# Why not general PM?



## NIW_Engineer (Apr 12, 2007)

Hi all,

I wonder what are the disadvantages of choosing the General PM rather than your respective discipline PM.

Here's are the topics covered in the General AM along with percentage of total questions. The bold ones are also in general PM. As you can see, there is considerable overlap. I guess then that if you prep thoroughly for AM General you are already well prepared for PM general, right? Why burden yourself with additional topics for discipline PM?

Chemistry (9% of the total questions)

Computers (7%)

Dynamics (7%)

*Electricity and Magnetism* (9%,*12%*)

*Engineering Economics *(8%,*10%*)

*Engineering Probability and Statistics* (7%,*9%*)

*Engineering Mechanics* (statics and dynamics) (10%,*13%*)

Ethics and Business Practices (7%)

*Fluid Mechanics *(7%,*15%*)

*Materials Properties* (7%,*11%*)

*Mathematics* (15%, *10%*)

Strength of Materials (7%)

*Thermodynamics* (7%,*15%*)

Biology (5%) is found only on PM General

By this comparison, it looks like a sure strategy is to prep strongly for these overlapping topics and minimize the amount of non-overlapping topics by avoiding the disciple specific PM exam.

I appreciate any feedback.


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## benbo (Apr 12, 2007)

The theory is that as, say, an Electrical Engineer, you would know a lot about electrical engineering and would rather have more questions in your own field. This is when you bear in mind that the afternoon FE exam is pretty tough. By the way, I looked at your intro and it appears you have a PhD in ME. Assuming you've actually bveen working in something like ME I think it would be better to take the ME. But, there are others who would disagree.


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## NIW_Engineer (Apr 12, 2007)

benbo said:


> By the way, I looked at your intro and it appears you have a PhD in ME. Assuming you've actually bveen working in something like ME I think it would be better to take the ME. But, there are others who would disagree.


benbo, thanks for your reply.

If the PM Mech. Eng. exam where Convective Heat Transport and Numerical Methods only, I would destroy it. But, alas, that is not the case. They ask things like Solid Mechanics and Controls which are long forgotten, so reviewing them would take the same effort as reviewing forgotten topics for the general exam.

Also, the afternoon general exam seems to be favorable to thermal-inclined mechanical engineers given that 15% of questions are fluids and 15% are thermo/heat transfer. Add to that 10% for math and I have 45% of questions covered in fields for which I probably need very little study.


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## grover (Apr 13, 2007)

I took the general PM. I'm an EE, but I'm weak in many of the traditional EE fields and figured I'd be better off simply studying the general information in greater detail, as I was studying it already. Paid off in my case! But then again, I'm far stronger in fluids, thermo, dynamics and structures than the average EE.

If you know your basics, no reason the general PM shouldn't be as much of a cakewalk as the morning! All told, I thought the PM questions were easier than most of the AM practice exam questions I prepared with (and took FAR less time) and only a very few couldn't be solved with the supplied FE reference manual.


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## singlespeed (Apr 14, 2007)

I also took the General PM for the FE. When I walked out of the AM portion, I felt like I nailed it. After the PM General, I was not nearly as confident.

I had hoped for some turbine problems, circuit problems, basically in depth electrical/mechanical with multiple parts - this was not the case. I got a bunch of stuff that is covered in the NCEES supplied FE Reference Manual, but not necessarily covered by the review books by Lindeburg et. al..

Logic and digging through the FERM got me through it though


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## FusionWhite (Apr 16, 2007)

I took the general also (Chemical engineer here). I will still swear to this day that what saved me on the afternoon general is the math/calculus. It was pretty tough but I nailed those problems.

In the afternoon it broke down to this: was the class part of my cirriculum. I nailed the chemistry, thermo etc in the afternoon. It was easy. I also completely bombed the stuff like mechanics and materials.

IF you feel confident that you can do well on the morning session take the general afternoon and pick the low hanging fruit from your field. If you think you'll struggle in the morning take your discipline.


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## Natee (Apr 16, 2007)

Wow, thanks everyone for your input. I'm having a nervous breakdown here. As the days get closer to the test, I don't feel that all great... I've been doing the practive exams, and I've been working on all 3 of the sample tests that came with the FERM (Lindeburg) book and I'm not doing that great. The mechanics, materials, chem, fluids and thermo are all my weakness... wow, that's most of the test already  . How would you compare the difficulty of the sample test to the actual test, both morning and afternoon?

FusionWhite, I know you said that the afternoon sample is different from the actual test, what about just the morning section?


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## Ritchie503 (Apr 16, 2007)

singlespeed said:


> I also took the General PM for the FE. When I walked out of the AM portion, I felt like I nailed it. After the PM General, I was not nearly as confident.


I took General PM too, completely agree with you singlespeed. After the AM I thought "I really did learn a lot in college", after the PM general I was like "geez I hope I passed, that was really tough".



FusionWhite said:


> I took the general also (Chemical engineer here). I will still swear to this day that what saved me on the afternoon general is the math/calculus. It was pretty tough but I nailed those problems.


I agree that knowning the math/calculus was HUGE... When I took it 5 years ago I know many who used their calculators to do all the calculus, I didn't want to learn how to use a new calculator that could do that so I did all the old fashioned way. And since those calculators are now banned (wow what a suprise) you just have to know it.

I did very well on the test by the way! (Honestly I really didn't study that much for it, I have studied 20x more for the PE)


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## FusionWhite (Apr 17, 2007)

Natee said:


> Wow, thanks everyone for your input. I'm having a nervous breakdown here. As the days get closer to the test, I don't feel that all great... I've been doing the practive exams, and I've been working on all 3 of the sample tests that came with the FERM (Lindeburg) book and I'm not doing that great. The mechanics, materials, chem, fluids and thermo are all my weakness... wow, that's most of the test already  . How would you compare the difficulty of the sample test to the actual test, both morning and afternoon?
> FusionWhite, I know you said that the afternoon sample is different from the actual test, what about just the morning section?


Its very hard to describe the afternoon problems. They are hard and I felt like many of them I was seeing for the first time. But I picked out the easy ones and worked those and then made good educated guesses on the rest.

As for feeling nervous, you just need to be confident that you have done all you can. In all honesty I never took a single practice exam. I worked tons and tons of problems but never in a test setting. Plus overall I was a very mediocre engineering student. I was by no means an all star in class and I managed to pass. Relax if possible take a couple days off before the test, go in and hit it hard


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## gatormech_e (Apr 17, 2007)

i also took the general PM section of the FE last April. i would recommend putting in the extra study time since you are prepping for the morning general anyway.

of course, i'm mechanical, so i was a pretty good generalist as an undergrad. the math definitely saved me on the PM section.

now, i'm on to the PE...and praying i pass it.


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## NIW_Engineer (Apr 17, 2007)

gatormech_e said:


> of course, i'm mechanical, so i was a pretty good generalist as an undergrad. the math definitely saved me on the PM section...


This seems to be the key. When I saw the make-up of the general PM (see first post on this thread) I thought the test was really biased towards thermal-oriented Mech. Engs. Seems to be the consensus opinion so far in this thread that prepping thoroughly for the general Am and PM is the path of least resistance.


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## SkyWarp (Apr 18, 2007)

Linderburg's practice exam is a horrible representation of the difficulty level of the exam. If you have the practice exam from NCEES, you'll see it's not nearly as bad. Remember that you only have a few minutes per question. The stuff in Linderburg sometimes takes 8 minutes and half a sheet of paper, the exam is not like that.


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## JoeBoone82 (Jul 3, 2007)

I took the general because I did well in my general engineering courses. With some of my professors in the Civil Engineering Department, I felt like I would have a better chance sticking with the general pm. I passed it in 2004.


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## mbparksPE (Jul 23, 2007)

Allow me to be the voice of dissent. I am a computer engineer by degree, and would never have thought of attempting the EIT much less the PE if not for my job. I believe computer engineers are amongst the least represented engineer discipline on the EIT (not so much the EE PE). With that said, I listened to all the advice and crammed for the General exam for the afternoon. On test day that was still my plan, until I sat down and flipped through both the General and EE. There were about 10 questions that were very much centric to computer engineering (much to my amazement) on the EE exam so at the last minute I decide what the heck and tried the EE exam. I passed. My advice, if you are unsure is to prep for the General, study your discipline a bit too, and wait to make final judgment until the test is sitting in front of you. That's my two cents.


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## Raanne (Jul 24, 2007)

Anyone taking this a few years after graduation, I would recommend doing General/General. Thats what I did (i took the FE 2 1/2 years after graduating)... That way you only have one set of thigns to study. I just studied the general stuff, and I did fine. It was just as easy to re-learn that as it was to re-learn the mechanical stuff...

morning exam = felt really easy

afternoon exam - felt really difficult

both sections i finished with lots of time left over (almost an hour for the afternoon)...


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## VA_Env_Engr (Jul 24, 2007)

I agree with Raane. I was 6 years out of grad school before I decided to take the FE. After reviewing the material, I decided to tackle General/General on FE. Granted that afternoon was a lot more difficult, but the subject matter is the same, so your study strategy can focus on the same things, rather than including your discipline specific topics.

Just my :2cents:


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## kc_p21 (Aug 23, 2007)

What materials to study for General Afternoon FE?

What I have heard is afternoon problems are no where near to FERM. Any suggestions?

Thanks,


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## VA_Env_Engr (Aug 24, 2007)

kc_p21 said:


> What materials to study for General Afternoon FE?
> What I have heard is afternoon problems are no where near to FERM. Any suggestions?
> 
> Thanks,


You'll essentially need to study the same things you do for the AM section, only in greater depth. The PM questions tend to be a lot trickier but are based on the same principles.


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## kc_p21 (Aug 24, 2007)

VA_Env_Engr said:


> You'll essentially need to study the same things you do for the AM section, only in greater depth. The PM questions tend to be a lot trickier but are based on the same principles.


Thanks for your reply.


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## Art (Aug 25, 2007)

if you have a PhD in MechE from an accredited school, you'll nail ANY PM section...the test is very straightforward...I took it 20 years after graduation...

and studied the general ASCE material for 3 months 6 to 8 hr/week...

I walked out KNOWING I passed, I could not come up with more than a dozen questions I was unsure of...

it's very basic stuff...

imo the general is the way to go...


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## Guest (Aug 26, 2007)

When I took the EIT (FE) everybody took the same exam - there weren't any specialty afternoon sections. I think the with enough preparation, it is definitely 'do-able'. :2cents:

JR


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## JPGOLF (Aug 30, 2007)

Art said:


> if you have a PhD in MechE from an accredited school, you'll nail ANY PM section...the test is very straightforward...I took it 20 years after graduation...and studied the general ASCE material for 3 months 6 to 8 hr/week...
> 
> I walked out KNOWING I passed, I could not come up with more than a dozen questions I was unsure of...
> 
> ...



I think being an ME (or ChE) helps you in the PM general. I am an ME and found it does not take much to go thru the general. I took the test in april 06 and passed. I think maybe if you are an EE, yuo would struggle a little bit to get all the Thermo and Fluids stuff.

My experience in both the FE and PE (april 07) was that the afternoon section was more intense than the morning section. Problems take longer because it is 1 scenario with 3-4 questions per scenario. The morning part was easy, some questions you answer just by reading them (carefully of course)

I finished both afternoon sections with less than 15 minutes left so I had to wait until everybody was finished. Morning sections I finished before the last 15 minutes. (PE Mech, i was done in 3 hrs., i don't know why, but i did)

Jpgolf


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## Art (Aug 30, 2007)

JPGOLF said:


> I think being an ME (or ChE) helps you in the PM general. I am an ME and found it does not take much to go thru the general. I took the test in april 06 and passed. I think maybe if you are an EE, yuo would struggle a little bit to get all the Thermo and Fluids stuff.
> My experience in both the FE and PE (april 07) was that the afternoon section was more intense than the morning section. Problems take longer because it is 1 scenario with 3-4 questions per scenario. The morning part was easy, some questions you answer just by reading them (carefully of course)
> 
> I finished both afternoon sections with less than 15 minutes left so I had to wait until everybody was finished. Morning sections I finished before the last 15 minutes. (PE Mech, i was done in 3 hrs., i don't know why, but i did)
> ...


I'm a EE, but have a good bit of experience in controls and mechanical systems...

FE I walked out an hour + early

PE ~1/2 hour early, I checked my work twice...

the stuff is very basic...imho it's easier for a guy who's been out of school, than one just graduating...

it's practical knowledge based, not theoretical...

the calculus is on the order of the y = x ^ 2, dy/dx = ?

almost everything can be found in the FE reference book if you are familiar enough with it...


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## CE_SE_Micheal_Scoffield (Sep 19, 2007)

Hi to all,

Im new to this , I just wanted to have an advice, what do you suggest, will I go for Fe General Pm or Civil Discipline? Ive out of school for 12 years.

Advices are very well appreciated.


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## squishles10 (Sep 20, 2007)

CE_SE_Micheal_Scoffield said:


> Hi to all,Im new to this , I just wanted to have an advice, what do you suggest, will I go for Fe General Pm or Civil Discipline? Ive out of school for 12 years.
> 
> Advices are very well appreciated.


What do you do at work?


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## CE_SE_Micheal_Scoffield (Sep 20, 2007)

squishles10 said:


> What do you do at work?



Im unto Civil/Structural Engineering, Municipal, Transpo Design also. THANKS squishles for your advice, I will do my best to start my review.


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## squishles10 (Sep 20, 2007)

CE_SE_Micheal_Scoffield said:


> Im unto Civil/Structural Engineering, Municipal, Transpo Design also. THANKS squishles for your advice, I will do my best to start my review.


I'd do civil- I was weak in those areas, but I'm sure you'll be fine. General just sucks because it's so much stuff you don't know and it seems like you're going nowhere and never getting anything. I still have my printed out equation book around and I'm using it for the PE now. I had it memorized so well that I can still find everything. Yes, it's freakish, I know. :dunno:


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