# How much is too much study/reference material?



## CE0502 (Jun 28, 2007)

I was wondering about how many items of study materials everyone bought in preparation for the PE. I skimped this past time and bought just the CERM and the NCEES sample questions book, and borrowed an old Lindeburg practice problems book to work through. This time around, I'm considering purchasing a few more books to use during the exam and it will set me back a few hundred bucks. I'm considering an engineering dictionary, the SERM, and a new edition of Lindeburg's Practice Problems... and I'm also considering the Seismic and Wind book from ICC. Is there any of this I could skip? I don't know that I NEED a dictionary, but it seems like it would be nice to have on hand. I'm borrowing 6-Minute Solutions from a friend and have found some other good resources on this board for free!

Think this is too much? I felt underprepared with too few study materials last time, I want to be fully prepared this time but not sure if I'm going overboard here, or if I'm on the right track to passing.


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## Eckybay (Jun 28, 2007)

I had a milk crate full - the CERM, NCEES sample problem book, Steel Manual, The Green Book, AASHTO Bridge Manual, and few of the other standard transpo references that I could borrow from work.

Too much? The guy that brought the book case on wheels that was packed full of stuff - every single recommended reference, college texts, etc......It maybe open book, but you don't have unlimited time to find something in a reference that you aren't at least somewhat familiar with....

I used the CERM for the morning, used some of the transpo references in the afternoon for the depth portion. I didn't worry about having all the other references for the depth portions I wasn't taking. Sure, maybe I would have been able to look up an extra answer or two, but I didn't want to have to haul the extra stuff.....

That's my take, at any rate. Your mileage may vary.


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2007)

CE0502 --

Could you tell us what exam depth area(s) you are preparing for and the weak points in your exam diagnostic?

For me, I found that I had overburdened myself with texts, references, sheets, and multiple solutions to similar-type problems. One of the best things I ever did was sit down and prepare my own 'manuals' for each subject area. I organized and tabbed these manuals and included frequently encountered formulae, frequently encountered tables/charts/figures, and worked out problem solutions highlighting critical steps or assumptions. This allowed me to condense my materials into a handy guide that was organized by my own logic - a key component when you are trying to work efficiently. I used these manuals while working out problems and updated them as I came across new or different information.

It is a lot of work but I am convinced that this effort was a primary factor in helping me go from fail to pass 





JR


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## VA_ENGR (Jun 28, 2007)

I think the NCEES sample exam is good practice.. you may not want to take it to the test, but its good to work it a couple times during review.

The Six Minute Solutions books are good review... try to work as much of them for your afternoon section as possible.

I had almost all the recommended books for Transpo exam, plus a couple things like a Geotech book (Das) , the books from Kaplan, an Enviro Handbook from McGraw Hill, and a small binder with a few solved problems. I also had a small binder that was a quick ref for equations, and it also has a lot of conversion factors in it. I brought 2 milk crates to the exam, and passed this time. The CERM and my Enviro Handbook were good subs for an engineering dictionary for me.


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## CE0502 (Jun 28, 2007)

jregieng said:


> CE0502 --
> Could you tell us what exam depth area(s) you are preparing for and the weak points in your exam diagnostic?
> 
> For me, I found that I had overburdened myself with texts, references, sheets, and multiple solutions to similar-type problems. One of the best things I ever did was sit down and prepare my own 'manuals' for each subject area. I organized and tabbed these manuals and included frequently encountered formulae, frequently encountered tables/charts/figures, and worked out problem solutions highlighting critical steps or assumptions. This allowed me to condense my materials into a handy guide that was organized by my own logic - a key component when you are trying to work efficiently. I used these manuals while working out problems and updated them as I came across new or different information.
> ...


Thanks for the responses everyone. 

I will be preparing for Civil/Structural Depth (second time). I don't have my diagnostic with me, but my weak points were member design, loading analysis, and failure analysis I think. It sucks because I felt these areas should have been stronger since I do structural work - however, building design and codes are foreign to me. My strong points were geotechnical and transportation.

Thanks for all the help everyone, I do appreciate it!


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## ALBin517 (Jun 29, 2007)

CE0502 said:


> Thanks for the responses everyone.
> I will be preparing for Civil/Structural Depth (second time). I don't have my diagnostic with me, but my weak points were member design, loading analysis, and failure analysis I think. It sucks because I felt these areas should have been stronger since I do structural work - however, building design and codes are foreign to me. My strong points were geotechnical and transportation.
> 
> Thanks for all the help everyone, I do appreciate it!



Whatever you bring, know where everything is. You don't want to spend time going "where's waldo" looking for a page. I passed this spring and I'd say the best time I spent was probably making indeces for the books that didn't have them. Especially the books of practice problems - I brought about four.

Since you have already attempted once, you probably realize that the exam will ask you to know a little bit about everything. If you can find a similar problem and / or the area of a text where the material was explained, then apply it to the test problem, you are in good shape.


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## sceriana (Jun 29, 2007)

I don't want to say that there is no such thing as too much because you surely can go overboard. But I think it boils down to what you feel comfortable with. First time around when I failed, I only had 2 milk crates of books. Second time when I passed, I added a rubber maid bin equivelant of two more milk crates. I might have used only 1/4 to a 1/3 of the books I had but I had my references ready to flip open if need be.

And I don't think it is so much a matter of "losing time trying to find something." I borrowed books from work and co-workers and also ordered books that I never really had a chance to look at in detail. But that is where the index comes in handy. I looked in the index, if I found what I was looking for, flip to the page and this is where you need to figure out if you can use it or not. Don't start reading the whole chapter but can you use it? If not move on. And if the index has no reference to it, move on to the next book.

I was very happy with the amount of books I had. I think it helped me answer a good 10-12 questions correctly. I would have even liked to have a civil dictionary but I didn't. Luckily it didn't effect me.


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## CE0502 (Jul 5, 2007)

Thanks again for the additional responses. In reading these posts and others, I've realized the mistakes I made in preparing and not preparing enough, and am doing things completely differently this time around in terms of studying, references, organization (of which there was none this past time). Hopefully the hard work will pay off in the fall. One day I'll see my name on the banner too!


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## bigray76 (Jul 26, 2007)

I had posted this under the 'Anything About the PE Exam' thread but figured I would repost it here. One guy at the test center asked me if I had left any books at home. Personally I would rather have a book for an obscure topic and not need it than run across a question that I can't answer and know that had I brought book X, I would have had time at the end to hunt down the definition/answer.

One thing about the Transpo exam - a lot of the recommended references are big binders so they take up a lot of space in a milk crate. I didn't use them all, but was sure glad I had every last book that I brought... and for the guy who harassed me when we got inside, I did leave a few books at home!!!

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Having taken and passed the Transpo PM, I know one question that I had going into my crunch time for the exam was ‘what do I bring’, so I figured I would list out everything I brought. I finally have unpacked my crates from the April exam and decided I would list out what I had and what I used.

I would suggest that if anyone is taking a practice exam that they work it with their books in crates and try to mimic the conditions they will face on test day (limit yourself to half of the dining room table, put crates on the floor, one on the table, etc.)

Here is a list of all the books (by milk crate) that I brought into the exam with an indication of whether I used them in the AM, PM, both, or not at all.

Crate 1 – the one I had on the table

AASHTO Greenbook (PM)

CERM (AM/PM)

Engineering Unit Conversions – Lindeburg (AM/PM)

My 5 discipline specific binders (AM/PM)

Crate 2 – Transportation Only

MUTCD (PM)

HCM

AASHTO – Roadside Design Guide

Traffic Engineering Handbook (PM)

Asphalt Handbook MS-4 (PM)

Handbook of Civil Engineering Calculations – Hicks

PCA – Design &amp; Control of Concrete Mixtures

Traffic Engineering – McShane, Roess, Prassas 2nd Edition – (PM)

Transportation Engineering &amp; Planning – Papacostas &amp; Prevedouros (PM)

Crate 3 – Everything Else (a.k.a. the feel good that I have it just in case crate)

ASCE 7-02

ACI318-02

Large Binder of Solved Problems

Structural Analysis – Hibbeler

Cameron Hydraulic Data

Introduction to Environmental Engineering – Davis &amp; Cornwell (AM)

Water Supply &amp; Sewerage – McGhee

Wastewater Engineering – Metcalk &amp; Eddy (AM)

Principles of Geotechnical Engineering – Das (AM)

Principles of Foundation Engineering – Das

Engineering Economy – College Text

All 5 of the Six Minute Solutions

NCEES Sample Exam

Practice Problems Book for the CERM

Sample Exam – Lindeburg

NJ sat us two to a table, so I had my small white crate on the table, laid down my handtruck on the floor with the other two crates facing up so that when I needed a book, I pulled the handtruck out like a file drawer. I had the transpo crate in the back position for the AM and switched that to the front position for the PM.

I also brought a clear Tupperware container with a couple bottles of water, calculators (2), granola bars, Motrin, tissues, Halls, chapstick, contact lens case, and my glasses.

Books that I am happy that I bit the bullet and bought for the test: Traffic Engineering Handbook and Asphalt Handbook MS-4.

Good luck to all taking the October ’07 exam. I look forward in trying to help as much as I was helped by this forum for the April ’07 exam!

-Ray


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## squishles10 (Apr 7, 2008)

bigray76 said:


> I had posted this under the 'Anything About the PE Exam' thread but figured I would repost it here. One guy at the test center asked me if I had left any books at home. Personally I would rather have a book for an obscure topic and not need it than run across a question that I can't answer and know that had I brought book X, I would have had time at the end to hunt down the definition/answer.
> One thing about the Transpo exam - a lot of the recommended references are big binders so they take up a lot of space in a milk crate. I didn't use them all, but was sure glad I had every last book that I brought... and for the guy who harassed me when we got inside, I did leave a few books at home!!!
> 
> ---------------------
> ...


I just spent an HOUR looking for this list so I'm bumping it!


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## MC_Engineer (Jun 20, 2008)

Hi all, I passed the 2008 April Civil PE (Geotech depth) thanks to the wealth of references I brought in with me.

For Breadth, you only need the CERM and, until the CERM gets updated, a few construction texts. Don't worry about crib sheets or lots of tabs. Just make notes in the CERM, note CERM locations on the NCEES breadth topics list, and learn to use the CERM index and TOCs at the beginning of each chapter (put a tab at the beginning of each chapter and at the index those are really helpful when flipping around). Also make sure to check the errata and make corrections as needed.

During the breadth portion you will have enough time to hunt around and find what you need in the CERM. Not so for depth where you will be pressed for time (I don't think a single person at my test site in Reno, NV finished their depth module early).

For Depth, you need every single reference you can get your hands on. There is no such thing as too much. That being said, a book that has not been opened prior to the exam has a higher potential to be a waste of valuable time. Become a community borrower at the nearest University Library and check out your maximum number of books on the various topics from the NCEES depth module list of topics. At the very least, tab the table of contents, index, and pertinent chapters/pages covering those topics. This will help you to scrounge for some not so quick answers during the exam.

If the NCEES is kind enough to list the recommended references for your depth module, bring those too. They list no references for Geotech and I brought 14 geotech textbooks in with me. Guess what? They ALL got used during the exam and all of them contributed something vital to my passing the 2008 April Civil PE.

No one gives you dirty looks and everyone brings in lots of books so don't make it an issue of pride. Make holding the letter from your state licensing board that says you passed the issue ...


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## IlPadrino (Jun 20, 2008)

MC_Engineer said:


> For Depth, you need every single reference you can get your hands on. There is no such thing as too much. That being said, a book that has not been opened prior to the exam has a higher potential to be a waste of valuable time. Become a community borrower at the nearest University Library and check out your maximum number of books on the various topics from the NCEES depth module list of topics. At the very least, tab the table of contents, index, and pertinent chapters/pages covering those topics. This will help you to scrounge for some not so quick answers during the exam.


I disagree with this as a blanket statement as it surely depends on the depth you're taking. I believe the CERM will address more than 90% of the questions for WR/Environmental. From my perspective, the downside to too many references is that you're spreading your preparation time too thin (because I certainly agree it's worse than useless to bring an unopened book to the exam).

My theory is don't give away any questions with silly math mistakes (failure to properly convert units is the SILLIEST) and you'll do fine with a solid foundation.


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## MC_Engineer (Jun 20, 2008)

I agree Sraymond. I took the Geotech depth which the CERM is just about useless for. CERM has lots of great Water Resources information and maybe if I were preparing for WR/Enviro I would have a different attitude on reference materials.

Sorry to all for the previous blanket statement. Here's a slightly improved blanket statement: Make sure you have some in depth literature for ALL the subjects listed on the NCEES topics list for your depth module. If it's all in the CERM, great. Chances are, you'll need more than that, so be prepared for that eventuality as well.

The depth exam will reach for subject matter, you will be thankful for a reference or two that covers topics outside the beaten path of your depth area.


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