# California PE vs TE?



## deltron (Dec 23, 2015)

There is a California-specific traffic PE separate from the civil PE. I've noticed that some people with traffic PEs use the term "TE" after their name instead of PE. Is that the industry standard?


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## ptatohed (Dec 24, 2015)

deltron said:


> There is a California-specific traffic PE separate from the civil PE. I've noticed that some people with traffic PEs use the term "TE" after their name instead of PE. Is that the industry standard?


I've always been a little confused on this.  I really thought that you first needed a PE to even apply for the TE.  But if you look at the TE application, it appears as if it is just as involved as the PE application and it seems you could apply to sit for the TE exam without first being a PE.  ?  I know several TEs and they were all PEs first.  The exclusive benefits of the TE are very limited and a PE license gives you all or at least almost all of the authorities that a TE gives you.  Unless you want to be a City Traffic Engineer or sign off on engineering speed studies, the TE won't provide you with too much benefit over a PE.  What are you looking to do?

http://www.bpelsg.ca.gov/pubs/forms/trapp.pdf


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## deltron (Dec 24, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> I've always been a little confused on this.  I really thought that you first needed a PE to even apply for the TE.  But if you look at the TE application, it appears as if it is just as involved as the PE application and it seems you could apply to sit for the TE exam without first being a PE.  ?  I know several TEs and they were all PEs first.  The exclusive benefits of the TE are very limited and a PE license gives you all or at least almost all of the authorities that a TE gives you.  Unless you want to be a City Traffic Engineer or sign off on engineering speed studies, the TE won't provide you with too much benefit over a PE.  What are you looking to do?
> 
> http://www.bpelsg.ca.gov/pubs/forms/trapp.pdf


I have just passed the TE exam actually, and I do not have my civil PE yet. The requirements for the TE are looser than for the PE, in fact you do not even need other professional engineers as references. This was useful for me because my two years of qualifying experience were largely as an engineer in a transportation planning firm with almost no PEs. You're right that the TE basically doesn't grant any authority as it is a "Title" rather than a "Practice" license (like the civil PE). It's main usefulness is for the reasons you mentioned, plus marketing reasons like the PTOE. Why the Board does this, I have zero idea.

I have since moved to a city agency as a civil project engineer to work on getting my civil PE. Until then, I guess I'll use the "TE" title.

My ultimate goal is to return to planning with TE and PE licensure, because I find that much more interesting than vanilla civil/traffic work.


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## ptatohed (Dec 24, 2015)

deltron said:


> I have just passed the TE exam actually, and I do not have my civil PE yet. The requirements for the TE are looser than for the PE, in fact you do not even need other professional engineers as references. This was useful for me because my two years of qualifying experience were largely as an engineer in a transportation planning firm with almost no PEs. You're right that the TE basically doesn't grant any authority as it is a "Title" rather than a "Practice" license (like the civil PE). It's main usefulness is for the reasons you mentioned, plus marketing reasons like the PTOE. Why the Board does this, I have zero idea.
> 
> I have since moved to a city agency as a civil project engineer to work on getting my civil PE. Until then, I guess I'll use the "TE" title.
> 
> My ultimate goal is to return to planning with TE and PE licensure, because I find that much more interesting than vanilla civil/traffic work.


Thanks for the reply.  So, now I know that you can pass the TE without first being a PE.  I did not know that.  But I am confused about what you said regarding professional references not being needed.  In the application (linked in post # 2 above), it seems to clearly ask for references.  Right?

_ALL THE NAMES OF YOUR REFERENCES MUST BE LISTED ON THIS PAGE. For California work, each engagement claimed as qualifying experience MUST have a reference from a licensed California Professional Engineer in responsible charge licensed in the discipline for which you are applying, unless exempt from licensure. _


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## deltron (Dec 28, 2015)

ptatohed said:


> Thanks for the reply.  So, now I know that you can pass the TE without first being a PE.  I did not know that.  But I am confused about what you said regarding professional references not being needed.  In the application (linked in post # 2 above), it seems to clearly ask for references.  Right?
> 
> _ALL THE NAMES OF YOUR REFERENCES MUST BE LISTED ON THIS PAGE. For California work, each engagement claimed as qualifying experience MUST have a reference from a licensed California Professional Engineer in responsible charge licensed in the discipline for which you are applying, unless exempt from licensure. _


I was just as confused, until I read the "Engagement Record and Reference Form for PE Application (Excluding Civil)" which states:

_Individuals who are applying for licensure in any of the other disciplines of engineering may submit references from anyone who is technically qualified to appraise your skills as an engineer._

Since a traffic PE is not required to practice traffic engineering per the "title act" vs "practice act" provision, anyone with traffic engineering experience as described above is qualified to be a reference, regardless of PE status. I contacted the Board for clarification when applying and they confirmed this interpretation to be true.

See this link: http://www.bpelsg.ca.gov/applicants/pe_errf_instructions_2010.pdf


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## trailgal (Dec 17, 2016)

Thanks for the info Deltron. Were you required to pass the EIT prior to taking the TE exam?


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## CAPLS (Dec 19, 2016)

trailgal said:


> Thanks for the info Deltron. Were you required to pass the EIT prior to taking the TE exam?


All applicants for licensure as a PE in California are required to first pass the FE exam and obtain the EIT certificate unless you meet the criteria for waiving the FE exam under Board Rule 438 http://www.bpelsg.ca.gov/laws/boardrules.pdf

This applies to all PE licenses including Traffic Engineer.


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## ptatohed (Dec 25, 2016)

CAPLS said:


> All applicants for licensure as a PE in California are required to first pass the FE exam and obtain the EIT certificate unless you meet the criteria for waiving the FE exam under Board Rule 438 http://www.bpelsg.ca.gov/laws/boardrules.pdf
> 
> This applies to all PE licenses including Traffic Engineer.


This is what I thought but is in direct conflict with what deltron said.  He said he has his TE but not his PE.


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