at the crank. Once it's paid off I plan on putting a supercharger on it and upgrade camshaft, heads, and putting 3.91 rear gears in. I'd like to be in the 600rwhp range when done

Other mods include: ZL1 springs, toe rods, trailing arms, multiple bushing upgrades, sway bars &amp; endlinks, slotted/dimpled rotors, 6-piston brembo front caliper upgrade, strut tower brace. Then a bunch of cosmetic things &amp; upgraded stereo.

BTW, it's my daily driver.


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> 2010 Camaro 2SS/RS.
> 
> 6.2l V8, with intake, headers, ported throttle body, high-flow cats &amp; catback exhaust, dyno-tuned to 419 rwhp/419 tq. Assuming 20% losses, I'm at 525 at the crank. Once it's paid off I plan on putting a supercharger on it and upgrade camshaft, heads, and putting 3.91 rear gears in. I'd like to be in the 600rwhp range when done
> 
> ...


Very nice. Have you taken her to the track? Ironically (or is it just coincidentally?  ), a friend and I are taking my two cars to the track for the first time this upcoming Friday. Unfortunately it is only a 1/8 mile. But hoping for, say, 13's in the 1/4, I guess I should hope for high 8's/low 9's in the 1/8. I'd guess you're in the 12's in the 1/4?


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

At over 6000' in elevation, my best time at the 1/4 mile is a 14.1 @ 106 mph.

Using the NHRA altitude corrections for Denver, I'm would be at 13.26 @ 112 mph.

http://www.nhra.com/competition/altitude.aspx?AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1

Disclaimer: I've only taken it to the drag strip once, and only did 6 passes. At the time I was using near-bald all season tires, so I'm fairly certain the car can go faster.


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> At over 6000' in elevation, my best time at the 1/4 mile is a 14.1 @ 106 mph.
> 
> Using the NHRA altitude corrections for Denver, I'm would be at 13.26 @ 112 mph.
> 
> ...


Yikes, then maybe I'll be more in the 14s, or low-mid 9s in the 1/8. I was hoping for 13s though. I'm guessing the S4 will do better than the Max due to the AWD. We'll see...


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

The other issue is that I'm at close to 4000 lbs. It's a heavy bitch and reducing weight is difficult.


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## Supe (Jun 22, 2015)

I call winner! Road course, or drag strip! I'll even give you guys a 2 or 3 second head start... in the 1/8 mile... without the nitrous


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## Road Guy (Jun 22, 2015)

Let's do a real race, like say over Loveland Pass in late January.


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## ptatohed (Jun 22, 2015)

Road Guy said:


> Let's do a real race, like say over Loveland Pass in late January.


For pinks!


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 22, 2015)

Good thing I have all-season tires...


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 22, 2015)

Love the transformers logo on there Dex!


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## knight1fox3 (Jun 22, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> Love the transformers logo on there Dex!


You should see some of his other pics of the Bee at the Denver Comicon and the other Movie car group.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 23, 2015)

knight1fox3 said:


> Ramnares P.E. said:
> 
> 
> > Love the transformers logo on there Dex!
> ...




Put up a link!


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## Supe (Jun 23, 2015)

Road Guy said:


> Let's do a real race, like say over Loveland Pass in late January




I could put ice studs/screws in my tires and run tubes, I guess...


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 23, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> knight1fox3 said:
> 
> 
> > Ramnares P.E. said:
> ...


2013 Comic Con: http://s44.photobucket.com/user/dexman1349/library/Camaro%202010-08-21/2013%20Denver%20Comic%20Con

2014 Comic Con: http://s44.photobucket.com/user/dexman1349/library/Camaro%202010-08-21/Comiccon%202014

I didn't take Bee this year.

You can see I replaced the front bumper between shows. The new one is a custom one that has the mailslot from the SS inserted onto a ZL1 front end.

This pic from 2013 is my computer's desktop:


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 23, 2015)

The Colorado Movie Car club Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/ColoradoMovieCars


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 23, 2015)

Nice pics Dex! So why no Bee this year?


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jun 23, 2015)

We have a ton of different cars in the club (including 2 other Bee's) and a limited amount of floor space. I was only supposed to be there in 2013, but was a last minute fill-in for 2014. We used one of the other Bees this year. The part that makes it challenging is that we have to give up our car for the full weekend. Load the car into the convention center on Thursday evening, and pick it up Monday night (this year was over Memorial Day weekend, so was a day longer than usual).


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jun 23, 2015)

Ahh, that makes sense. Yeah that could get pretty inconvenient, especially on long weekends.

Thanks for the links though, awesome pics!


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## goodal (Jun 23, 2015)

We have a 2006 Highlander Hybrid 2wd and its ok...I guess. It sucks in the snow. In fact the whole hybrid thing has alot of weird aspects that annoy me. We will be needing something soon and will either get the gas guzzling Highlander or the new Explorer. They both look great, seat 7, are not a minivan and get good gas mileage. I'm leaning toward the Explorer due to looks alone. However, the Highland is known to be one of the longest lasting vehicles on the road. Mine is proof of that. It has 225,000 miles on it.


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## ptatohed (Jun 29, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> Dexman PE PMP said:
> 
> 
> > At over 6000' in elevation, my best time at the 1/4 mile is a 14.1 @ 106 mph.
> ...


Okay, so both my cars (the supercharged Maxima and the bi-turbo S4) ran 9.3's in the 1/8 last Friday night. I don't have the slips with me but I think the Maxima was around 80mph and the S4 was around 76mph.

Was hoping for better but there is always next time. 

Both cars were on 91 octane, full interior (minus easy-grab stuff like spare tires, etc.), and fully inflated street tires.

I drove the Maxima. I had a really hard time getting traction. If I hooked, I would get a 9.3 - 9.5. If not, I got a 10.x, sometimes 11.x  Even the 9.3 had room for improvement with traction.

My friend drove the S4. He was still getting familiar with an AWD stick shift. His best time of the night (9.3) was his very last run at midnight. So, I think the S4 is capable of a little better too.

Overall, lots of fun.


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## MetsFan (Jul 1, 2015)

Dex, so your keeping Bee after all? Great pics btw!


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 2, 2015)

MetsFan said:


> Dex, so your keeping Bee after all? Great pics btw!


This close to it being paid off and not overly thrilled with the Gen 6 Camaro, I think I'll keep it for a while. Either pick up a commuter car or upgrade Mrs Dex's SUV once Bee is paid off.

I'm really liking these: Mercedes GLA45 AMG

http://www.autoguide.com/manufacturer/mercedes-benz/2015-mercedesbenz-gla-45-amg-review-4149.html


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## Supe (Jul 8, 2015)

AMG SUV?


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## MetsFan (Jul 8, 2015)

I'm going to put that on my list of cars to test drive. I hate the "tablet" trend in these new cars though. Did they forget about it during the design process and just stick it on at the end?


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## matt267 PE (Jul 8, 2015)

MetsFan said:


> ...I hate the "tablet" trend in these new cars though....




My wife's car has touch screen controls. You can't see shit when it's sunny out and bright in the car. I'm very happy with the dials and buttons in my 2005 Corolla.


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## Road Guy (Jul 8, 2015)

I miss the pull knobs on my 79 CJ-----


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## snickerd3 (Jul 8, 2015)

MetsFan said:


> I'm going to put that on my list of cars to test drive. I hate the "tablet" trend in these new cars though. Did they forget about it during the design process and just stick it on at the end?


yeah i don't get this trend...technically Illinois is a handsfree state, no texting or talking directly with a phone so how is a tablet screen in the car any different. you are distracted for several seconds to change screens to get to the controls you want


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 8, 2015)

I will admit that's the one big thing I don't like about it. I agree that it completely looks like they forgot about the controls during design and just scabbed something on. Now if it was simply a docking station and could take it with me on the train for the rest of my commute...


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 8, 2015)

Supe said:


> AMG SUV?


For a size comparison, it's slightly bigger than a Subaru XV


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## Road Guy (Jul 8, 2015)

^-- basically a station wagon


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Jul 8, 2015)

Roomy, with a nice cross breeze. Brakes need new shoes.


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## csb (Jul 8, 2015)

That's the same design on the Mazda and I also don't like it. I think it gets it up to a better viewpoint for quick glances at maps, but it looks awful. And I'm sure there's some SHRP study that shows the optimum height for navigation systems.

The 2015 Subaru Legacy has heated rear seats. Winter nooners no longer require sacrifice on the part of the bottom!


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 8, 2015)

Road Guy said:


> ^-- basically a station wagon


That's all-wheel drive and runs quarter-mile times comparable to my Camaro


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## Krakosky (Jul 8, 2015)

I have a BMW X1 that I bought in March that I love. It's my first "fast car". It doesn't have touch screen controls, but rather a large knob in the center console that controls everything on the screen. Also, 28 mpg combined.


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## MetsFan (Jul 8, 2015)

Krakosky said:


> I have a BMW X1 that I bought in March that I love. It's my first "fast car". It doesn't have touch screen controls, but rather a large knob in the center console that controls everything on the screen. Also, 28 mpg combined.




Just be careful when it's out of warranty. Those bimmer repairs get really expensive.


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## Krakosky (Jul 8, 2015)

Yeah I paid for the "everything's covered for 100k miles" because I have a 110 mile commute. It is nice that they also include all oil changes and maintenance up to 50k miles.


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## jeb6294 (Jul 9, 2015)

My Ford Explorer had the MyTouch and the fancy-pants touchscreen, but once you got moving it would disable itself and you had to do everything with the buttons on the steering wheel or by voice commands. I'm surprised that's not how it is on all cars.


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jul 9, 2015)

jeb6294 said:


> My Ford Explorer had the MyTouch and the fancy-pants touchscreen, but once you got moving it would disable itself and you had to do everything with the buttons on the steering wheel or by voice commands. I'm surprised that's not how it is on all cars.




That's the same on my Lexus. The phone keypad /gps will work when stationary but once you get over 2-3 mph it won't allow any input.


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## MetsFan (Jul 9, 2015)

The only thing my Touareg disables is the video in motion. Otherwise, it just pops up a warning about inputting an address while driving. Having it disable completely would be annoying since you can have a passenger doing the work.


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## knight1fox3 (Jul 9, 2015)

Ramnares P.E. said:


> jeb6294 said:
> 
> 
> > My Ford Explorer had the MyTouch and the fancy-pants touchscreen, but once you got moving it would disable itself and you had to do everything with the buttons on the steering wheel or by voice commands. I'm surprised that's not how it is on all cars.
> ...


Same on our Infinity FX-35.


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## Supe (Jul 9, 2015)

I wired the "park indicator" wire on my truck's DVD player to ground. Voila... video while driving. I don't watch, but will put on movies for junior when she rides in the truck since its a standard cab.


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## SNAPE/SMOTT PE (Jul 9, 2015)

Ken 3.0 said:


> Roomy, with a nice cross breeze. Brakes need new shoes.


My current vehicle isn't much better than this. But it's paid for and ok as a daily driver.


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## jeb6294 (Jul 10, 2015)

MetsFan said:


> The only thing my Touareg disables is the video in motion. Otherwise, it just pops up a warning about inputting an address while driving. Having it disable completely would be annoying since you can have a passenger doing the work.




GPS stuff was pretty easy to do with the voice commands. It would be annoying not being able to have a passenger punch stuff in, but as long as people are going to be that stupid then I'd say that's the price everybody pays until they can come up with a way to limit use to a non-driving person.


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## ptatohed (Jul 10, 2015)

My '03 TL does not restrict Navi input to a stationary position only. Still works great. Last update DVD made by Acura was 2013 so, for now, it's fairly current.

My aftermarket Kenwood double-din DVD/nav in my '99 Maxima works while moving too but only because I wired it as such. The instructions say to ground it to the e-brake (so it only works when the e-brake is pulled). I grounded it to the chassis. Last update disk I could buy is 2008. My house was built in '05 so at least it shows up.

The OEM navi on my '01.5 S4 works while the car is in motion but it is the most primitive nav dinosaur you'll ever see. No touchscreen, it's all done by buttons and knobs and joystick in the center console. Monochrome. No map/graphics, it's all 100% text-based (with a few symbols like right/left arrows). Small screen in the gauge cluster between the tachometer and speedometer. Entry is painstakingly tedious. I still have the '01 disk - so my neighborhood isn't even in there.


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## knight1fox3 (Jul 10, 2015)

^ how much do those update disks run you? I found they are quite pricey for the Infiniti variety.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 10, 2015)

None of my cars have navigation. I just use my phone.


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## ptatohed (Jul 10, 2015)

knight1fox3 said:


> ^ how much do those update disks run you? I found they are quite pricey for the Infinity variety.


This can be very true. The reason I have the latest Acura disk is because they were selling it for $100 shipped (the last generation of my TL was '03, Acura supports updates for 10 years after the last model year, Acura discounted the last year disk).

The reason I have the last update disk (2008) for my (2005) aftermarket Kenwood DVD/Nav unit is because *cough* *cough* &lt;I might have used a torrent site to get it&gt; *cough* *cough*. These sell for close to $300.

The reason I have never updated the S4 is because it costs several hundred (and would only get me to like 2003, and the system is a dino).

Have you tried ebay?


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## ptatohed (Jul 10, 2015)

knight1fox3 said:


> ^ how much do those update disks run you? I found they are quite pricey for the Infinity variety.


Infiniti.


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## knight1fox3 (Jul 10, 2015)

^ auto-correct.


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## NJmike PE (Jul 10, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> knight1fox3 said:
> 
> 
> > ^ how much do those update disks run you? I found they are quite pricey for the Infinity variety.
> ...


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## Ramnares P.E. (Jul 10, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> knight1fox3 said:
> 
> 
> > ^ how much do those update disks run you? I found they are quite pricey for the Infinity variety.
> ...


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## jeb6294 (Jul 13, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> None of my cars have navigation. I just use my phone.




^That. I thought it was borderline criminal when they put a navigation system in my car and then wanted me to pay to make it work right. Ford was really bad about updates with the MySync system because it controlled everything so it wasn't just navigation updates. It was kind of neat to hit the button and ask the car to tell you where the cheapest gas was and have a list show up on the screen, but now that I have my plain ol' truck I can do the same thing with my phone. Google Maps works just as well as the Explorer's ever did plus it takes traffic into account and I know it'll always be up-to-date. One of these days I may upgrade the stereo to something with CarPlay once Apple gets that sorted out a little more.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 17, 2015)

Test drove the Mercedes this week. I really like how it drives. The "base" GLA250 is definitely spirited enough to be a fun daily driver without dropping the $60k they want for the AMG version.


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## MetsFan (Jul 17, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> Test drove the Mercedes this week. I really like how it drives. The "base" GLA250 is definitely spirited enough to be a fun daily driver without dropping the $60k they want for the AMG version.




I'm going to put that on the list of cars to check out too. I would love the AMG, but that is too much cash for a daily driver.


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## csb (Jul 17, 2015)

This makes me curious- what price do you guys consider reasonable for a car?


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 17, 2015)

http://www.mercedesoflittleton.com/2015-Mercedes-Benz-GLA-Class-GLA250-Base-4MATIC-I4-2.0-L-603684146

^^ This is the one Mrs Dex liked, although I think I prefer the blue \/

http://www.mercedesoflittleton.com/2015-Mercedes-Benz-GLA-Class-GLA250-Base-4MATIC-Intercooled-Turbo-Premium-Unleaded-I-4-2.0-L121-611918311


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## csb (Jul 17, 2015)

OMG I found my van http://www.mercedesoflittleton.com/2010-Mercedes-Benz-Sprinter-2500-High-Roof-V6-3.0L-589018800


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## csb (Jul 17, 2015)

Can someone lend me $61,000?


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## MetsFan (Jul 17, 2015)

csb said:


> This makes me curious- what price do you guys consider reasonable for a car?




I think reasonable is relative just like what we consider to be rich. I don't really want to spend more than 25K on my next car since it will just be used to go to and from work, but we spent almost twice that on our Touareg.

Dex, that would be a tough choice for me. I really like the blue, but I would like it to be more of a navy color.


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## MetsFan (Jul 17, 2015)

Hurry! Price mistake!

http://www.mercedesoflittleton.com/2015-Mercedes-Benz-GLA-Class-GLA250-Base-4MATIC-Intercooled-Turbo-Premium-Unleaded-I-4-2.0-L121-611918312

Or maybe they will ask you to send cash through Western Union


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 17, 2015)

I don't like dark colors on cars because they are hard to keep clean/looking good. Grey is the exception. I'm ok with the grey, it's actually the only other color that is available that I like.

As far as how much is considered reasonable, it depends. If it's something I plan on keeping for a while and that I expect to be durable, then I don't mind dropping $40k. But if it's just a beater simply just to get to/from somewhere, then I won't spend as much.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 17, 2015)

MetsFan said:


> Hurry! Price mistake!
> 
> http://www.mercedesoflittleton.com/2015-Mercedes-Benz-GLA-Class-GLA250-Base-4MATIC-Intercooled-Turbo-Premium-Unleaded-I-4-2.0-L121-611918312
> 
> Or maybe they will ask you to send cash through Western Union


I saw that one on the lot. It's a dark purple and is actually really cool looking (assuming it's kept clean)


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## MetsFan (Jul 17, 2015)

Dexman PE PMP said:


> *I don't like dark colors on cars because they are hard to keep clean/looking good. Grey is the exception. I'm ok with the grey, it's actually the only other color that is available that I like.*
> 
> As far as how much is considered reasonable, it depends. If it's something I plan on keeping for a while and that I expect to be durable, then I don't mind dropping $40k. But if it's just a beater simply just to get to/from somewhere, then I won't spend as much.




That is true. Our Touareg is grey and I asked my wife yesterday if she had washed it since it looked clean. Nope, that's just what it looks like. My black bimmer on the other hand looks like crap.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 17, 2015)

I will never purchase a black car. Unless it's $5.

The black stripes on Bee is the most black paint I've had on a car since I was in highschool.


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## Road Guy (Jul 17, 2015)

I had a white car once I think that is the absolute worst it never looks clean.


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## MetsFan (Jul 17, 2015)

I love a clean, black car though. It's just so difficult to keep up with.


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## engineergurl (Jul 17, 2015)

csb said:


> This makes me curious- what price do you guys consider reasonable for a car?




That depends on a few factors but since we have been car shopping for almost a year, I'll speak up. It depends on how long you expect it to last and what you intend to use it for. Right now we have two paid off vehicles that we don't plan on trading in because although they are getting older, they are still holding up. We do know that they won't last forever and want to get something before one of them dies.

We have a 2010 Mazda 6 that was purchased in 2009 that we paid $21,000 for brand spanking new.

We have a 2002 Jeep Grand Cherokee that was purchased in 2011 that we paid $10,000 for with 100,000 miles on it.

We have considered several options but we hope to get a fuel efficient beater car for about $4000 to last a few years and then a larger towing capable vehicle and have looked at several ranging in price from $17,000 to $40,000 (we would trade in the mazda for this if needed). the Cherokee now has 200,000 miles on it and will never die, so it was well worth the money spent on it and we intend to keep it for quite a while.

We don't look at cars as a status symbol or for fun. Each car we have ever purchased has had a purpose and when we looked at buying we had goals such as how long the car needed to last, how much cash we had to put down on it and how long we really wanted to pay on it for.


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## YMZ PE (Jul 19, 2015)

engineergurl said:


> We don't look at cars as a status symbol or for fun. Each car we have ever purchased has had a purpose and when we looked at buying we had goals such as how long the car needed to last, how much cash we had to put down on it and how long we really wanted to pay on it for.




This. We also consider our commute, because the more time we spend in a car stuck in traffic, the more enjoyable a ride we'd want it to be.


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## SNAPE/SMOTT PE (Jul 19, 2015)

YMZ PE said:


> engineergurl said:
> 
> 
> > We don't look at cars as a status symbol or for fun. Each car we have ever purchased has had a purpose and when we looked at buying we had goals such as how long the car needed to last, how much cash we had to put down on it and how long we really wanted to pay on it for.
> ...


Same here, both our cars are 10 years old and paid for. Envoy was bought used, and is the kid car. My crappy Pontiac G6 was bought new, got into a wreck at 6 months from purchase and was never the same (I'll always say it should have been totaled, but they didn't agree...probably because I had gap insurance). At first I loved the look of my G6, and the panoramic sun roof. Now it's the beater daily driver...gets good gas mileage.

We keep fixing what's wrong when things break, but I know at some point one of our vehicles will break down and it will cost more to repair than it's worth. That's when we'll go car shopping. For now, I'm loving no car notes. Now if I can get the house paid off.


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## csb (Jul 20, 2015)

May 2024 is when the house is paid off.

I suppose in August I'll go drive some cars and see what I like. I have no idea on cost. I'm leaning towards used, because I hate the idea of a giant car loan.


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## knight1fox3 (Jul 20, 2015)

csb said:


> I'm leaning towards used, because I hate the idea of a giant car loan.


+1000

I'll never buy new unless I run out of ways to spend my fatty retirement $$. Besides, &lt; 20k miles is still considered "new" in my book. And the total cost is reduced drastically.


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## ptatohed (Jul 20, 2015)

knight1fox3 said:


> csb said:
> 
> 
> > I'm leaning towards used, because I hate the idea of a giant car loan.
> ...


I'm 40 and have never had a new car in my life.  But, on the bright side.... I've never had a car payment in my life.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 20, 2015)

Went to the Mercedes dealership on Saturday. Mrs Dex really liked the GLA250 (not the AMG), so we started talking numbers with the sales guy. After about 20 minutes we just walked out because their offer was pure garbage. Bunch of douche bags.


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## P-E (Jul 20, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> knight1fox3 said:
> 
> 
> > csb said:
> ...


Trying to decide between new or used for my next car or truck. My current car I bought new in 98. I tend to hold on to cars until they require major repair so I don't mind buying new.


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## mudpuppy (Jul 21, 2015)

I bought my Aveo new in 2006 for $14k. I hope to have it for at least 14 years, to keep the capital cost at about $1k per year. Five more years to go.

I bought my '97 Jeep 3 years ago for $4k, so I'm already almost to the same point on that.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 30, 2015)

Here's a good option for a daily driver here in CO:

http://www.centennialchryslerjeeponline.com/new/Chrysler/2015-Chrysler-200-Denver-cc53146e0a0a0065132dc64c2ab39cd8.htm


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## MetsFan (Jul 31, 2015)

I really like the styling on the new 200's. I don't think I'd get one though.

I told my wife about going to take a look at the new GTI's and she said the only condition she has on a new car is that it has to be automatic. So much for my dreams of pretending to be a race car driver on my way to work, lol.


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