# ASHRAE Fundamentals



## Clydeman (Jan 17, 2011)

I have been going through HVAC Six Minute Solutions. I am about half way through and have already run across a couple problems where MERMS did not have the necessary information; R-123 tables and some weird CRF (condensation resistance factor) window problem.

The prof in my PE review course said that ASHRAE Fundamentals is a good book to have.

I can see how it would be nice as I don't think MERMS does that great of a job covering psychrometrics.


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## Trev... P.E. (Jan 18, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> I have been going through HVAC Six Minute Solutions. I am about half way through and have already run across a couple problems where MERMS did not have the necessary information; R-123 tables and some weird CRF (condensation resistance factor) window problem.
> The prof in my PE review course said that ASHRAE Fundamentals is a good book to have.
> 
> I can see how it would be nice as I don't think MERMS does that great of a job covering psychrometrics.


I haven't started my preparation yet, other than beginning the book accumulation process, so can't vouch for how useful it is, but one of the books I got was ASHRAE Fundamentals from 2005. I managed to find it on ebay for $30 delivered in excellent condition. I'll be taking TF, but when I saw the HVAC section in MERM, I felt it was a little light, so wanted a backup reference. I felt the previous edition would be more than sufficient for this exam


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## cydcarter (Jan 18, 2011)

There are four major ASHRAE publications: HVAC Applications, HVAC Systems &amp; Equipment, Fundamentals, and Refrigeration. These books are constantly updated and then one book is issued every year (it cycles over thereafter). The index of all the books are intertwined and looking up something in the index of Fundamentals will refer you to Applications Chapter 23 for instance. They are essentially parts of a whole. And any ASHRAE member gets new copies constantly, so I doubt the material in the 2006 Refrigeration changed dramatically from 2010 Refrigeration, so you can use slightly older copies if you don't have your own.

I tell you all of this because I brought all four to my PE test and I want to believe I opened every one of them (one case I know was because I was hoping to find some information in it on a problem I was clueless about). If you plan to take the HVAC depth module, I urge you to find these books and atleast flip through them before the exam and tab useful sections. The page layout (mostly text, equations and tables) gives off a dry and dull feeling of a dictionary rather than an encyclopedia - there are no color pictures. So do not plan to open them exam day and know where to go to. Fortunately, my job requries constant checking, so I had tabbed most of the books already.

I don't know how well all of this would relate to the TF depth module, but I believe there is no harm in more books (assuming you're exposed to the material within them). I also know that upon completion of my practice problems (including Lindeburgs problems, 6 min solutions and the NCEES practice exam) I did not have all the tables and information necessary to complete every one of them. However, on the actual exam, the material within my four ASHRAE books, and other study materials was more than enough.

I hope that helps anyone on the verge of deciding to use these. Let me know if you have specific questions about the content that Amazon or another site can't fully provide.


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## Clydeman (Jan 18, 2011)

cydcarter said:


> There are four major ASHRAE publications: HVAC Applications, HVAC Systems &amp; Equipment, Fundamentals, and Refrigeration. These books are constantly updated and then one book is issued every year (it cycles over thereafter). The index of all the books are intertwined and looking up something in the index of Fundamentals will refer you to Applications Chapter 23 for instance. They are essentially parts of a whole. And any ASHRAE member gets new copies constantly, so I doubt the material in the 2006 Refrigeration changed dramatically from 2010 Refrigeration, so you can use slightly older copies if you don't have your own.
> I tell you all of this because I brought all four to my PE test and I want to believe I opened every one of them (one case I know was because I was hoping to find some information in it on a problem I was clueless about). If you plan to take the HVAC depth module, I urge you to find these books and atleast flip through them before the exam and tab useful sections. The page layout (mostly text, equations and tables) gives off a dry and dull feeling of a dictionary rather than an encyclopedia - there are no color pictures. So do not plan to open them exam day and know where to go to. Fortunately, my job requries constant checking, so I had tabbed most of the books already.
> 
> I don't know how well all of this would relate to the TF depth module, but I believe there is no harm in more books (assuming you're exposed to the material within them). I also know that upon completion of my practice problems (including Lindeburgs problems, 6 min solutions and the NCEES practice exam) I did not have all the tables and information necessary to complete every one of them. However, on the actual exam, the material within my four ASHRAE books, and other study materials was more than enough.
> ...



So you are saying that just getting the Fundumantals book is not enough, that all 4 books are needed?

I too am taking TF, and highly doubt that there would be much use in getting all 4 of those books. Unless you are taking HVAC, it would seem that spending vast amounts of time studing for HVAC breadth is a waste of time. From what I have read (and heard), breadth HVAC questions do not involve more than simple questions to see if you can read a chart, perhaps a mixing problem or a very simply process.

I was hoping that all I would need is the Fundamentals book (rather than all 4). As I said, I don't feel that MERMs does a great job of covering HVAC.

I did take an HVAC class in college. I should go dig up that book and see how useful it would be.


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## cydcarter (Jan 18, 2011)

Nathan Satter said:


> So you are saying that just getting the Fundumantals book is not enough, that all 4 books are needed?
> I too am taking TF, and highly doubt that there would be much use in getting all 4 of those books. Unless you are taking HVAC, it would seem that spending vast amounts of time studing for HVAC breadth is a waste of time. *From what I have read (and heard), breadth HVAC questions do not involve more than simple questions to see if you can read a chart, perhaps a mixing problem or a very simply process.*
> 
> I was hoping that all I would need is the Fundamentals book (rather than all 4). As I said, I don't feel that MERMs does a great job of covering HVAC.
> ...


If you are taking the HVAC PM module, you could benefit from all 4 (even if they are all 10 years old). As I said later in that post, I don't know how TF depth module would be affected by the books. But I will try to give some explanations on why I brought and used all 4 books (I already own them as a member, so there was no additional cost for me).

Background: I have a degree in aerospace eng, but went into mech eng field since the aero field wasn't doing too hot at the time. I have only 4.5 yrs experience at one firm that designs a very narrow, specialty-type of building. I don't have other experience, so studying for the PE was harder for me since we don't use the usual equipment, but use very custom equipment instead. That is a key reason why I often had to fall back on the 4 books. I had no background in mechanical and also had little experience with a fair portion of content of the PM module. You took more HVAC classes in college than I did  I could have taken TF since it aligns more with my education, but I know there is great benefit in mastering a test on the field that I will be working in for the foreseeable future.

Examples of why you MIGHT need all four books:

*Applications:* Gets into the general way to design for various scopes of buildings (clean rooms, healthcare, pharm, etc). Very doubtful this would be helpful in TF, and I only ended up looking in here when I had no clue on 1 problem in HVAC PM. This is a great book for HVAC career, not so much for the exam (HVAC or TF).

*Refrigeration:* Title is self-explanatory. Biggest use for me was lots of values for the specific heats and freezing points of various foods/mixtures/etc. I used this book on the HVAC-PM (Keeping this very general to comply with NCEES exam policies). Strangely enough, the refrigerant tables and charts are not in this book, but Fundamentals.

*Fundamentals:* Title is self-explanatory. Lots of tables, lots of equations, lots of good rules of thumb, lots of concepts. I used this book on HVAC-PM. I think this book could bring value to TF folks.

*Systems&amp;Equipment:* Various equipment and equipment configurations. I used this book on HVAC-PM. I can imagine this could be useful for the TF module as well.

Note 1: This is not to say that Lindeburg or other books did not have the information I was looking for, but I already use the ASHRAE books a lot, and felt more comfortable going to my usual sources, as they really are HVAC specific. I brought a suitcase to that exam full of stuff. I had no shortage of material. But I had tabbed and read over everything with me at some point within the last year. I am very optomistic in my wishes and hopes, but very pessimistic in my planning. I'd rather have a sore back and cramped legs (they made me put it under the table) after 8 hours than be comfortable and assured I would be back in 6 months.

Note 2: I bolded a comment in your above post that caught my eye. Really, that all depends on where the examinee is coming from (experience + education) and what sources they have at the moment. Can't look it up in the table or chart if you dont have them to begin with 

I hope that helps resolve some confusion on my previous post. I'm sorry for implying they are all necessary or even valuable for TF people.


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## HerrKaLeun (Jan 19, 2011)

While studying I learned to hate the organization of the ASHRAE books. They really should make one large book and update that every 2 years. This would avoid the redundancies.

anyone working in the industry needs all 4 books anyway.

As pointed out, why are the refrigerant tables in fundamentals, and not in Refrigeration? And when I design a piping system I need piping and pumps. Piping is all over the 4 books, pumps in one.

And every chapter has parts referring to another book of an older version. If you have a newer version, the chapters are different and you don't find it anymore. Besides the inconvenience of needing 4 books.

I think the whole system is made to force you to buy as many books and standards.


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