# Post Zimmerman trial riots?



## Capt Worley PE (Jul 9, 2013)

> After an all-white jury acquitted a Miami cop in the death of Arthur McDuffie in 1980, the city exploded in a burning, three-mile-wide riot that lasted three days, caused $100 million in damage, resulted in 18 deaths, and inspired curfews and gunpoint checks by the National Guard.
> 
> In the coming weeks, a mostly white jurywill decide whether to acquit George Zimmerman of second degree murder charges in the controversial shooting death of Miami Gardens teen Trayvon Martin.
> 
> Local police and community leaders are already cautioning against any actions that could escalate to violence or destruction, even turning to social media and Miami Heat stars for help.




Much more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/03/george-zimmerman-verdict_n_3540499.html

So, will there be riots? To what extent?


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## snickerd3 (Jul 9, 2013)

i think there will be some form of rioting whatever the results end up being.


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## YMZ PE (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm guessing kids and wives will be hid.


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## YMZ PE (Jul 9, 2013)

BTW, Capt reads Huff Post? What the hey?


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## MA_PE (Jul 9, 2013)

given the demographics in Miami, I think riots are inevitable. Some folks just like won-ton revelry, vandalism and destruction of property. They use anything as an excuse to incite it and act it out...."win" or "lose" it doesn't matter.


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## Road Guy (Jul 9, 2013)

I agree its gonna be ugly either way...


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## csb (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm getting a new TV!


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## Road Guy (Jul 9, 2013)

Is it truly an all white jury or is it a Cuban-american jury?

I thought Zimmerman was Cuban/American?


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## Dark Knight (Jul 9, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> I agree its gonna be ugly either way...




Agree. Sanford, where the trial is happening, is not far from where I live. I warned my wife about this one week ago. Today, at work, we had a safety call to talk about this too. Sadly there are outsiders, call it Black Panthers or White Supremacists, that will take advantage of whatever happens to do their thing. I am very concerned about one of my sons at UCF. He is taking a summer class and most likely will be out when the verdict comes out. Hope nothing happens but right now this is very stressful.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jul 9, 2013)

I think the media will incite riots after the verdict...especially if it's a slow news day.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 10, 2013)

I was working in Central GA when the Rodney King Riots broke out, and was amused that rioting broke out in da ATL a few days after it was over in LA.


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## Road Guy (Jul 10, 2013)

I was in downtown Atlanta *Georgia DOT office* during part of the rodney king riots, i rode home with a guy who laid a 44 magnum on his dashboard to drive through atlanta. there was lots of vehicle damages to other cars..it was a scary situation...

later that day our guard unit was activated to work the riots, we never went into the city but stayed on the outskirts of the city in case we were needed..they actually handed out ammunition it was thought to be that bad..

i was always glad we just stayed on the back of the truck for 2 days and then went home.. that could have gotten ugly..


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## Exception Collection (Jul 10, 2013)

I hope there won't be riots, but i wouldn't bet on it. That said, I don't expect them to be as bad as the Rodney King riots - The Rodney King situation was one where the perception was that blatantly racist cops attacked someone and were effectively protected by the establishment and by an all-white jury. Zimmerman's case there's enough leeway in what happened that there's more room for reasonable doubt.

I will say I think he should probably be convicted of manslaughter, but not murder. Had he not been armed and following Trayvon while disregarding the instructions of the dispatch person (officer?), Trayvon would not have felt the need to confront him for his threatening behavior. (And yes, following someone around is generally considered threatening behavior). The prosecutor overcharged, and did not charge lesser charges as a backup. This assumes he didn't commit a felony by threatening Trayvon through his behavior; if he did, than murder 2 is possible but unlikely to get a conviction.

It's almost as if the prosecutor is throwing the case. And that is why I expect riots.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 11, 2013)

Exception Collection said:


> The prosecutor overcharged, and did not charge lesser charges as a backup. This assumes he didn't commit a felony by threatening Trayvon through his behavior; if he did, than murder 2 is possible but unlikely to get a conviction.
> 
> It's almost as if the prosecutor is throwing the case. And that is why I expect riots.




Looks like they are trying to change that...

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/11/19415120-judge-to-consider-lesser-charges-for-george-zimmerman?lite&amp;ocid=msnhp&amp;pos=1



> The Florida judge in George Zimmerman’s second-degree murder trial will decide Thursday whether she will allow the jury to consider lesser charges – manslaughter and aggravated assault – when they begin deliberations on Friday.


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## EM_PS (Jul 13, 2013)

the whole trial is F'd up - 6 jurors instead of 12, and all of them women?! This thing has all the lead-in to a mistrial as it is....


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## Road Guy (Jul 13, 2013)

Please tell me they are not all white women?


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## maryannette (Jul 13, 2013)

I think it is 5 white women and 1 other woman.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jul 13, 2013)

What happened to a "jury of your peers"?


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## MA_PE (Jul 14, 2013)

Baed on the news I heard....only small "riots" and they were in San Francisco. Go figure


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## Road Guy (Jul 14, 2013)

Has Obama weighed in yet?


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## IlPadrino (Jul 14, 2013)

EM_PS said:


> the whole trial is F'd up - 6 jurors instead of 12, and all of them women?! This thing has all the lead-in to a mistrial as it is....




Florida's statute 913.10 "Number of jurors.—Twelve persons shall constitute a jury to try all capital cases, and six persons shall constitute a jury to try all other criminal cases." Rewarding the all women aspect, read -florida-shooting-jurors-20130713,0,599177.story"&gt;http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/sns-rt-us- USA -florida-shooting-jurors-20130713,0,599177.story for a description.

Your response is full of emotion. We've got to stop appealing to the "emotion of the crowd" and rather leverage the "wisdom of the crowd".


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## IlPadrino (Jul 14, 2013)

wilheldp_PE said:


> What happened to a "jury of your peers"?




Do you know the source of this? Hint: it is NOT in the Constitution.

Do you know what is meant by "peer"? Hint: It is NOT someone just like you.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 14, 2013)

^^^ damn HOA regulations...


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## wilheldp_PE (Jul 14, 2013)

IlPadrino said:


> wilheldp_PE said:
> 
> 
> > What happened to a "jury of your peers"?
> ...








> Peer: one that is of equal standing with another *:* equal; _especially_ *:* one belonging to the same societal group especially based on age, grade, or status




If those women were not in Zimmerman's same societal group, age, etc, then they are NOT his peers by any definition, I don't care what the source of "a jury of your peers" is.

I've always said, "if I am guilty of a crime, I want a jury trial, but if I'm innocent, I want a bench trial." Juries are stupid. Even if you've been on one, as a collective, they are stupid. You can convince at least 1 or 2 people on a jury that up is actually down. And those people will at least make things a pain in the ass for the rest of the jury or cause a hung jury. But if I want the facts to speak, I'll leave it up to a judge and keep the idiots out of the decision.


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## Road Guy (Jul 15, 2013)

Where are all the white women!


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> Has Obama weighed in yet?








> "The death of Trayvon Martin was a tragedy. Not just for his family, or for any one community, but for America. I know this case has elicited strong passions. And in the wake of the verdict, I know those passions may be running even higher. But we are a nation of laws, and a jury has spoken. I now ask every American to respect the call for calm reflection from two parents who lost their young son. And as we do, we should ask ourselves if we’re doing all we can to widen the circle of compassion and understanding in our own communities. We should ask ourselves if we’re doing all we can to stem the tide of gun violence that claims too many lives across this country on a daily basis. We should ask ourselves, as individuals and as a society, how we can prevent future tragedies like this. As citizens, that’s a job for all of us. That’s the way to honor Trayvon Martin."


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## Road Guy (Jul 15, 2013)

Wow basically the president is saying that the jury was wrong.

Or maybe if Zimmerman didn't have a gun he would be dead instead of Trayvon.?


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## goodal (Jul 15, 2013)

What a wise and insightful leader we have.


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## mizzoueng (Jul 15, 2013)

The riots are still going on and the violence is increasing. LA is a massive hotbed and businesses and vehicles have been looted and damaged. Rioters threw things at the police. How exactly is this making things better? This doesn't exactly help the cause of changing minds about the lower/middle class black community when violence is the first resort when things don't go the way they want it.

The media didn't help in this case either, the whoe thing was spun out of control and built up such a fever that no one was level headed when it was over. The digital age and need for instant information and decisions is ridiculous when it comes to these trials. Everyone is now guilty, and even when proven innocent, is still guilty.

I do not agree with the Stand Your Ground law, and I do think that Zimmermann should have been convicted of at least assault as he could have just walked away.

What I am most disappointed in is that these types of deaths occur every day in America. last year there were 113 homicides where I live, of those maybe half a dozen were "sensationalized" by media since they involved kids or affluent white neighborhoods. The others were either small lines on the paper or not reported at all. No riots took place, no social media campaigns were started, and CNN/Fox/MSNBC didn't give a rats a$$ that that an 8yo was shot in the face because he was on his grandmothers front porch.

if we want to change the issue, maybe we should start with respecting all human lives and not just the ones that were ended by one of another color.


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## Dark Knight (Jul 15, 2013)

I hope the Martins sue the HOA and that this opens a Pandora Box. This happened because the HOA thought that the city police was not good enough for them and they needed wannabees, like GZ, to patrol the neighborhood.

Regardless of what happened, I was not there so cannot favor one side or the other, the HOA is responsible before my eyes. I think it is time that someone put a stop to these abusive, authoritarian, and arbitrary organizations. They have way to much power.


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## snickerd3 (Jul 15, 2013)

I don't see this thing as over yet. The civil cases of wrongful death or other non criminal type lawsuits are sure to start.


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## mizzoueng (Jul 15, 2013)

Snick, how can there be a wrongful death case if he was acquitted of any wrong doing in the death of Martin? I agree with DK that the next step is going to be against the HOA or a legal battle to redefine the SYG law. The SYG law is the primary problem, it allows people to walk into dangerous situations when all logical sense tells you to walk away from danger.


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## snickerd3 (Jul 15, 2013)

Criminal court yes, but there are lots of civil court suing type stuff that can happen...from the various legal pundits out there I was hearing on the radio this weekend


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

mizzoueng said:


> Snick, how can there be a wrongful death case if he was acquitted of any wrong doing in the death of Martin?




Level of proof is lower. 'Preponderance of the evidence' rather than 'beyond a reasonable doubt.'


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## mizzoueng (Jul 15, 2013)

Capt Worley PE said:


> mizzoueng said:
> 
> 
> > Snick, how can there be a wrongful death case if he was acquitted of any wrong doing in the death of Martin?
> ...




Same evidence could be used both ways. As Zimmermann said he was assaulted, he should be able to counter-sue.


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## EM_PS (Jul 15, 2013)

He was aquitted of criminal charges - civil suits will definitely be filed, just like w/ OJ! 

Dude's definitely gonna be financially drained, even if he sees no time behind bars.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

mizzoueng said:


> I do think that Zimmermann should have been convicted of at least assault as he could have just walked away.




1) He did nothing legally wrong by not walking away. This is America. You can walk where you like, no matter how unwise it is.

2) It isn't assault if it is self defense. The jury decided it was self defense.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

mizzoueng said:


> Capt Worley PE said:
> 
> 
> > mizzoueng said:
> ...


He can indeed.

I doubt he will.


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## EM_PS (Jul 15, 2013)

Sue a dead kid?! :lmao:


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

EM_PS said:


> Sue a dead kid?! :lmao:




technically, you'd sue the estate, but there isn't really much point, is there?


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## csb (Jul 15, 2013)

(insert awful, too soon Skittles assets joke here)


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## Dexman PE PMP (Jul 15, 2013)

Capt Worley PE said:


> mizzoueng said:
> 
> 
> > I do think that Zimmermann should have been convicted of at least assault as he could have just walked away.
> ...


But is it self defense if you verbally harrass someone to the point they physically respond?


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

Dexman PE said:


> Capt Worley PE said:
> 
> 
> > mizzoueng said:
> ...


Yep, believe it or not.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

csb said:


> (insert awful, too soon Skittles assets joke here)




Or...


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## snickerd3 (Jul 15, 2013)

skittles need to take the new green apple flavor out and put lime back in the bag...it totally over powers all the other flavors


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)

All joking aside, the truly sad thing about this is that it all could have been avoided if either or both parties had acted like responsible adults instead of playing a game of 'Quien es mas macho?'

One life gone, many lives ruined because they were both 'too much of a man' to back down.


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## EM_PS (Jul 15, 2013)

Capt Worley PE said:


> EM_PS said:
> 
> 
> > Sue a dead kid?! :lmao:
> ...




Yeah it seems this happened in Chicago, where some poor chump (college kid) tried to cut across the tracks at one of the train stations, got predictably splattered by a train, and some bystanders got injured by flying severed limbs, and thence they sued his estate for recompense or something.

Wow. just wow.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 15, 2013)




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## IlPadrino (Jul 15, 2013)

wilheldp_PE said:


> Peer: one that is of equal standing with another *:* equal; _especially_ *:* one belonging to the same societal group especially based on age, grade, or status
> 
> If those women were not in Zimmerman's same societal group, age, etc, then they are NOT his peers by any definition, I don't care what the source of "a jury of your peers" is.
> 
> I've always said, "if I am guilty of a crime, I want a jury trial, but if I'm innocent, I want a bench trial." Juries are stupid. Even if you've been on one, as a collective, they are stupid. You can convince at least 1 or 2 people on a jury that up is actually down. And those people will at least make things a pain in the ass for the rest of the jury or cause a hung jury. But if I want the facts to speak, I'll leave it up to a judge and keep the idiots out of the decision.




What you want and what you're entitled to are two very different things.


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## Road Guy (Jul 16, 2013)

I asked one of our attorneys and basically in legal language (not webster) a jury of your peers are the registered voters whom reside in the court district where the case is administered, nothing else matters.....


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## Capt Worley PE (Jul 16, 2013)

The Nuge weighs in.....http://rare.us/story/nugent-zimmerman-verdict-vindicates-citizen-patrols-self-defense/


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