# CA Licensure Application - Reference Clarification



## skc005 (Jun 16, 2017)

Hi there,

I passed the 8 hour this past April, and the CA board has made a one time exemption to allow new applicants to submit their applications for October to the re-file deadline of July 10th. Great news for me, cause I thought I'd have to wait until next April to take the Seismic and Surveying exams.

Anyhow, I'm filling out the reference forms and I want to make sure I'm understanding what the instructions are referring to as "engagements" and "date overlaps". I have worked for one company for the last 2.5 years. As I understand it, an "engagement" is simply my company. So for all four of my references, they will be listed as "engagement 1" since it's my present company. Additionally, there is instruction to "explain overlaps in dates". If I understand correctly, this only applies to engagements that overlap in dates, i.e you were somehow working for two companies at once? As far as filling out the "from and to" for qualifying experience, those dates can overlap with my other references, correct? Right now, I have listed:

- Ref 1: 1/5/15 to 6/30/17 - 29 months

- Ref 2: 1/5/15 to 6/30/17 - 29 months

- Ref 3: 10/5/16 to 6/30/17 - 8 months

- Ref 4: 12/5/15 to 6/30/17 - 18 months

Is this the appropriate way to fill this out?

Thanks.


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## leggo PE (Jun 16, 2017)

Hi @skc005! I think you are understanding everything correctly.

Yes, an engagement is a position at a company for which you worked. I believe overlapping would be referring to working for more than one company simultaneously, also. And lastly, yes, dates from supervisors can overlap. I had two references that overlapped on my application; in fact, they had the exact same dates like your references 1 &amp; 2. I think the BPELGS understands that staff level employees may work for more than one project manager at once.

Good luck come October!


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## ptatohed (Jun 17, 2017)

It's probably best to consult @CAPLS on this because I see it differently than you guys.  I don't think overlapping means working for two companies at once.  I think overlapping is what skc is showing for his Ref 1 and 2.  I think you can have references overlap so skc will get credit for 2 references but he will only get credit for one 29 month period.  Hopefully CAPLS can help.


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## CAPLS (Jun 19, 2017)

skc005 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I passed the 8 hour this past April, and the CA board has made a one time exemption to allow new applicants to submit their applications for October to the re-file deadline of July 10th. Great news for me, cause I thought I'd have to wait until next April to take the Seismic and Surveying exams.
> 
> ...


What you have described here is one way that will work.  Ref. 2-4 will not receive any additional work experience credit since those dates are all encompassed within the overall dates in Ref. 1.  Overlaps are referring to two different engagements that have conflicting dates/places of employment or work experience that overlaps with dates under education credit.


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## skc005 (Jun 19, 2017)

CAPLS said:


> What you have described here is one way that will work.  Ref. 2-4 will not receive any additional work experience credit since those dates are all encompassed within the overall dates in Ref. 1.  Overlaps are referring to two different engagements that have conflicting dates/places of employment or work experience that overlaps with dates under education credit.


Thanks for the input. If that's the case, if they deem reference 1 is appropriate for 29 months but deem that the experience from other references don't qualify, will they still approve my application?


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## CAPLS (Jun 19, 2017)

skc005 said:


> Thanks for the input. If that's the case, if they deem reference 1 is appropriate for 29 months but deem that the experience from other references don't qualify, will they still approve my application?


If you have a Board-approved BS degree (ABET) in the discipline you are seeking licensure for and you are claiming that degree for work experience credit, then you need to provide evidence of a minimum of 24 months of experience in the discipline for which you are seeking licensure, performed under an appropriately licensed person.  It doesn't matter which part of the submitted experience is used to qualify as long as a minimum 24 months is accounted for.  In your described case, if 24 months of the submitted 29 months is deemed qualifying "&lt;discipline&gt; engineering" experience, the other 3 engagements will serve as the remaining required 3 references.


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## skc005 (Jun 19, 2017)

CAPLS said:


> If you have a Board-approved BS degree (ABET) in the discipline you are seeking licensure for and you are claiming that degree for work experience credit, then you need to provide evidence of a minimum of 24 months of experience in the discipline for which you are seeking licensure, performed under an appropriately licensed person.  It doesn't matter which part of the submitted experience is used to qualify as long as a minimum 24 months is accounted for.  In your described case, if 24 months of the submitted 29 months is deemed qualifying "&lt;discipline&gt; engineering" experience, the other 3 engagements will serve as the remaining required 3 references.


Good to know, thanks!


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## Gorgoroth (Jun 29, 2017)

I only had 2 "engagements" on my application. One for each of my employers.  My application was accepted.


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## Guest (Aug 23, 2017)

.


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## CAPLS (Aug 30, 2017)

Gorgoroth said:


> I only had 2 "engagements" on my application. One for each of my employers.  My application was accepted.


Then you must of submitted two additional engagement/reference forms claiming no additional time so you met the requirement for 4 references.


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## CAPLS (Aug 30, 2017)

fireguy_PE said:


> Each company you work for is an engagement, but so is each position level to which you might be promoted. For example, suppose you start with your company as "Engineer I" and are promoted to "Engineer II" and both of those are part of your qualifying experience. You now have two engagements even though you only have one employer. Each engagement requires a minimum of one reference.


Yes, that works


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## Bakheat (Sep 3, 2017)

Have you received the authorization notice? I have same situation like you but didn't reicive any emails from board, please update


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## Engineer7 (Dec 8, 2018)

I passed the PE Exam in CA. I am now working on the Application.

I've only worked as an engineer in one utility my entire career (42 months) so all four of my engagements will be designated with 1. For each four of my references I will add different projects, ﻿but is it ok if the Engineering Tasks and Duties are copied and pasted on each form? Or should I try to put a variety of projects with different tasks to show versatility? It will still be one engagement though right?

I see the PE's I am referencing every day, and they see the kind of work I do.

Should I put all of them as continuous?

Engagement 1 From 6/15 to 12/18 42 months Manager

Engagement 1 From 6/15 to 12/18 42 months Coworker

Engagement 1 From 6/15 to 12/18 42 months Senior Engineer/Coworker﻿

Engagement 1 From 6/15 to 12/18 42 months Indirect Supervisor

﻿  

﻿ Also it looks like there is only room to enter two lines worth of projects. Is it enough to just put two projects for each reference?﻿﻿﻿


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## PE Aspirant (Dec 14, 2018)

About the references. I am currently working for third company after my graduation. I was unable to get references from my first company, however I am getting 2 references from company 2 and another 2 references from company 3. Please let me know if I put them correctly?

Engagement 2 reference 1 &amp;2

Engagement 3 reference 3&amp;4 ?


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