# Career burnout



## fmullner

I have finally admitted to myself that I am burnt out with my current career. I don't hate it. It just doesn't get me out of bed in the morning like it used to. The job itself is OK, the pay is good, there's advancement potential, etc. In fact, all those things that usually make you say "screw this place" are absent from this job, but I'm still not all that happy. In fact, I'm bored out of my skull. I'm also fully aware that going out and "doing something else" is easier said than done.

I know I'm not the only one out there who's been in this spot before, so any advice would be appreciated. How do you learn to love what you do again?


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## Guest

I heard a very wise person once say that you have to balance your work and away-from-work 'happiness' in order to really evaluate your happiness on the job. In other words, sometimes we accept the hum-drum job in order to enhance our away-from-work activities.

For me, I am at the same point of boredom with my job for slightly different reasons. I LIKE my chosen profession, so will be seeking alternate employment soon. Once I finish my M.S. degre ..  Not to mention that I do not make enough $$ to support the things I would like to do away-from-work.

I suggest introspection as to what is important in your life. Once you find the balances between work and away-from-work activities, you can not only have a better perspective of YOUR situation but also make more informed decisions for what you might do to change your perspective.

Good luck!

JR


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## niffur

let me guess - you recently crossed the 7-8 year mark of the working life. i think it happens to everybody - that period of time where you just aren't excited like you used to be, but you recognize you have it pretty good.


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## Polysloman

fmullner said:


> I have finally admitted to myself that I am burnt out with my current career. I d In fact, I'm bored out of my skull. I'm also fully aware that going out and "doing something else" is easier said than done.


You need more hobbies; expensives ones. buy a set of hybrid ping golf clubs get your game strong. Start recruiting clients, try doing business development. Mentor &amp; tutor at your H.S in engineering &amp; sports.

Give to more charities, volunteer anywhere: Contribute to wiki P.E. notes, help others on this board with THE exam

"A job is nothing but work" It's a mean to get &amp; do what you really want


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## bigray76

fmullner,

I don't care for my job... I don't mind the work, but I'd love to be doing something else (don't know exactly what)... however, my job pays the mortgage plus, it allows me to live in a nice house, raise a nice family, buy things we need, and enjoy a few hobbies. My goal is to get home from work every night and see my kids and wife. I'll never love what I do, but I love what it allows me to do.

Like Polyslo says, take up a hobbie - we all need a place to vent and destress - golf, fishing, fencing, volunteering, etc. It is a healthy thing to do.

Ray


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## fmullner

Hey all, thanks for the advice.

Niffur--I will have 10 years in my career in June. You pretty much nailed it.

I have to say that this wasn't really the advice I was expecting which makes it all the more interesting. The funny thing is that I've always had a hard time being good to myself, so acting on the advice may be easier said than done.

Thanks again.


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## chavez

I've been feeling it too....happens to me around December / January every year though...


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## C-Dog

I decided to get my PE and took the FE and PE in one year. That kept my mind occupied at work. I also got more involved in local town politics, as a watchdog, not a politician. That is how I did it.


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## Dleg

I think everyone "burns out" in their job eventually. Like everyone else said, concentrate on making the most of your life outside of work first. If there's something about your job that prevents you from doing that, such as long hours or being on call all the time, then I could consider looking for something different, perhaps even for less pay. Like government work!

Once you've made sure you've given yourself enough time to get your personal life up and running, then the best thing I have found to spark itnerest in your job is to set a goal. Like passing the PE exam, or earning someother certificaiton, or just learning something new.

But, like others above, I find that I can put up with quite a bit of BS as long as I am enjoying my life away from work, and have enough time to enjoy it.


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## Dark Knight

Do you think a professional burn out is bad? Wait until you feel the same about your personal life. I mean, feeling that you are on quick sand, that no matter how hard you try things never change and, as a matter of fact you go deeper. That sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Vishal

^ +1 on that. At times, things just don't go your way, no matter what you do. In fact, they keep on spiraling down even with good intentioned efforts!! I am not enjoying life at work as such. I am just in my 5th year og my career and the beginning of this year has been very very damp for me. i hope i collect myself soon and get back to full force. however, i want to just take off for a week or two and do nothing. just relax, i think the vacation is overdue now.. !! will save this thot for some other time.. till then let's just get back to work


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## csb

I've hit this wall too...at the five year mark. Failing the PE was just enough to push me to really wonder, "Do I even want to be an engineer?"

I have no advice...just that I'm at this point too...it pays the bills, but it's getting harder to get here every morning.


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## Brody

One possiblility is to make certain you don't spend long hours at work and don't take the job home with you.


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## NCcarguy

I can honestly say that I've been through that about 10 times in my career. heck I still don't know if this is what I want to do when I grow up!!! I will say, to those of you that feel this way after failing the exam.....that's normal! I can say that mainly because I failed the damn exam so many times, but that feeling usually passes. What you need to do is commit yourself to passing the test, no matter what else, if you get this behind you, then that's done! Then you may be able to re-evaluate where you are with your chosen path. Those that are just feeling this way....take a look at what REALLY is making you feel this way. I doubt it's the career, but it could be what you're doing, or who you're doing it with, or for....I've been stuck in a corner spot just doing red-lines before and I HATED that job...now I spend all day on the phone some days dealing with ill developers.....and I LOVE it! everything that has to be done in this business isn't done by everyone, so there are MANY different ways to make money....and LOTS of it!

So take a look at what you REALLY want to do, and start working in that direction. If the opportunity isn't there where you currently work, look for another job, and be honest when you interview as to where you want to work toward......

Most importantly though......ALWAYS KEEP A GOOD ATTITUDE!!!!! I can't say enough how just CHOOSING to have a good attitude every morning will make a tremendous amount of difference in your life......try it!


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## ODB_PE

NCcarguy said:


> Most importantly though......ALWAYS KEEP A GOOD ATTITUDE!!!!! I can't say enough how just CHOOSING to have a good attitude every morning will make a tremendous amount of difference in your life......try it!


Though this is difficult to do, this is probably the best advice I have seen. When you start off the day pissed off, it can only get worse. I do this to myself way too much.

In my case It has always been "it will be better after this is done" - I have been on the fast track - 7 years ago I was 10 years removed from an engineering program I basically failed out of the first time. In the last 4.5 years, I managed to father 2 children, finish my BS, MS, get 3.5 years of experience and my PE, all while maintaining a family and 2 small children (and being able to keep my Saint of a wife at home the whole time) - each step along the way I told myself it would be easier when in fact is has somehow gotten harder and more miserable.

The hobbies and friends thing is important too - I have been so wrecked the last few years it seems I have abandoned all of it. Talk about depressing!

Just wanted to vent as well as add to the "you are not alone" sentiment.


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## Capt Worley PE

I've always been a big saver. That helps a lot when you get fed up and just quit. I've done that before after 6.5 years with the feds. Hated the job, hated where I lived, but I had the bank to quit and move. One of the smartest moves I ever made, over all.


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## Dleg

There are plenty of opportunities for "career changes" that don't require stopping being an engineer, which is where your degree and experience is best suited. If you've really hit a wall, that can be good for you. But you may have to start out again in an entry level position. I've done that three times now - started in the oilfield, got tired of having no life, moved into A&amp;E work (total entry level), and then moved into government, where I;ve been relatively happy ever since, but paid poorly compared to private sector engineers.


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## Wolverine

Get a book called Pathfinder, by Lore. It's all about deciding what it is you really want to do based on what you're good at, and then resolving to _*be there *_ in 5 years or 10 years or whatever it takes. Don't live in comfortable misery - have the guts to risk it all, even if you fail.

Some good inspirational stories right up there ^^^. In seven more years, what will you be saying to yourself? What do you *want *to be saying? I want to be where NC is, loving the job, with great attitude. Good stuff.


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## RIP - VTEnviro

chavez said:


> I've been feeling it too....happens to me around December / January every year though...


I've kinda been in a rut lately and I'm wondering if that whole winter depression thing has something to do with it. I haven't seen much of my wife in the last month so that is probably messing with me too.

I don't wake up in the morning dreading anything, but a lot of times lately I've just been rundown with the daily grind, feeling like I should be doing more, and worrying a lot about stuff. I'm kinda sluggish and have a hard time pumping myself up to do stuff I normally love to do.


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## Dark Knight

Wolverine said:


> Get a book called Pathfinder, by Lore. It's all about deciding what it is you really want to do based on what you're good at, and then resolving to _*be there *_ in 5 years or 10 years or whatever it takes. Don't live in comfortable misery - have the guts to risk it all, even if you fail.
> Some good inspirational stories right up there ^^^. In seven more years, what will you be saying to yourself? What do you *want *to be saying? I want to be where NC is, loving the job, with great attitude. Good stuff.


Thanks for this post Wolverine. I am showing it to my wife. This is how we are living now. In a comfortable misery. She does not want to risk moving out of here even when I showed her we would be better somewhere else.

But women, at least most of them, think primary with their heart. Their emotions get the best of them. My best reasonings and talks have not been enough to make my wife think about moving from a place that is beautiful...ok....but has us living on a check by check basis. For a couple that is going to celebrate their 20th year together I think that is ridiculous. Maybe I should be a bad husband and impose my will no matter what.


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## maryannette

I've been there, too. And for what it's worth, BIO, we've been married over 27 years and there are still times that we live week to week. Kid in college and trying to provide everything to everybody. I know it will be better sometime, but if I knew I would never have a good life (not just defined by money) because of _where _I am, I'd consider moving. I've had 2 horrible times in my career, both because of horrible managers. Each in his own way made my life miserable. There were days that I hated going to work, but friends, co-workers, and a supportive husband got me through. One of the best "tricks" I ever used was to sing or hum "Zip-a-dee-Do-Da" softly or in my head. I had to realize that I was in control of my attitude. I could choose to be happy, or I could be miserable.

Juggling

Imagine life is a game in which you are juggling five balls. The balls are called work, family, health, friends and integrity. And you're keeping all of them in the air. But one day you finally come to understand that work is a rubber ball. If you drop it, it will bounce back.

The other four balls--family, health, friends, integrity--are made of glass. If you drop one of these, it will be irrevocably scuffed, nicked, perhaps even shattered. And once you truly understand the lesson of the five balls, you will have the beginnings of balance in your life.

James Patterson


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## Dark Knight

maryannette said:


> Juggling
> Imagine life is a game in which you are juggling five balls. The balls are called work, family, health, friends and integrity. And you're keeping all of them in the air. But one day you finally come to understand that work is a rubber ball. If you drop it, it will bounce back.
> 
> The other four balls--family, health, friends, integrity--are made of glass. If you drop one of these, it will be irrevocably scuffed, nicked, perhaps even shattered. And once you truly understand the lesson of the five balls, you will have the beginnings of balance in your life.
> 
> James Patterson


That is deeeeeeeeep

Thanks Mary


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## Capt Worley PE

I like the juggling story. Quite true.


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## RIP - VTEnviro

> I've been there, too. And for what it's worth, BIO, we've been married over 27 years


I've barely been alive over 27 years. I'm still a newlywed. Interesting to think where we will be in 27 years.

I love the juggling story mary!


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## Vishal

I remembered this story from what Mary said. May be some of us have read it, but I like to read it often... Here it goes.

One day, an old professor of the School of Public Management in France, was invited to lecture on the topic of “Efficient Time Management” in front of a group of 15 executive managers representing the largest, most successful companies in America. The lecture was one in a series of 5 lectures conducted in one day, and the old professor was given 1 hr to lecture.

Standing in front of this group of elite managers, who were willing to write down every word that would come out of the famous professor’s mouth, the professor slowly met eyes with each manager, one by one, and finally said, “we are going to conduct an experiment”.

From under the table that stood between the professor and the listeners, the professor pulled out a big glass jar and gently placed it in front of him. Next, he pulled out from under the table a bag of stones, each the size of a tennis ball, and placed the stones one by one in the jar. He did so until there was no room to add another stone in the jar. Lifting his gaze to the managers, the professor asked, “Is the jar full?” The managers replied, “Yes”.

The professor paused for a moment, and replied, “Really?”

Once again, he reached under the table and pulled out a bag full of pebbles. Carefully, the professor poured the pebbles in and slightly rattled the jar, allowing the pebbles to slip through the larger stones, until they settled at the bottom. Again, the professor lifted his gaze to his audience and asked, “Is the jar full?”

At this point, the managers began to understand his intentions. One replied, “apparently not!”

“Correct”, replied the old professor, now pulling out a bag of sand from under the table. Cautiously, the professor poured the sand into the jar. The sand filled up the spaces between the stones and the pebbles.

Yet again, the professor asked, “Is the jar full?”

Without hesitation, the entire group of students replied in unison, “NO!”

“Correct”, replied the professor. And as was expected by the students, the professor reached for the pitcher of water that was on the table, and poured water in the jar until it was absolutely full. The professor now lifted his gaze once again and asked, “What great truth can we surmise from this experiment?”

With his thoughts on the lecture topic, one manager quickly replied, “We learn that as full as our schedules may appear, if we only increase our effort, it is always possible to add more meetings and tasks.”

“No”, replied the professor. The great truth that we can conclude from this experiment is:

*If we don’t put all the larger stones in the jar first, we will never be able to fit all of them later.*

The auditorium fell silent, as every manager processed the significance of the professor’s words in their entirety.

The old professor continued, “What are the large stones in your life? Health? Family? Friends? Your goals? Doing what you love? Fighting for a Cause? Taking time for yourself?”

*What we must remember is that it is most important to include the lager stones in our lives, because if we don’t do so, we are likely to miss out on life altogether. If we give priority to the smaller things in life (pebbles &amp; sand), our lives will be filled up with less important things, leaving little or no time for the things in our lives that are most important to us.* Because of this, never forget to ask yourself,

What are the Large Stones in your Life?

And once you identify them, be sure to put them first in your “Jar of Life”.

With a warm wave of his hand, the professor bid farewell to the managers, and slowly walked out of the room.

Take care of the large stones first - the things that REALLY matter. Set your priorities. The rest are just pebbles and sand. If you put the sand or the pebbles into the jar first, there will be no room left for the stones.

The same goes for your life. If you spend all your energy and time on the small stuff, you will never have room for things that are truly most important.

Pay attention to the things that are critical in your life. Take time to play with your children. Take your partner out for dinner. Take time to have a chat with your loved ones. There will always be time to go to work, clean the house and give a dinner party.

Sometimes the less important things in life can distract us, filling up our time and keeping us away from what really matters. I encourage you to take a moment and ask yourself, is your jar of life full of sand &amp; pebbles or is it filled with large stones?


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## maryannette

VTEnviro said:


> I've barely been alive over 27 years.


OH!!! I think I just felt old.

No, it's gone. I'm young.


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## C-Dog

maryannette said:


> OH!!! I think I just felt old.
> No, it's gone. I'm young.


What are you talking about? Your like one of the Sesame Street Monsters. You look the same now as you did in 1970. You forgot you are a puppet!


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## maryannette

C-Dog said:


> What are you talking about? Your like one of the Sesame Street Monsters. You look the same now as you did in 1970. You forgot you are a puppet!


Oh, yeah!!! Marionettes don't get older. Maybe I can still decide what I want to be when I grow up.


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## mr. smee

I too am at a point where I am feeling burned out professionally. I've been working since 2001; first as a military civil engineer and now for a local government (county). I can't believe that I've been in the professional workforce for seven years! Anyway, I have failed to get excited about work over six months now...it seems like it's just the same old stuff day in and out. I've managed to find some fulfillment outside of work as a performance/social salsa dancer and I love it. But the nagging question in the back of my mind is: shouldn't I have a similar passion for my daytime job? I feel like the only reason I feel I'm doing this CE stuff is to finance my dance addiction.

I wish there was some way I could do the salsa thing full time, but the market is glutted with instructors in the Bay Area.

In any case, I'm grateful for all your words of encouragement, similar experiences, and cool stories. Maybe things will change if and when I pass this PE exam.


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## maryannette

I also think this time of year is somewhat depressing. I try to spend some time outside when I can. Things seem to go in cycles. Hope things pick up for you.


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## C-Dog

It is the lack of sunlight. We need out D to be happy. Plus, all of the bills from the Holi's come due.


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## maryannette

I heard on radio news this week that the 3rd Monday in January is known as Black Monday because the weather is not good, the daylight is short, and the bills have come in.


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## maryannette

maryannette said:


> Juggling
> Imagine life is a game in which you are juggling five balls. The balls are called work, family, health, friends and integrity. And you're keeping all of them in the air. But one day you finally come to understand that work is a rubber ball. If you drop it, it will bounce back.
> 
> The other four balls--family, health, friends, integrity--are made of glass. If you drop one of these, it will be irrevocably scuffed, nicked, perhaps even shattered. And once you truly understand the lesson of the five balls, you will have the beginnings of balance in your life.
> 
> James Patterson


The rest of the story--I had additional thoughts that I wrote regarding this quote a few years ago when I was in a philosophical (in an engineering sort of way) mood:

I have made another observation about the five balls representing life. Glass balls have a hard surface with a very low coefficient of friction. When they spin or roll on a table top, they are able to keep momentum. They don’t get dragged down. They easily follow the initial course. Even when they hit another hard surface head-on, they are not bounced very far.

The rubber ball has a very high coefficient of friction. Any contact causes it to change course, bounce, slow down, and follow a very erratic path. When it hits something hard head-on, it bounces off hard.

And so it is with life. Family, health, friends, and integrity are the glass balls. When they are on course, they are not easily slowed down or detoured. They have hard outer surfaces which keep external forces from greatly influencing them.

The rubber ball representing work bounces. It is hard to keep a career spinning or rolling on a course with normal obstacles. Every little contact causes it to lose momentum. Each encounter makes it go in a different direction. The rubber ball is controlled by external forces.

The glass balls are your treasures. With proper care, they stay on course.


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## EM_PS

Career burnout - inevitable, esp. for all generations past the 'boomers. I once upon a time was a geologist, doing enviro work (consulting). came to hate it somewhere in my mid to late 20's. . . .a couple jobs later (all related career tracks) and here i am at the big '40', 13 weeks from graduating w/ an engineering degree :eyebrows: (geomatics)! I may pursue geotechnical work, poss. enviro again, poss. licensure as a PS . . . apparently i don't know what i wanna be when i grow up (Michigan job market sucks right now anyways)

I don't know what your discipline is, but the following has always inspired me (passion in what you do, whatever that may be):

The Bridgebuilder

An old man traveling a lone highway

Came at the evening, cold and gray,

to a chasm vast and wide and steep,

With waters rolling cold and deep.

The old man crossed in the twilight dim,

The sullen stream had no fears for him;

But he turned when safe on the other side,

and built a bridge to span the tide.

"Old man," said a fellow pilgrim near,

You are wasting your strength by building here.

Your journey will finish with the ending day,

You never again will pass this way.

You've crossed the chasm, deep and wide,

Why build this bridge at eventide?"

The builder lifted his old gray head.

"Good friend, in the path I have come," he said

"There followeth after me today

A youth whose feet must pass this way.

The chasm that was as nought to me

To that fair-haired youth may a pitfall be;

"He, too, must cross in the twilight dim-

Good friend, I am building this bridge for him."


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## cement

^^ nice!

good luck on your career. I expect you'll find your place.


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## Guest

maryannette said:


> OH!!! I think I just felt old.
> No, it's gone. I'm young.


When I was done south on my visit, most everyone at the plant was 49+ - there was one young lady that just turned 30. I was completely amazed that even though there was some discussion of aches and pains these people had more energy than many of the college kids I see around me every day. The difference - ATTITUDE! :true:

They were a fun group to hang out with - I am SERIOULY thinking of joining thier club. 



error_matrix said:


> I don't know what your discipline is, but the following has always inspired me (passion in what you do, whatever that may be):
> The Bridgebuilder


Quite inspirational!! Good luck!

JR


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## SSmith

Im feeling the same burnout thats been talked about above.

My job right now is the highest degree of technical engineer in the organization (GS13). Combine that with recently changes to our compensation plan (NSPS) gives me an opportunity to compete for higher grade jobs earlier, and Im working hard to get promoted into management to get a different perspective of the same work issues.

If that doesnt work, Im not sure how else to fight the burnout.

*holds breath*


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## maryannette

error_matrix said:


> The Bridgebuilder


I like the poem very much for many reasons.



> I am SERIOULY thinking of joining thier club.


Joining the club is definitely better than not joining. 

We're all human. I know no one who has been in a career that was totally satisfying through long-term. Good luck to all you "kids" who are facing burn-out. It's part of life. It's not permanent.


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## Wolverine

Words given me by a senior engineer who quit to become an artist:

"Life is certainly NOT linear."


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## Capt Worley PE

Good point, Wolverine. When I first started my career, I was amazed at the circuitous route everyone in my office took to get to the same point. Some of the paths were quite interesting.

Now, I have an interesting path myself.


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## Brody

I started out in engineering, got into IT, and now am happily back into the relatively sheltered waters of engineering.

IT is a field with an exponential learning curve with burnout lurking constantly.


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## NSEARCH

niffur said:


> let me guess - you recently crossed the 7-8 year mark of the working life. i think it happens to everybody - that period of time where you just aren't excited like you used to be, but you recognize you have it pretty good.


Man, hit the nail on the head for me. I just look at what my boss does and what I've been doing for the last 8 years and I just don't think I can do it for another 30+ years, even if it means that I make less money. Money is NOT the route to happiness in life. I was just as happy when I first started (making a lot less money) and still do the same activities (spearfishing, camping, mountain biking, traveling, etc.) outside of work now as I did then but I make more money. Funny how you still find a way to spend it isn't it?

Anyways, for the last 4-5 years I've wanted to go to fire school and obtain my firefighter/paramedic certification. I'm enrolling in a 7 month night program this September and I can't be more stoked about it. I may end up quitting this behind-a-desk/computer-pushing-paper job one day or I may not but at least I'll still accomplish something I've wanted to do for a long time now. And one of the perks about that job is that I could still be an "engineer" on my days "off" of work.

Being stuck inside most of the day responding to clients "needs" for everything they needed "yesterday" is just wearing on me.


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## maryannette

Who Moved My Cheese? by Spencer Johnson, MD is a good book to read. You can read it in less than 2 hours. It is a story of how to adapt to change and actively seek what makes you happy.

I read the book about 8 years ago when I was at a new job after 13 years with the same company. It was returned to me by someone I loaned it to and I re-read it. Good the 2nd time, too.

It's worth the cost and time to read.


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## Slugger926

I am taking up the hobby of investing so that one day I can truly do what I want to do.


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