# Structural Engineering Exams



## SE-III (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi All,

I am a practicing structural engineer primarily working in power sector. I will have 3 years of experience in March 2009. I have a BSc Civil Engg. from a Foreign university and MSc from a US university. I have a PE License that I got this year. I intend to take SE exams for MLSE License in October 2009.

I have read thoroughly all the requirements on NCEES website. I understand that among other requirements I need 3 years of structural engineering related work experience. I need to enroll in NCEES Records Program. I have following questions:

1) Is it advisable to enroll in the NCEES Records Program before my 3 years of experience is completed? or should I wait till March 2009?

2) As I understand, being an MLSE will improve my quality as a structural engineer and other than that I will be able to practice as a structural engineer in some jurisdictions where it is required to practice Structural Engineering (except for CA, IL etc.). Are there anyother benefits that I may get? How about salary increase? How important do you become after getting SE license?

3) What does it mean by "Engagement" for NCEES Records Program application? For Example, as I have been working in this firm for almost 2.5 years now and my level of responsibility has been more or less the same (promoted from Engineer II to current Engineer III level). So, I would consider it as one engagement. And I have worked with different supervisors during this time, so for references any five of them should qualify as references for my application ??

4) Do you think that my current position as Engineer III will reduce the chances for acceptance of my application for MLSE? Moreover, out of 2.5 years for about 4 months I have worked on site design and storm drainage system design. I do not think if I have been in a responsible charge on any of the assignments I did. How will that impact my application? What does it mean by responsible charge anyway?

5) How much fee is associated with NCEES MLSE exam? Can I take SE I and SE II in one shot? What are the chances that I will clear both exams in one go? Can I apply for and take just SE I? And once I pass that I take SE II later.

6) I wonder how many PEs and MLSEs are there in US?

I will greatly appreciate if you can answer all or some of these questions.

Thanks.


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## Bigwolf (Oct 8, 2008)

The answer to most of you questions will depend on what state you choose to test in.

1. If you enroll in the records program prior having three years of experience, then you will need to verify the 3 years of experience on the exam application. In addition, check out NCEES to see if the specific state allows all parts of the record for the application. There are some states that won't accept the references, etc. Each state is different. Also, in California for example, they want 3 S.E.'s on the application so if your NCEES record has Civil Engineers as references, it will not be accepted for the S.E. application.

2. This will depend on your job and the current economic conditions. I think at this point a lot of us would be lucky to keep our jobs---asking for a raise may be a bit much these days...but again, depends on your situation.

3. I've worked at the same firm for 5 years, so when I filled out my record, I only had 1 engagement. I just spilled my guts and told them everything I've done at my place of employment and then I had the 5 references sign off for it.

4. I don't know much about the Engineer II/III rating, but be careful about applying for the structural exams without the full structural experience. Again, in California for example, they require 3 years of structural experience after you get the civil license. If the full 3 years does not consist of structural work, they will not accept the application....so be sure to check the verbage at your state.

5. The fees will vary depending on the state you take the exam in. People have passed both exams in 1 shot, but it sounds kind of rare.

6. I have no idea since there is no national registration, you would have to check each state for this kind of information.


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## kevo_55 (Oct 8, 2008)

I've "upgraded" my NCEES record to MLSE. So, if you have any more questions please feel free to post them.

Basically, the MLSE doesn't do too much unless you are transmitting your record to an SE state. Even then, a MLSE "upgrade" isn't required. It will only speed the proccess along.

From my personal experience, my IL SE seal got approved in just under 2 months with a MLSE. That in itself was worth it.


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## SE-III (Oct 9, 2008)

kevo_55 said:


> I've "upgraded" my NCEES record to MLSE. So, if you have any more questions please feel free to post them.
> Basically, the MLSE doesn't do too much unless you are transmitting your record to an SE state. Even then, a MLSE "upgrade" isn't required. It will only speed the proccess along.
> 
> From my personal experience, my IL SE seal got approved in just under 2 months with a MLSE. That in itself was worth it.



Can I be a MLSE by applying directly to NCEES, without applying through a State (such as IL, HI etc.)? Currently, I am in NJ and SE is not required here.

OR

Is it absolutely necessary to first file the application with a state and once you become an SE in that state, you transmit your record to MLSE?

I was thinking of creating NCEES Record first, then, initiate the NCEES SE evaluation process and, then, take the SE I and SE II together in one shot. After that I thought of applying to the state where I needed to get a SE license.

NCEES website doesn't give complete information regarding the entire SE licensing process. Its very unfortunate. Its only these forums that one can get a good idea about it. If you can direct me to any other links with more detailed information, I will greatly appreciate.

And how can we Bookmark the messages here on this forum for later review?


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## kevo_55 (Oct 9, 2008)

^^ The MLSE has nothing to do if you are a registered SE in a state or not. It simply says that you meet the NCEES model law for being an SE. This is not the same as meeting the NCEES model law to be a PE. There are several additional items that you must do for MLSE.

The first step is to get your NCEES record. The 2nd step is to take the SEI and SEII. Currently only one state allows for you to take them in one shot. That state is IL. If you would like to take the SEI and SEII in NJ, then you will have to take them seperately. This might actually be a better thing to do depending on how well you can take exams.

With a "standard" NCEES record which records that you've passed the SEI and SEII, there is very little reason to get the MLSE "upgrade." I personally got it because the MLSE rules are for the most part the IL SE board's rules. It made it very easy for me to get that license.

As for saving this thread, I think you can do it by looking at your controls up at the top of the screen.

I hope this helps!


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## ARLORD (Oct 9, 2008)

kevo_55 said:


> ^^ The MLSE has nothing to do if you are a registered SE in a state or not. It simply says that you meet the NCEES model law for being an SE. This is not the same as meeting the NCEES model law to be a PE. There are several additional items that you must do for MLSE.
> The first step is to get your NCEES record. The 2nd step is to take the SEI and SEII. Currently only one state allows for you to take them in one shot. That state is IL. If you would like to take the SEI and SEII in NJ, then you will have to take them seperately. This might actually be a better thing to do depending on how well you can take exams.
> 
> With a "standard" NCEES record which records that you've passed the SEI and SEII, there is very little reason to get the MLSE "upgrade." I personally got it because the MLSE rules are for the most part the IL SE board's rules. It made it very easy for me to get that license.
> ...




kevo_55

I am not in IL, but I also plan to get licensed as a SE in IL via reciprocity through another state. Why do you imply that applying to IL with the MLSE "upgrade" is easier than without it. I would expect the process to take 2-3 months without it. Am I missing something.


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## SE-III (Oct 9, 2008)

kevo_55 said:


> ^^ The MLSE has nothing to do if you are a registered SE in a state or not. It simply says that you meet the NCEES model law for being an SE. This is not the same as meeting the NCEES model law to be a PE. There are several additional items that you must do for MLSE.
> The first step is to get your NCEES record. The 2nd step is to take the SEI and SEII. Currently only one state allows for you to take them in one shot. That state is IL. If you would like to take the SEI and SEII in NJ, then you will have to take them seperately. This might actually be a better thing to do depending on how well you can take exams.
> 
> With a "standard" NCEES record which records that you've passed the SEI and SEII, there is very little reason to get the MLSE "upgrade." I personally got it because the MLSE rules are for the most part the IL SE board's rules. It made it very easy for me to get that license.
> ...


Thanks for very helpful information ...

I read through all IL SE board rules, can you please confirm the following issues that I do not completely understand...

1) For a Non SE Intern, the board requires a total of 4 years of experience (out which only a minimum of 2 years has to be SE experience with responsible charge).

2) VE-SEG (Verification of Employment/Experience) needs to be filled out by a supervisor. Unlike NCEES Record or PE applications (e.g. for CA), IL SE board does not require 4 or 5 references from all of the supervisors that one might have worked with.

3) Other than $100 application fee, what is the fee for SE I &amp; SE II ($350 &amp; $800 respectively?)

If you feel comfortable, please answer the question that how much experience did you have when you applied for IL SE. Was it borderline? What kind of work had you been doing?

Thanks.


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## kevo_55 (Oct 9, 2008)

ARLORD said:


> kevo_55
> I am not in IL, but I also plan to get licensed as a SE in IL via reciprocity through another state. Why do you imply that applying to IL with the MLSE "upgrade" is easier than without it. I would expect the process to take 2-3 months without it. Am I missing something.


ARLORD,

An IL:SE license requires 18 semester credits in structural analysis and structural design. The requirement for MLSE is the exact same for this. By not having an MLSE you'll have to have the IL SE board look at your college transcripts and decide if you meet this or not.

My boss applied for an IL:SE. The board concluded that he didn't have enough college classes to fulfill this requirement. He ended up needing 6 months of additional engineering experience. The total amount of time ended up being 8 full months.

I got my IL:SE license in 2 months. It made for less headache.

In any case, a MLSE can only help for reciprocity. For $50 extra, I believe for me it is a deal.


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## kevo_55 (Oct 9, 2008)

SE-III said:


> Thanks for very helpful information ...
> I read through all IL SE board rules, can you please confirm the following issues that I do not completely understand...
> 
> 1) For a Non SE Intern, the board requires a total of 4 years of experience (out which only a minimum of 2 years has to be SE experience with responsible charge).
> ...


SE-III,

1. How much total experience do you have? If you have 2 years of SE experience (design of wood, steel, concrete, &amp; masonry) then you'll be ok in order to take the exam. Otherwise, you might need more.

2. You are correct. You need a VE-SEG filled out for each of your employers. If you've only worked for one company, then you'll only need one.

3. I'm not sure for the fee for the SEI or SEII in IL. I know that they do not use the ELSES (like most other states). You might have to make a call or continue to ask around.

I hope this helps!


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## SE-III (Oct 9, 2008)

Kevo_55,

I will have 3 years of SE experience by March 2009. I have SE experience in Steel, Concrete and Masonry but not in Wood/Aluminum/light weight metal structures, however I have learned wood design on my own. Do you think that not having experience in wood design will hurt?

Thanks,

SE-III.


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## kevo_55 (Oct 9, 2008)

^^ Nah, you should be just fine.

lusone:


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## IowaPE (Jan 21, 2009)

kevo_55 said:


> My boss applied for an IL:SE. The board concluded that he didn't have enough college classes to fulfill this requirement. He ended up needing 6 months of additional engineering experience. The total amount of time ended up being 8 full months.


kevo,

I passed the SEI exam several years ago and am taking the SEII this spring in hopes of getting my IL:SE. I, like your boss, will be short on the required 18 semester credits in structural analysis and design (3 hours by my count). A few questions for you:

- How many acceptable credits did your boss have when he was required to gain the additional 6 months experience?

- How much structural experience did your boss have when he applied and was required to gain the additional 6 months experience?

I have 9 years of structural experience (5 years pre-PE, 4 years w/ PE), and was wondering how I compared to your boss so I might get a feeling for what the IL board might require of me.

Not sure if you'll know this information, but thought I'd ask.

Thanks.

EDIT: I just noticed that you're a fellow ISU grad and Chi Epsilon member (via your LinkedIn profile)!! In fact, we both got our BSCE the same year (2000). I'm having trouble putting a face with the name though. GO CYCLONES!


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## IlliniASU (Jan 21, 2009)

Random side note: yay for XE!


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## rdbse (Jan 21, 2009)

I am not sure if the MLSE does anything.... well in my case anyway.

I applied for my IL SE license at the same time I applied for my NCEES record. I recieved my IL license first, so the MLSE did not come into play.

The certificate from NCEES in general, and does not indicate MLSE designation. You might think they would give you something based on there advertisments in trade magazines.


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