# Water/Wastewater: Career switch



## rudy (May 5, 2009)

I'll been thinking about switching careers for a few years now. With all the downturns in my industry, I've managed not to get layed off. However, I'm ready to start making the switch. I've decided something in environmental... water/wastewater... specifically with a government agency.

(1) I've taken the time to finally decide what I want to do when I grow up.

(2) My kids are getting older, so in a couple of years I won't be needing my current flexible schedule. Middle school and high school lets out later in the day, so I could probably pick them up if I go into work an hour early, instead of 2 hours early.

(3) The pay won't be as great, but there won't be as much pressure. The benefits will be great -- pension and medical benefits for retirement. These do not exist with my current industry.

So, I could use some advice. I only have 3 months (college summer internship) in environmental, and 2 years volunteering once a month running water quality tests in one of our lakes for one of our River Authorities (but this only amounts to 96 hours -- not much). Other than that no experience. I have my PE, but don't know how far that will take me without experience.

I figure the only way to switch is to gain some training AND experience. The training I can probably get thru some seminars and AiChE/ASCE chapter meetings. But how do I gain experience while keeping my current job?


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## Dleg (May 5, 2009)

What's your area of expertise now? A lot of "environmental" engineering is really just civil and construction engineering.


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## rudy (May 5, 2009)

My expertise has nothing to do with water/wastewater. I work in the semiconductor industry, in research and development, over 15 years experience. I could tell you how to build a computer chip that's fast and has lots of memory. I'm still young though. Well, at least that's what I tell myself. Yes, this goal of mine to switch into a new career path is probably going to be a long road.


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## Dleg (May 5, 2009)

So, you're an electrical engineer then? Or mechanical?

If you have experience working with hazardous materials, you might be able to make the move into the haz waste side of the enviro field a little easier. But you're right, if you want to move into the water side of things, you might have a tougher time. Maybe you should look at pursuing a Master's in Engineering in some water field, like the ME in Water Resources that is offered by Colorado State. At least that would get your foot in the door a little easier.

Otherwise, if you can find a way to finagle your current experience into something somebody needs, you might be able to find a job if you're willing to relocate to somewhere that has a hard time finding engineers. Indian Health Services, for example, seems to always have openings in the southwest and other places, but usually small towns in isolated places. Heck, if you moved out here MY agency would probably hire you (but you'd pretty much have to be here already, and be willing to work at a more entry-level salary, without any specific degree or experience).


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## rudy (May 5, 2009)

I'm Chemical. Although there are many Electricals where I work, there are several Chemical's. The Electrical's mainly do the evaluation of the product as it moves along the line and at the end of the line. The Chemical's work with the individual processes required to make the product. I have an MS degree in Chemical Eng, with a focus in Evironmental (i.e. all my electives were in Environmental).

Relocate to India? hmmm... No thank you. Actually, in my dream world, I was thinking of working for the government until retirement age. Then applying for the Marianas Island job you posted. Living off of that paycheck and pension, and enjoying the island. By then, the kids would be out of the house. I even had the hubby convinced.

I'm making it harder for myself in not considering relocation. My hubby likes his job, and I really like where we live. Austin is a big city, with a small town feeling. The University of Texas is in town, with several surrounding universities/colleges; this keeps the population very diverse and fun. Since this is a capital city, all of the state offices are in town, and other options include working for the city.

At this point, it looks like I'll be having to do alot of networking to get my foot in the door, and entering at an entry level position.


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## Dleg (May 6, 2009)

"Indian Health Services" is a US government agency, part of the DHHS, serving American Indians and Alaskan Natives, by the way.

Actually, it sounds like you have the requisite education. I would recommend keeping an eye out for jobs and applying for everything. You might get lucky, but you would probably have to accept an entry level position. Any Navy or Army bases near there? They seem to be looking for a lot of environmental engineers lately on USA Jobs.


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## Chucktown PE (May 6, 2009)

With the degree you have I wouldn't think it would be much of a problem. You'll probably have to spend some time at lower level positions but I would think that you could look at your state water/wastewater regulatory authority and find a job relatively easy when the economy picks back up.


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## rudy (May 6, 2009)

Dleg said:


> "Indian Health Services" is a US government agency, part of the DHHS, serving American Indians and Alaskan Natives, by the way.
> Actually, it sounds like you have the requisite education. I would recommend keeping an eye out for jobs and applying for everything. You might get lucky, but you would probably have to accept an entry level position. Any Navy or Army bases near there? They seem to be looking for a lot of environmental engineers lately on USA Jobs.


Oh, sorry about that. Indian Health Services... will have to look into that. Thanks for the tip. I just assumed India since quite a bit of our stuff has been outsourced there. USA jobs is a great suggestion too. There's an Army base up the street, about an hour's drive. I even came across a research engineering position for the CIA here in town. Thank you for the advice Dleg.



Chucktown PE said:


> With the degree you have I wouldn't think it would be much of a problem. You'll probably have to spend some time at lower level positions but I would think that you could look at your state water/wastewater regulatory authority and find a job relatively easy when the economy picks back up.


Thank you for the encouragement Chucktown. I'm going to give myself through the summer for some training and networking. I'm basing my training on the job descriptions that I'm interested in. For example, I'm reviewing the HEC-RMS water model from the Army Corps. of Engineers.


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## jillnova (May 13, 2009)

Dleg said:


> If you have experience working with hazardous materials, you might be able to make the move into the haz waste side of the enviro field a little easier. But you're right, if you want to move into the water side of things, you might have a tougher time. Maybe you should look at pursuing a Master's in Engineering in some water field, like the ME in Water Resources that is offered by Colorado State. At least that would get your foot in the door a little easier.
> Otherwise, if you can find a way to finagle your current experience into something somebody needs, you might be able to find a job if you're willing to relocate to somewhere that has a hard time finding engineers. Indian Health Services, for example, seems to always have openings in the southwest and other places, but usually small towns in isolated places. Heck, if you moved out here MY agency would probably hire you (but you'd pretty much have to be here already, and be willing to work at a more entry-level salary, without any specific degree or experience).


I work in the haz waste side of environmental, and am in the middle of an internal transition to wastewater engineering. There some overlap between the two, but progress is slow because of my charge rate to projects (PE with 15 years experience) is high compared to my knowledge level (entry level). There are precious few projects that can afford an expensive entry level designer. If it weren't for the general dearth of wastewater engineers I may never have had the opportunity at all. Thankfully I found that by specializing in a new offshoot of wastewater engineering (renewable energy via anaerobic digestion) that I can justify my rate as a "resident expert" on projects.

I don't know that my approach would work for someone coming from an entirely unrelated branch of engineering. Yes there are electrical controls at plants but they are more an an electrician's level than a design level. I second the motion to get the masters degree, as it will give you the coursework background and the gravitas from the advanced degree. Although your masters degree may take longer than some. Most masters programs will require you to take some extra undergraduate level courses if your original undergraduate major is far removed from the masters program. Good luck!


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## rudy (May 13, 2009)

Thank jillnova for sharing. The more I look into it, the more it seems that there are different types of careers in water/wastewater, which is good. Yup, I agree that a master's degree will open up more doors. Thank you again.


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## Samzmom08 (May 14, 2009)

Hi Rudy,

Happy belated mother's day! Hooray for being a terrific mom!

My BS is Chemical Engineering, MS in Chemistry (Eco-toxicology), PE in Chemical. Mom of a two year old. Seven years as an environmnetal engineer with a municipal wastewater treatment plant. Recently I am looking into getting in the Civil PE (more desirable in the environmental arena).

Here is my $0.02: you already have the education (MS and PE) to qualify for any entry level environmental engineer in most municipality, your asset is your heavy chemistry background and kinetics for wastewater treatment plant design processes, plus you have transferable professional skills having worked at a private industry. Most municipality will provide training once you are hired.

Get a copy of the Metcalf &amp; Eddy "Wastewater Engineering", and attend a WEFTEC event (water environment federation) or become a member, they have the best seminars for water/wastewater industries and huge government agency network.


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## Kephart P.E. (May 14, 2009)

I would suggest trying to find a job with a consulting firm that specializes in Enviro/Wastewater.

Consulting Engineers get way more experience much more quickly than almost anywhere else IMHO, mostly because they typically don't hire unless they have work for you to do. Plus it is very easy to run something once you have designed a similar system.


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## GulfCoastCivil (May 14, 2009)

My mentor since college has his degree in Chemical Engineering. He does mostly utility pipe work now, designing sewer collection &amp; water distribution systems.


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## rudy (May 15, 2009)

Samzmom08 said:


> Hi Rudy,
> Happy belated mother's day! Hooray for being a terrific mom!
> 
> My BS is Chemical Engineering, MS in Chemistry (Eco-toxicology), PE in Chemical. Mom of a two year old. Seven years as an environmnetal engineer with a municipal wastewater treatment plant. Recently I am looking into getting in the Civil PE (more desirable in the environmental arena).
> ...


Hi Samzmom08, Happy Mommy's Day to you too !!! I had forgotten about those days when they were small, but quickly remembered them babysitting my 2-year old niece last night. Their voices are so cute at that age.

Great advice. I was planning on going to the book store this weekend. I'll add Metcalf &amp; Eddy. If I don't find it there, I already found it on Amazon. It looks like most of WEFTEC meetings this year are in Florida. I'm going to stick to local ASCE chapter meetings here in town for now, but will definitely be keeping an eye on the WEFTEC site for any future meetings nearby. Thank you again for the insight.


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## rudy (May 15, 2009)

D. Kephart said:


> I would suggest trying to find a job with a consulting firm that specializes in Enviro/Wastewater.
> Consulting Engineers get way more experience much more quickly than almost anywhere else IMHO, mostly because they typically don't hire unless they have work for you to do. Plus it is very easy to run something once you have designed a similar system.


Hi D. Thank you. I really like what I do now. But the reality of it is, is that it is not secure and there are no retirement benefits. Actually, there is no retirement. Once we get to retirement age, all we leave with is our 401k. So my train of thought is going into something that is fairly secure and offers retirement and is something that I like to do since the pay will be considerably less. I also want to get away from working late in the evenings... something 8 to 5, at least until the kids are gone to college.

I'm in my 30's, so in order to be able to retire at a decent age with a good pension, which will depend on years of service, it is better for me to start a government job in a couple of years. I need to have a decent number of years of service for the retirement multiplier to be beneficial. If I were a few years younger, I would definitely consider the consulting route for experience, then government. Thank you for your suggestion.


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## rudy (May 15, 2009)

GulfCoastCivil said:


> My mentor since college has his degree in Chemical Engineering. He does mostly utility pipe work now, designing sewer collection &amp; water distribution systems.


One of my professor's used to say that Chemical Engineering was one of most diverse fields. Seems like that is still true today.


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## klk (May 18, 2009)

Hi Rudy,

Even though WEFTEC won't be in Texas, that doesn't mean you can't get something out of WEF. You should see when the Water Environment Association of Texas (WEAT) has their annual conference and attend that. WEAT is a member association of WEF, so you can get some good training and do some networking, all at one event. If you are serious about transiting to wastewater, I would get involved in WEAT instead of ASCE. Wastewater folks tend to gravitate towards WEF.

Here is the link for WEAT http://www.weat.org/


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## rudy (May 21, 2009)

Hi klk,

This is awesome! Thank you very much for the WEAT website. I had never heard of this. I've started off with the recent newsletter and calendar of events. There are meetings in my hometown, which I will start attending. I even saw the CMOM workshop, which I understand covers all of the PHD requirements.

I was wondering if there was a professional chapter for the water/wastewater management. I guess most of the people I talked to were Civil's, and thats why the ASCE idea came along. I will definitely drop that idea and participate in WEAT instead.

Thank you very much!


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## Guest (May 27, 2009)

rudy said:


> I'll been thinking about switching careers for a few years now. With all the downturns in my industry, I've managed not to get layed off. However, I'm ready to start making the switch. I've decided something in environmental... water/wastewater... specifically with a government agency.


Out of curiousity - why are you thinking about wastewater engineering? Also, have you considered whether you are thinking primarily municipal or also some aspects of industrial wastewater treatment?



rudy said:


> So, I could use some advice. I only have 3 months (college summer internship) in environmental, and 2 years volunteering once a month running water quality tests in one of our lakes for one of our River Authorities (but this only amounts to 96 hours -- not much). Other than that no experience. I have my PE, but don't know how far that will take me without experience.


I agree with what others have said - your chemical engineering background should be sufficient to get started. Many engineers in state and federal jobs working in water/wastewater treatment are actually chemical engineers.

FWIW - I turned down a job to be the PE Supervisor for the State of Florida's Industrial Wastewater program before I accepted my current job. Dleg hit the nail on the head - if you have experience/knowledge about hazardous waste/waste treatment, that is actually pretty good knowledge to get you ahead of the curve.

The other thought is that no matter what 'transition' field you enter, you will end up being entry level due to lack of experience in that area. So, pursuing something that you *LIKE* is critical at this point. 



rudy said:


> I figure the only way to switch is to gain some training AND experience. The training I can probably get thru some seminars and AiChE/ASCE chapter meetings. But how do I gain experience while keeping my current job?


I am not sure you will be able to get experience directly during the interim.

There are several people on the forum who are knowledgeable about water/wastewater treatment. I have some things that are in electronic format if you are interested and can recommend other references (like the Metcalf &amp; Eddy text).

From somone who just made a job/career switch - I can tell you that it is VERY refreshing.  I am working longer hours but I find that it really doesn't phase me (no pun intended) as I really like what I am doing now. 

Good luck!! 

JR


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## rudy (May 29, 2009)

Hi JR,

Obviously I don't know what I'm doing. There seems to be alot of branches in water/wastewater (municipal vs industrial). Alls I know is that in all my electives, I gravitated towards environmental and the effects on our water resources.

Yup, I figured that I would have to start at an entry level and work my way up and that I needed to be sure I liked it. Since I enjoyed my volunteer water monitoring and I am interested in water, I think it will be worth a try.

Yes, please. I'm interested in any electronic material you could provide. I've looked up the Metcalf &amp; Eddy book at the neighborhood book store, couldn't find it there, looks like Amazon will be the way to go.

So when you made the career switch, did u do the same things I'm doing? (i.e. reading up on the new area, attend meetings with new engineering groups). Or did you do additional things for the switch?

Thank you so much for your encouragement, rudy.


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## maryannette (May 29, 2009)

Rudy, I changed jobs last year. I finished 3 years in Civil degree program, but didn't finish degree. Left college in 1978. I worked for several years in Civil design, but had limited options. I ended up working in mechanical product design (started by doing drafting) for over 20 years. Wanted to have more options a few of years ago and decided to take PE exam again. I passed in Civil. I moved into construction management for US gov. Part of what got me my job is my general project experience, not specific industry knowledge. I have adapted very well in my new job because of general professional experience. I hope you can get where you want to be.


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## wilheldp_PE (May 29, 2009)

Dammit Mary, I hate when you post. Whenever you do, I have to spend 10 minutes watching your avatar dance.


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## GTjoy (May 29, 2009)

I don't have much experience in water/wastewater either (my background was more in air and transportation), but I'm beginning to get my feet wet - no pun intended.

Another organization you could look into is the American Water Works Association (AWWA). It includes industry/utility water and wastewater treatment professionals, as well as folks from civil and military sides of government, nonprofits and consulting services like myself. AWWA is huge and I believe they have active local sections/chapters in Texas.

I recently went to my first conference on Water Security - very interesting stuff - this is still a growing issue and there is somewhat of a dearth of people with expertise in that arena.

Secondly, I have friends actively involved in the AWRA. It's more focused on water resources rather than water treatment, but you might find something you like.


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## Guest (May 29, 2009)

rudy said:


> Obviously I don't know what I'm doing. There seems to be alot of branches in water/wastewater (municipal vs industrial). Alls I know is that in all my electives, I gravitated towards environmental and the effects on our water resources.


Well, something to keep in mind from a regulatory perspective - don't box yourself into just water/wastewater treatment. Considering things like NPDES or perhaps Wetlands permitting (a very HOT topic now due to budget resources/constraints).

I know you said you were looking at state/federal govt resources. Are you considering a geographical move with this career change?



rudy said:


> Yup, I figured that I would have to start at an entry level and work my way up and that I needed to be sure I liked it. Since I enjoyed my volunteer water monitoring and I am interested in water, I think it will be worth a try.


I started off as a physics major in college. I worked part-time in a wetlands chemistry lab (focused on soils biogeochemistry) as a lab assistant during my freshman/sophmore years. The experience between working in a lab and in the field directed me towards environmental engineering, though turd tumbling bored the hell out of me. I tended to like the more abstract science aspect which is why I gravitated towards groundwater modeling, geophysical exploration/characterization, and environmental remediation - fields where you are driven by codes and standards and you are required to think outside of the box.

It's good you had that experience - THAT will help lead you in the direction you will want to go. 



rudy said:


> Yes, please. I'm interested in any electronic material you could provide. I've looked up the Metcalf &amp; Eddy book at the neighborhood book store, couldn't find it there, looks like Amazon will be the way to go.


See what you can find at websites like

http://www.epa.gov

http://www.usace.army.mil

http://www.nrcs.usda.gov/

http://www.wbdg.org/ccb/browse_cat.php?o=29&amp;c=4

There are MANY FREE publications that you can peruse to see what is being done in terms of state-of-the-state work.



rudy said:


> So when you made the career switch, did u do the same things I'm doing? (i.e. reading up on the new area, attend meetings with new engineering groups). Or did you do additional things for the switch?


I think I knew I was going to make a switch from my current job during the time I started preparing for professional licensure. While I COMPLETELY love working on environmental remediation projects, I realized that the degree of expenditure and work being conducted had approached a nadir. In other words, those fancy things I learned in school didn't mean  since cookie cutter approaches were being applied (generally speaking).

I definitely started reading and talking to other people as part of my educational experience. I also took on new, different assignments at work that would allow me to branch out into other areas and learn about those things. One of the areas I ended up working in was hazardous waste regulation and disposal issues in the power/utility industry .. including two nuclear power plants. Taking on that huge project exposed me to lots of new and different areas of regulation and allowed me to see what it was like to work within that industry. I personally liked all of the people I worked with and the working environment - it seemed to match the aspects that were important to me, including:

- reasonable pay/benefits

- reasonable working hours (time off)

- reasonable mixture of new/different project

- reasonable expectation for growth/advancement

- reasonable working environment between indoors and outdoors

- reasonable utilization of knowledge/skill from previous work experience

- reasonable recognition (respect) for my education and professional licensure

So, once I put together a decision matrix of what was important and placed some weighting factors on those choices - the power/utility industry seemed the right place for me. And .. voila .. here I am.  I have been VERY busy since I started working here ... but I can't say I have been happier with my job (and life) in a very, very long time. Even if the money wasn't better - I still would have made the switch because there are somethings you can put a price on - personal satisfaction being one. 



Mary :) said:


> Rudy, I changed jobs last year. I finished 3 years in Civil degree program, but didn't finish degree. Left college in 1978. I worked for several years in Civil design, but had limited options. I ended up working in mechanical product design (started by doing drafting) for over 20 years. Wanted to have more options a few of years ago and decided to take PE exam again. I passed in Civil. I moved into construction management for US gov. Part of what got me my job is my general project experience, not specific industry knowledge. I have adapted very well in my new job because of general professional experience. I hope you can get where you want to be.


That's awesome Mary! 



GTjoy said:


> Another organization you could look into is the American Water Works Association (AWWA). It includes industry/utility water and wastewater treatment professionals, as well as folks from civil and military sides of government, nonprofits and consulting services like myself. AWWA is huge and I believe they have active local sections/chapters in Texas.


That's a good point - AWWA is a very good organization for information, conferences, and networking.



GTjoy said:


> I recently went to my first conference on Water Security - very interesting stuff - this is still a growing issue and there is somewhat of a dearth of people with expertise in that arena.


Potable drinking water treatment (and distribution) has enjoyed increasing levels of funding primarily due to security issues. I just wish some of that funding would also get re-direction for improvement of the infrastructure as it is in desperate need of improvement.



GTjoy said:


> Secondly, I have friends actively involved in the AWRA. It's more focused on water resources rather than water treatment, but you might find something you like.


And yet even another group, with a slightly different focus is Air &amp; Waste Management Association (AWMA) with emphasis on air and waste issues.

JR


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## GTjoy (May 29, 2009)

rudy said:


> There seems to be alot of branches in water/wastewater (municipal vs industrial). Alls I know is that in all my electives, I gravitated towards environmental and the effects on our water resources.
> I'm interested in any electronic material you could provide.


I'd recommend looking into stormwater, groundwater, and other water resource-related work as well, including wetlands and floodplain work and even permitting work. For example, a federal agency's facility would still to need comply with state local stormwater and wastewater permit requirements.

Plus there is also always NEPA work, which isn't engineering, but it's good to be knowledgeable about it anyway, and it's a good way to get your foot in the door of some federal agencies (since they all have to comply with NEPA).

Lastly, have you heard of MIT's open courseware? There's some introductory stuff there on water treatment, water resources, and hydrology:

http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Civil-and-Enviro...ering/index.htm


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