# Fatty Raises



## rppearso (Jan 4, 2010)

Did anyone here get a nice fatty raise after they passed there PE or is it to early to tell? What was the percentage of your rasie and what engineering disipline are you?


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## Dark Knight (Jan 4, 2010)

rppearso said:


> Did anyone here get a nice fatty raise after they passed there PE or is it to early to tell? What was the percentage of your rasie and what engineering disipline are you?


:Locolaugh: :Locolaugh: :Locolaugh:

Sorry to laugh. Nothing personal. I just remember how much I got two years ago. About $600 dollars a year. :smileyballs:


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## Engineer Okesola (Jan 4, 2010)

If I pass I'm supposed to get 10%, no questions asked.

Lets hope the economy hasn't nixed that.


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## Chucktown PE (Jan 4, 2010)

I got $100 a month more. So that would equate to less than a 1.5% raise.


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## gibby09 (Jan 4, 2010)

The last 2 companies I worked for would give a bonus when you passed then give you a raise at the annual review. But I've been told by others that you don't get what you deserve unless you switch companies.

Then again with this economical situation everything may be different.


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## texfrazer (Jan 4, 2010)

In almost all circumstances, you'll never get what you're worth unless you switch companies. The business model is to only pay someone just enough to keep them from leaving. When you change companies, the other company is looking to pay you just enough to get you to move and then just enough to stay with them.

The irony is that those who are content and happy with who they work for and how much they earn are really the ones that other companies are looking to hire, but they typically only find the ones who aren't content with where they are or aren't content with how much they're earning, and won't be content with the new company or the new raise.


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## gibby09 (Jan 4, 2010)

I've heard a lot of people talk about %'s. 10%-20% is what I've heard that most people are wanting or think that they will get, but realize that usually it is in the 4-6% range (when staying with the same company). Most of the people I have talked with are dissapointed with what they actually get.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 4, 2010)

I got about 10%, but it was coupled with my yearly review. IIRC it was something like 4% from the review, 6% from the PE.

Alot of the basis of the raise comes from what having the PE does for the company. If I was still with my original employer out of college, I would have received nada as they were a general contractor and I was a field engineer. Now that I work for a consultant, my billable rate went up (which allowed them to pay more) and I also went through the company's PM training program to allow me to manage my own projects. IMO, the PM training provided more of a basis for the raise than the PE did simply because I was able to provide more benefit to the company. Only having a PE wouldn't really be able to provide much because the office I work in is entirely PE's (except the receptionist), so if I chose to not sign a set of plans, they would have no problem finding someone else to do the work.


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## rppearso (Jan 4, 2010)

So what im hearing is the PE is not really all that and is more just for oneself to see if you can do it. Maybe its not worth all that much but stamping is still taking on a liability that I would not think one would want to do for free. I think I am just going to forget that I have it lol.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jan 4, 2010)

rppearso said:


> So what im hearing is the PE is not really all that and is more just for oneself to see if you can do it. Maybe its not worth all that much but stamping is still taking on a liability that I would not think one would want to do for free. I think I am just going to forget that I have it lol.


It makes you a hell of a lot more marketable if you were to lose your job.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 4, 2010)

it's not that a PE is worthless. It's more about what the PE does for both you and your company. Can the company benefit from your PE? If yes, then you should be compensated for it. If not, why should they pay you more?


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## Dark Knight (Jan 4, 2010)

rppearso said:


> So what im hearing is the PE is not really all that and is more just for oneself to see if you can do it. Maybe its not worth all that much but stamping is still taking on a liability that I would not think one would want to do for free. I think I am just going to forget that I have it lol.


The PE has some value in the consulting industry. The question is: Are you willing to pay the price? It is a big responsability and I can guarantee you the stress level is very high. With the economy the way it is right now I would not jump to a consulting/designers firm.



Dexman1349 said:


> it's not that a PE is worthless. It's more about what the PE does for both you and your company. Can the company benefit from your PE? If yes, then you should be compensated for it. If not, why should they pay you more?


Agree. The company I used to work for encouraged us, and even paid for the PE and review books/courses. It had some weight at the time of an opening but was not the deciding factor.

The company I work for now despise engineers with PE license because the managers at the top of the company are not engineers(frankly...you do not have to be an engineer to be at a manager level here...the only requisite is not to have an idea what the job is and no technical knowledge in the area of work) and they do not want engineers in leadership positions. Now, they LOVE Masters Degree, even if it is a Master in something totally unrelated to the job you will manage, their eyes roll back, they pee in their clothes and their knees shake violently if they see Masters Degree in a resume.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 4, 2010)

Dark Knight said:


> The company I work for now despise engineers with PE license because the managers at the top of the company are not engineers(frankly...you do not have to be an engineer to be at a manager level here...the only requisite is not to have an idea what the job is and no technical knowledge in the area of work) and they do not want engineers in leadership positions. Now, they LOVE Masters Degree, even if it is a Master in something totally unrelated to the job you will manage, their eyes roll back, they pee in their clothes and their knees shake violently if they see Masters Degree in a resume.


My previous employer actually discouraged us to get PE's as well. This was because most of the engineers who got them ended up leaving the company. General Contractors typically don't need PE's, and the one I worked for already had as many as they wanted.


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## esmith (Jan 4, 2010)

Work for a small consulting (civil/structural) firm. No raise for me, but it helps the company out considerably by allowing the company to be qualified to do more/bigger projects. Boss still hasn't given me a reason, but his wife who handles payroll just said "we just can't do anymore than this" and handed me my normal pay check. Blame it on economy. Atleast I'm still working while I look for bigger better opportunities.


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## PA_Mining_Engr (Jan 4, 2010)

I'm suppose to get a ~4% raise through promotion and a $2k one time bonus, however; w/our current budget issues (state empolyee) it is hard to say if I'll get either!

Anyone looking for a PE Mining Engineer??!! :eyebrows:


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## hawkinjc (Jan 4, 2010)

after suffering an 18% pay cut last March, I was given a 10% raise (the only one in the whole company) at my yearly review just prior to getting my results back. The pay raise was necessary since I was making less than one of the guys who works for me.

I am going to ask for another raise but I doubt I get it. I have been told I now get to bonus 1/2% off the profits of our district.

I had already ran the engineering department for our district and got my designs stamped in our corporate office. Now our district has a PE they can show off and I will be stamping all my own work.

I like my company, but not enough for them to hold me back. Hopefully they step up to the plate. I will probably test the market some to see what else is out there.

I work for a subcontractor and passed the civil/structural.


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## rppearso (Jan 4, 2010)

Yea thats pretty much it is just start sending resumes out and see what kind of offers you can get, does anyone know if over seas engineering is better compensated (germany, etc)?


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## IlliniASU (Jan 4, 2010)

rppearso said:


> Yea thats pretty much it is just start sending resumes out and see what kind of offers you can get, does anyone know if over seas engineering is better compensated (germany, etc)?



That's an interesting question, and also begs the question of reciprocity overseas. How does that work? Are there additional exams to take? Would a license in the US even matter?


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## Supe (Jan 4, 2010)

IlliniASU said:


> rppearso said:
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> > Yea thats pretty much it is just start sending resumes out and see what kind of offers you can get, does anyone know if over seas engineering is better compensated (germany, etc)?
> ...



Yes and no. A lot of the overseas work from overseas -&gt; domestic is reviewed by a PE prior to construction stateside. The domestic -&gt; overseas work is usually stamped by a PE and then reviewed by the customer's engineers.


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## jd2u (Jan 4, 2010)

No immediate raise here, either. However, I was a non-traditional student when I got my engineering degree. I was very poor and went to work for the for the first place to offer me employment. I work for a state government and have been there for nearly 8 years. I have advanced to a position where I needed the PE license to advance further. The next advancement will raise my salary about 15%. It may not take that long since there are a number of engineers retiring soon.

I can't say that it will benefit me to try to go into the private sector at my age. My boss/supervisor congratulated me and in the same breath told me that I could not leave. All in the office laughed. We are very busy and it would leave our field office in a bind. It will be difficult to pass up an opportunity to try to advance so I put in a hint that a merit raise would be much appreciated...


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## rppearso (Jan 4, 2010)

jd2u said:


> No immediate raise here, either. However, I was a non-traditional student when I got my engineering degree. I was very poor and went to work for the for the first place to offer me employment. I work for a state government and have been there for nearly 8 years. I have advanced to a position where I needed the PE license to advance further. The next advancement will raise my salary about 15%. It may not take that long since there are a number of engineers retiring soon.
> I can't say that it will benefit me to try to go into the private sector at my age. My boss/supervisor congratulated me and in the same breath told me that I could not leave. All in the office laughed. We are very busy and it would leave our field office in a bind. It will be difficult to pass up an opportunity to try to advance so I put in a hint that a merit raise would be much appreciated...


Its not about the field office if you cant get a better offer somewhere you should take it, my whole goal it so work less hours for more money. You can leave when ever you want unless you are in the military or something, in which case all that requires is that you are physically present not that you stamp anything. If your company cant keep you motivated with compensation increases then you should be looking else where. I would be curious to see if people are able to find significant bumps up in pay through new offers, I have about 8 resumes out there to very pointed individuals through my network and have got one email back and a sucessful interview so we will see what the offers look like.


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## rppearso (Jan 4, 2010)

Supe said:


> IlliniASU said:
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> > rppearso said:
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I got onto a german forum to ask this very question but its not an engineering specific forum so I dont know if I will get an answer, I know canada has a Peng which is MUCH less rigourus to get than an american PE so im guessing that the american PE should carry some weight even in other nations (the canadian PE is basicly a longer jurisprudance questionarie and takes about 2-3 hrs and is not really even a technical exam), I definitly plan on following up my PE with an advanced degree so that should help overseas. I am getting burned out on the "im lucky to have a job mantra" I went through all this to make the big bucks not to be "lucky to have a job" so if I have to learn a new language so be it im not going to live in the soviet union if things do in fact take a turn for the worse lol. So far I have some good leads but the key will be what the offers look like.


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## Dark Knight (Jan 5, 2010)

rppearso said:


> I went through all this to make the big bucks not to be "lucky to have a job"...


Then you did pick the wrong career. There are no big bucks in engineering. One of my professors asked this question: "Who wants to be an engineer because the money?"

About 13 out ~ 25 raised their hands(I did not). He replied..."You are in the wrong place then. Leave and enroll in a Med or a Law School." I remember those words like it happened yesterday.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

I was just informed that I'm getting a "fatty" raise of 5%. Yay!


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## Qwistin (Jan 5, 2010)

Congrats Wil!

This thread crushes my dreams and hopes - while giving me useful information for honing my unrealistic expectations.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

Dark Knight said:


> rppearso said:
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> > I went through all this to make the big bucks not to be "lucky to have a job"...
> ...


I had a similar professor, and I too, remember the day he did this...

but I also had another professor brag about billing out at $150 per hour. Now that I've been working at a consulting firm for a few years, I realize that $150/hr is middle management. lol


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## Qwistin (Jan 5, 2010)

See, I was told by professors that engineering was a good field in which to make a living. Not huge bucks, but enough to live as I, personally, wish to live. What salary exactly would you term as "big bucks"?


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

Qwistin said:


> See, I was told by professors that engineering was a good field in which to make a living. Not huge bucks, but enough to live as I, personally, wish to live. What salary exactly would you term as "big bucks"?


*typical engineer answer*

It depends on where you're living. 6 figures here in Denver is close to big bucks, but 6 figures in San Diego is still decent, but not big. Compare that to the middle of Nebraska, 6 figures is HUGE.


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## MA_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> Dark Knight said:
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If I actually made what they bill me at, I'd be a very happy camper.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

MA_PE said:


> Dexman1349 said:
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Agreed. Stupid overhead multipliers...


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## Qwistin (Jan 5, 2010)

Dex, I love this board because typical engineer answers are given to typical engineer questions. 

You make a good point about location being a factor. Where I am, engineering isn't a shabby job.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

MA_PE said:


> If I actually made what they bill me at, I'd be a very happy camper.


There's a way to do that, but you become responsible for finding your own work and paying your own overhead.


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## robertogreen (Jan 5, 2010)

Got a nice 5% raise....after the 10% paycut.


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## Flyer_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

wilheldp_PE said:


> MA_PE said:
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> > If I actually made what they bill me at, I'd be a very happy camper.
> ...


And you would also likely find that your net will be at or below what you are taking home now.


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## 3dB down (Jan 5, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> Qwistin said:
> 
> 
> > See, I was told by professors that engineering was a good field in which to make a living. Not huge bucks, but enough to live as I, personally, wish to live. What salary exactly would you term as "big bucks"?
> ...



Having moved from the Bay area in CA to Omaha I can definately say that 6 figures would be huge in NE. My daughter said shortly after moving to Omaha, "Dad, it's like everything is on sale!".


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

A family friend just bought a 4000sf house with 5bd/4ba, 3car garage, 2 acres, and an unfinished basement in Northeast Colorado (about 10 miles from Nebraska) for $160k. That same price would buy a middle unit 2bd/1ba, 1 car garage townhome in the Suburbs of Denver.


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## RHOSU06 (Jan 5, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> A family friend just bought a 4000sf house with 5bd/4ba, 3car garage, 2 acres, and an unfinished basement in Northeast Colorado (about 10 miles from Nebraska) for $160k. That same price would buy a middle unit 2bd/1ba, 1 car garage townhome in the Suburbs of Denver.


I think I have to move to NE CO!!


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

RHOSU06 said:


> Dexman1349 said:
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> 
> > A family friend just bought a 4000sf house with 5bd/4ba, 3car garage, 2 acres, and an unfinished basement in Northeast Colorado (about 10 miles from Nebraska) for $160k. That same price would buy a middle unit 2bd/1ba, 1 car garage townhome in the Suburbs of Denver.
> ...


The problem is that $160k is expensive for the area. There aren't many jobs out there that can support that price. Finding a job for more than $8/hr is very difficult. Most of the people out there are farmers, or in the customer service field (retail sales, waiter/waitress, etc.).


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## FLBuff PE (Jan 5, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> RHOSU06 said:
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I had a buddy who lived in Ft. Morgan (NE Colorado), and would commute to Boulder every day. I visited his house out there...you couldn't pay me enough to live there. I like the mountains too much. And I pay out the a$$ for it too.


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## rppearso (Jan 5, 2010)

Anchorage is one of thoes places where 100K is ok money and im not seeing 100K yet so thats a problem, an end unit condo is 180K and the cost of living here is very high (nothing is on sale .... ever, and eating out is a racket lol). I am considering going to job shops and beefing up my home office to cut out alot of the over head. Job shops are worth there cut so long as there cut is reasonable because finding your own work can be a pain so I am definitly working on not being an employee. I talked to someone about lawyers and they told me unless your hot s**t and can contort and manipulate things very well your not making the big bucks either so medical doctors are about it but thats only if you go into surgury or some other such thing and I cant stand blood so the next logical step is engineering/science. I could live with 100$/hr even if im not working every day, I dont like getting up for work every day anyways.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

rppearso said:


> I could live with 100$/hr even if im not working every day, I dont like getting up for work every day anyways.


:lmao: I think most Americans would tolerate making $100/hr. It's only about 15 times minimum wage...


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## souper (Jan 5, 2010)

Flyer_PE said:


> wilheldp_PE said:
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I would think operating a one-man consulting firm from his/her own home would result in little overhead, no? What else is required other than insurance? You would need the clientele, of course.


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## FLBuff PE (Jan 5, 2010)

rppearso said:


> Anchorage is one of thoes places where 100K is ok money and im not seeing 100K yet so thats a problem, an end unit condo is 180K and the cost of living here is very high (nothing is on sale .... ever, and eating out is a racket lol). I am considering going to job shops and beefing up my home office to cut out alot of the over head. Job shops are worth there cut so long as there cut is reasonable because finding your own work can be a pain so I am definitly working on not being an employee. I talked to someone about lawyers and they told me unless your hot s**t and can contort and manipulate things very well your not making the big bucks either so medical doctors are about it but thats only if you go into surgury or some other such thing and I cant stand blood so the next logical step is engineering/science. I could live with 100$/hr even if im not working every day, I dont like getting up for work every day anyways.


Sounds like you got a motivation problem there, partner. Are you really Peter Gibbons?


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## wilheldp_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

souper said:


> Flyer_PE said:
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> > wilheldp_PE said:
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Insurance would be HUGE...both health and liability. Then you would have technology costs to pay for software licenses and the computer capable of running the newest software. You also have to be disciplined about taxing your income since you don't have an employer to do it for you automatically any more. It's just a big, fat pain in the ass.


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## souper (Jan 5, 2010)

wilheldp_PE said:


> souper said:
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Good thing my fiance is a school teacher with great benefits :]

My boss has a brother who's a CPA and handles all of his finances. It's sickening how much he pays him. Besides myself, it's easily his biggest overhead.... double the rent. I will happily spend the time to learn Quickin.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 5, 2010)

souper said:


> My boss has a brother who's a CPA and handles all of his finances. It's sickening how much he pays him. Besides myself, it's easily his biggest overhead.... double the rent. I will happily spend the time to learn Quickin.


I think it's a little more than just running Quickin...


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## souper (Jan 5, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> souper said:
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> > My boss has a brother who's a CPA and handles all of his finances. It's sickening how much he pays him. Besides myself, it's easily his biggest overhead.... double the rent. I will happily spend the time to learn Quickin.
> ...


Saw that coming 

It's a lot more than running Quickin, but Quickin is a popular and well established software for a reason.


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## EM_PS (Jan 5, 2010)

wilheldp_PE said:


> Insurance would be HUGE...both health and liability. Then you would have technology costs to pay for software licenses and the computer capable of running the newest software. You also have to be disciplined about taxing your income since you don't have an employer to do it for you automatically any more. It's just a big, fat pain in the ass.


Bah! Professional liability insurance may be more affordable than you might think - could only run 1.5% +- of your gross (obviously depending on your actual prof services). Health insurance would be a b!tch unless there is a working spouse carrying bennies. Software licenses would be a drop in the bucket - and fwiw, many in civil arena usually already running acad or whatever at home on a computer fit to do so. Asides from that, invest in an accountant. write off the floor space being used as office space in your house, your car / truck as business vehicle, etc.

I think its the best idea going, and I've considered doing this myself, but capital cost of needed surveying equip would be the prohibitive wrench in my plans. A civil I know who does this very thing has talked to me about possibly forming a consortium of home office engineers / surveyors. you don't even have to be in the same town per se. anyways, looks really good on a resume too (that you ran your own company), for when the economy does come back around.


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## Flyer_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

Just a word of warning about deducting home space used for business. If you do that, when you sell your house, the IRS is of the opinion that they can look upon that house as if you have been depreciating the value of the whole damn thing as a business asset. You then have a substantial capital gains liability.

My best friend is a tax accountant and advised me against playing with claiming my office space as any kind of tax deduction. It's one of those things that might save you a little now only to cost you a lot later.


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## EM_PS (Jan 5, 2010)

Flyer, you're actually working for a utility pretty much remotely, right?


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## Mutha PE PS (Jan 5, 2010)

EM_PS said:


> wilheldp_PE said:
> 
> 
> > Insurance would be HUGE...both health and liability. Then you would have technology costs to pay for software licenses and the computer capable of running the newest software. You also have to be disciplined about taxing your income since you don't have an employer to do it for you automatically any more. It's just a big, fat pain in the ass.
> ...


Only problem is getting clients to pay. I have done some moonlighting and thankfully I had a regular 40 hr job to fall back on to feed the family. Still have guys that owe from 3 years back. Will probably never collect on those.


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## Flyer_PE (Jan 5, 2010)

Nope. We're a 25-man consulting company. Unless the job we're on requires us to be on a client site, we all work from our homes.


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## EM_PS (Jan 5, 2010)

Re: Hart 4515

Nice Av - Yes this is true - a surveyor i worked for actually had the hardest times collecting his invoices from banks of all places, not your run-of-the-mill survey needer or developer

Re: flyer - Great setup!


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## rppearso (Jan 5, 2010)

You can also set up your own buisness and contract out to the very offices you used to work as a direct employee. I run hysys so buying a single user licence of that would not be feasable as it is around 10K a year so I would use client or contractor offices for that and maintain a small office for invoices and taxes etc, the senior PE that I used to work under still does that and he basicly gets to write off lunchs and driving to work thats the way to go. Trying to do it completely independant is probably not the way to go because you lack a project team and very expensive software, this can also be accomplished through job shops.


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## Mutha PE PS (Jan 5, 2010)

EM_PS said:


> Re: Hart 4515 Nice Av - Yes this is true - a surveyor i worked for actually had the hardest times collecting his invoices from banks of all places, not your run-of-the-mill survey needer or developer
> 
> Re: flyer - Great setup!


What I found is the people with the least amount of money always pay. The guys with the multi-million dollar corps. are always trying to figure a way not to pay.


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## EM_PS (Jan 5, 2010)

^yeah a company i worked for more or less inherited a landfill &amp; a site condominium based on failure to pay invoices. Of course the principals i think ultimately took some of the units from the site condo as payment - and this was pretty much right on Lake MI, so good $$ / good land


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## jgraw37 (Jan 6, 2010)

I've been told I'll be getting a whopping $0.50! Amounts to less than 2%. But I can't complain too much. I started in May '05 out of college at $23/hr, and was up to $30 in July '09. We have performance reviews/raises every 6 months, and they have been prettty good so far;

Date	Hourly	Annual	Raise

May-05	$23.00	$47840

Jul-05	$23.00	$47840	$0.00

Jan-06	$24.00	$49920	$1.00

Jul-06	$25.00	$52000	$1.00

Jan-07	$26.00	$54080	$1.00

Jul-07	$26.75	$55640	$0.75

Jan-08	$27.75	$57720	$1.00

Jul-08	$28.75	$59800	$1.00

Jan-09	$29.50	$61360	$0.75

Jul-09	$30.00	$62400	$0.50

I expect them to get a little better now with a P.E. This is for the greater Pittsburgh area where the median household income is ~$45,000.


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## rppearso (Jan 6, 2010)

I never look at medium house hold I look at actual cost of living.


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## wilheldp_PE (Jan 6, 2010)

rppearso said:


> I never look at *medium* house hold I look at actual cost of living.


"median"?


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 6, 2010)

I wonder if house prices are included (as well as an indicator) for calculating cost of living? hum... [/sarcasm]


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## rppearso (Jan 7, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> I wonder if house prices are included (as well as an indicator) for calculating cost of living? hum... [/sarcasm]


They should be thats probably the biggest factor is housing costs.


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## MonteBiker (Jan 7, 2010)

rppearso said:


> Dexman1349 said:
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> > I wonder if house prices are included (as well as an indicator) for calculating cost of living? hum... [/sarcasm]
> ...


I bet you are right, home prices are "probably the biggest factor is housing costs."

That will be my good laugh for the day!


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## rppearso (Jan 7, 2010)

MonteBiker said:


> rppearso said:
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Sorry housing costs are the biggest factor in cost of living.

Anyways what are peoples opinions of the following:

I got an offer at another company for significantly more than I am making now should I send this to my currant employer to see if they can match or exceed it (the higher ups have been giving the lower managers the run around about "market conditions" and I know thats bogus now) or should I just give 2 weeks. I want to make sure I play all my cards just right. I also have some more offers rolling in so I am going to wait a bit to see how much I can make.


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## Capt Worley PE (Jan 7, 2010)

rppearso said:


> should I send this to my currant employer


You work in the grape industry? If it is winemaking, it explains a lot.


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## Chucktown PE (Jan 7, 2010)

I would just tell them that you have an offer for better. Do you even want to consider staying with your current employer?


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

It depends on several factors (typical engineer answer):

-Would you prefer to stay at your current company if they came close (if not matched or exceeded) the new offer?

-What do you gain by going to this new company (other than increased $)? More vacation time, better health benefits, better work environment, etc?

-What do you lose by leaving your current company? % vesting in ESOP programs, vacation time, seniority, a good work environment, health benefits?

-What do you gain/lose in the long term by changing companies? (how does the new company address payraises vs the current one? How about vacation time?)

It all depends on what you are willing to forfeit to make other gains. Sometimes getting a new job only requires minimal forfeiture (ideally), but usually the loss in benefits (ESOP vesting, health insurance, paid time off, etc.) equals what you gain.

If you're just looking for money at the expense of all else, go where the money is. However, as you get older and get a family (if you choose to go this route), you will see that the $/hr becomes less and less of a deciding factor when it comes to where you work.

I know the company I work for doesn't provide the best $/hr (although it is still good), but they pay 100% of my medical, vision, and dental (I have to pay out the ass if I want my family to be covered though), I love the office I work for, the people I work with are great, and they provide great advancement opportunities. If I left my current company, I would lose 40% of my ESOP because I'm not 100% vested yet (which equals several thousand dollars), I would have to deal with my 401(K) and any potential losses with switching it over, I would potentially lose 1-2 weeks of vacation time per year.

My parents always told me to do what I love and the money will come. If you're good at what you do and you do what you love, more money will come.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

I can understand if you are young, healthy, and single that your main concern is your $/hr, because we were all there at one point. But if you ever get married, have kids, or heaven forbid, get sick, you will discover that what you look for your employer to provide can go WAY beyond $/hr.

It's amazing how quickly priorities can change as life happens. Hell, I'm only 30 and I'm looking at ways to make sure my kids are provided for incase something happens to me, make sure that I have the ability to take time off and be with them, be able to provide opportunities for my family (college, retirement, vacations), and all while providing the best current standard of living I can (home, car, etc.).


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## RHOSU06 (Jan 7, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> I can understand if you are young, healthy, and single that your main concern is your $/hr, because we were all there at one point. But if you ever get married, have kids, or heaven forbid, get sick, you will discover that what you look for your employer to provide can go WAY beyond $/hr.
> It's amazing how quickly priorities can change as life happens. Hell, I'm only 30 and I'm looking at ways to make sure my kids are provided for incase something happens to me, make sure that I have the ability to take time off and be with them, be able to provide opportunities for my family (college, retirement, vacations), and all while providing the best current standard of living I can (home, car, etc.).


I approve this message - couldn't have said it any better.


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## EM_PS (Jan 7, 2010)

rppearso said:


> Anyways what are peoples opinions of the following:
> I got an offer at another company for significantly more than I am making now should I send this to my currant employer to see if they can match or exceed it (the higher ups have been giving the lower managers the run around about "market conditions" and I know thats bogus now) or should I just give 2 weeks. I want to make sure I play all my cards just right. I also have some more offers rolling in so I am going to wait a bit to see how much I can make.


Your company very likely doesn't believe in counteroffers (hint: most don't), all the moreso in this economy; therefore neither should you go fishing for one. Its a little bit degrading, isnt it, to have a company (if they agree to) match a counteroffer that they may or maynot have thought you were worth, only by virtue of another company's offer?

Oh and hell no, don't give 2 weeks till you know for [email protected] sure that job offer is bona fide and you don't fail any requisite checks and/or pre-employment 'screenings'



Capt Worley PE said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> > should I send this to my currant employer
> ...


i almost picked up some currant jelly earlier today


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

EM_PS said:


> Its a little bit degrading, isnt it, to have a company (if they agree to) match a counteroffer that they may or maynot have thought you were worth, only by virtue of another company's offer?


Agreed. And in my earlier posts, by saying that you stay with your current employer, I was implying that you DON'T present them with your new job offer. If you prefer to stay, I would recommend asking for a raise and not even mention the new offer.


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## rppearso (Jan 7, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> EM_PS said:
> 
> 
> > Its a little bit degrading, isnt it, to have a company (if they agree to) match a counteroffer that they may or maynot have thought you were worth, only by virtue of another company's offer?
> ...


I have already asked for a raise and I am getting the same run around about market conditions blah blah blah and that there will be no raises this quarter, my potential offer would be close to a 50% raise which I highly doubt my current employer would give me if I asked, I would get an extra week of vacation, potentially a window office with a better view and I know half the people there becuase they already left my current company to work there. There are no pentions or anything like that and my current employer cut out 401K matching and im on an HSA medical insurance account and have enough on my card to cover my deductiable if something happens. My currant employer is also moving our cubes to the shopping level of a mall (not the professional office space on the 5th and 6th floors where engineers should be, of course I am succunded now so that wont matter as long as im on this current project but there really is nothing to go back to, sitting on the shopping level of a mall is a joke in my opinion but they are still operating under the "your lucky to have a job" mentality and it feels like things are turning around this year so they are going to loose all there staff if they dont make some drastic changes in the next few weeks). I am not single but do not plan on having kids for a long time and my GF has her own insurance which is better than my HSA plan.

I agree im not going to do anything until all the pre employment stuff is done, that would be really retarded.


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## RevMen (Jan 7, 2010)

Sounds like a no-brainer to me. A 50% raise is pretty frickin' substantial. Plus everything else sounds better, too.

If a bunch of your former co-workers are already at the new company, your current company has already made the decision to not offer higher salaries in an effort to retain people. It's probably not even worth the effort of asking them for a raise.


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## arada (Jan 7, 2010)

I wonder if I read this from this post : " my boss used to say your knowledge level is the same right before and right after you passed the PE exam - an excuse not to give raise" :wtlw:


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## rppearso (Jan 7, 2010)

arada said:


> I wonder if I read this from this post : " my boss used to say your knowledge level is the same right before and right after you passed the PE exam - an excuse not to give raise" :wtlw:


Yea until company X decides to give you a 50% raise lol. You should get your resume out there and leave that place in the dust. The PE is just the culmination of all the studying and hard work, I learned alot as I was studying for the PE that I did not learn in school or on the job, in fact I used the large blue book to do some affinity law calcs, so yea getting a letter in the mail does not increase your level of knowlage but it represents the knowlage to even sit for it and especially to pass it. The only way that guy has a leg to stand on is if he is already paying you a 6 figure salery, then I could see why he would not give you a raise but not for the reasons he presented.


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## Qwistin (Jan 7, 2010)

arada, I posted that on a results thread, but I can't remember where.

I actually had a boss say that to me. Jerk. I don't work there anymore. Lesson learned!


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

Its like the same excuse I used to use when I was younger. What's the difference the day BEFORE I turn 21 and the day AFTER my birthday? I'm not going to suddenly get "enlightened" so that my drinking habits will change.

The standard response I got was, "you're not 21 before your birthday, THAT's the difference."

You don't magically get smarter the day you get your P.E., but you know conform to a higher standard that is much more valuble. It's just a matter of how valuble everyone involved thinks that standard is.


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## FLBuff PE (Jan 7, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> Its like the same excuse I used to use when I was younger. What's the difference the day BEFORE I turn 21 and the day AFTER my birthday? I'm not going to suddenly get "enlightened" so that my drinking habits will change.
> The standard response I got was, "you're not 21 before your birthday, THAT's the difference."
> 
> You don't magically get smarter the day you get your P.E., but you know conform to a higher standard that is much more valuble. It's just a matter of how valuble everyone involved thinks that standard is.


I don't know about anyone else, but the knowledge fairy tapped me on the head immediately after I got my passing letter. And gave me a lollipop.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

FLBuff PE said:


> Dexman1349 said:
> 
> 
> > Its like the same excuse I used to use when I was younger. What's the difference the day BEFORE I turn 21 and the day AFTER my birthday? I'm not going to suddenly get "enlightened" so that my drinking habits will change.
> ...


So is that the same fairy that disappeared with my duplicate license you've been using?


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## FLBuff PE (Jan 7, 2010)

Come to think of it, that is where it came from. Wierd, huh?


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

Not completely unexpected. So how is that expert witness testimony coming along for "me"?


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## FLBuff PE (Jan 7, 2010)

Dexman1349 said:


> Not completely unexpected. So how is that expert witness testimony coming along for "me"?


It's the week of the 18th. Other experts agreed with 'your' findings.


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## Dexman1349 (Jan 7, 2010)

Good to know. I hate it when I have others contradicting "my" findings.


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## jd2u (Jan 7, 2010)

> i almost picked up some currant jelly earlier today rolleyes.gif


Man, I looked all day New Years Eve for some currant jelly to make a glaze for some Cornish Game Hens. Used apple jelly with a little extra lemon juice instead. They turned out great for something different from the rib-eyes we normally have before the ball is dropped.


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## RIP - VTEnviro (May 27, 2010)

bump


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## Chucktown PE (May 27, 2010)

how in the hell did this get HOF status?


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## roadwreck (May 27, 2010)

on EB.com there is no differentiation between the Hall of Fame and the Hall of Shame.


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## RIP - VTEnviro (May 27, 2010)

Chucktown PE said:


> how in the hell did this get HOF status?


for stuff like this...



> My currant employer is also moving our cubes to the shopping level of a mall (not the professional office space on the 5th and 6th floors where engineers should be, of course I am succunded now so that wont matter as long as im on this current project but there really is nothing to go back to, sitting on the shopping level of a mall is a joke in my opinion but they are still operating under the "your lucky to have a job" mentality and it feels like things are turning around this year so they are going to loose all there staff if they dont make some drastic changes in the next few weeks).


:f_115m_e45d7af:


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## Chucktown PE (May 27, 2010)

WTF, I work in a shopping mall. Does that mean I'm not as good of an engineer as riperson. Besides, there's a Sbarro's next door to me and they give me their leftover lasagna at the end of the day. And on the other side of my office there's a plus size lingerie shop. Those chicks like to party.


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## VJS (May 27, 2010)

texfrazer said:


> In almost all circumstances, you'll never get what you're worth unless you switch companies. The business model is to only pay someone just enough to keep them from leaving. When you change companies, the other company is looking to pay you just enough to get you to move and then just enough to stay with them.
> The irony is that those who are content and happy with who they work for and how much they earn are really the ones that other companies are looking to hire, but they typically only find the ones who aren't content with where they are or aren't content with how much they're earning, and won't be content with the new company or the new raise.


Dead on. Absolutely true!

I got a pay raise (9%) + stock option bonus in my present company just on the belief that I will pass the PE next month. Ofcourse, they will not admit that it is because of the PE. There is a company wide pay freeze. Till yesterday, they were paying just enough to keep me from leaving. A PE equipped PhD will change that. I am a Mechanical Engineer.


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## RIP - VTEnviro (May 27, 2010)

N00bs and HOf threads just don't mix.


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## frazil (May 27, 2010)

^ noobist!


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## RIP - VTEnviro (May 27, 2010)

I pwn more noobs before breakfast than entire nations do in a day.


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## MechGuy (May 27, 2010)

Chucktown PE said:


> WTF, I work in a shopping mall. Does that mean I'm not as good of an engineer as riperson. Besides, there's a Sbarro's next door to me and they give me their leftover lasagna at the end of the day. And on the other side of my office there's a plus size lingerie shop. Those chicks like to party.


If there was an Orange Julius where I worked I don't think I'd ever go home.


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## summit550 (May 27, 2010)

I work for an environmental company that has been more successful/profitable last year than the ever have and they used the "economy" as an excuse to not give raises. After bitching for 2 months I got a 10% raise. They acted like I should kiss ass but I told them "I'm 25%+ under payed so I should kiss ass for only being under payed 15%+". I know things are tough out there but even profitable companies are using the economy as a excuse to screw employees. If I passed my PE exam the first thing I'm doing is writing a resume and getting the hell outta Dodge.


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## Ble_PE (May 27, 2010)

VTEnviro said:


> N00bs and HOf threads just don't mix.


This bears repeating.


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## Master slacker (Jun 2, 2010)

summit550 said:


> I work for an environmental company that has been more successful/profitable last year than the ever have and they used the "economy" as an excuse to not give raises. After bitching for 2 months I got a 10% raise. They acted like I should kiss ass but I told them "I'm 25%+ under payed so I should kiss ass for only being under payed 15%+". I know things are tough out there but even profitable companies are using the economy as a excuse to screw employees. If I passed my PE exam the first thing I'm doing is writing a resume and getting the hell outta Dodge.


Actually, you're underpaid 17.5%, not 15%. Just sayin'.

X = baseline

0.75 X = your old salary

(0.75 X) + (0.1 * 0.75 X) = 0.825 X = new salary

X - 0.825 X = 0.175


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## jassiinpublic (Jun 3, 2010)

Double post.


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## jassiinpublic (Jun 3, 2010)

I'm an E-1 with 3.5 years of experience, LEED AP and now soon to be PE.

There's a bonus for passing but I doubt I'll get a bump now or when things pick up  The sad part is, I think I shot myself in the foot by passing the PE. The company might do the math (bonus + bump) and decide that it's cheaper to can me.

:sharkattack:



summit550 said:


> I work for an environmental company that has been more successful/profitable last year than the ever have and they used the "economy" as an excuse to not give raises. After bitching for 2 months I got a 10% raise. They acted like I should kiss ass but I told them "I'm 25%+ under payed so I should kiss ass for only being under payed 15%+". I know things are tough out there but even profitable companies are using the economy as a excuse to screw employees. If I passed my PE exam the first thing I'm doing is writing a resume and getting the hell outta Dodge.


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## summit550 (Jun 3, 2010)

Let's here from those who passed what response they are getting from their employers.


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## Sschell (Jun 3, 2010)

First time I read this thread all the way through... HoF for sure!



Capt Worley PE said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> > should I send this to my currant employer
> ...


Nice one!



FLBuff PE said:


> I don't know about anyone else, but the knowledge fairy tapped me on the head immediately after I got my passing letter. And gave me a lollipop.


you got "tapped" by a "fairy" huh? are you sure that was a lollipop?



Chucktown PE said:


> And on the other side of my office there's a plus size lingerie shop. Those chicks like to party.


Wow... just wow! this made me lol!


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## Dexman PE (Jun 3, 2010)

sschell_PE said:


> FLBuff PE said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know about anyone else, but the knowledge fairy tapped me on the head immediately after I got my passing letter. And gave me a lollipop.
> ...


No, the fairy drives a cargo van with no windows and "Free Candy" spray-painted on the sides, wears a clown outfit, and was offering you a free ride home from school.


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## Audi Driver P.E. (May 12, 2016)

Not only was my raise not fatty, it was low carb. as well.


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## snickerd3 (May 12, 2016)

what's a raise?  haven't seen one of those in a couple years


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## Dexman PE PMP (May 12, 2016)

lol @ Guest Dexman...


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## Supe (May 12, 2016)

I got a $15 spot bonus as part of our new rewards program.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (May 13, 2016)

Cleveland is considering to raise the min wage to $15, so I'll be making over $30k next year! Fatty Money!


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## snickerd3 (May 13, 2016)

yeah too bad the equivalent bump for professional salaries isn't going to happen with a bump in min wage


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## Ramnares P.E. (May 17, 2016)

This ^


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## matt267 PE (May 17, 2016)

snickerd3 said:


> yeah too bad the equivalent bump for professional salaries isn't going to happen with a bump in min wage


Nope, that's not going to happen, but this is: http://fusion.net/story/302781/wendys-self-service-kiosks-fast-food-automation/

Idiots didn't see this coming did they. Now my daughter is going to have a harder time getting her first job when she's in high school.


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## snickerd3 (May 17, 2016)

fast food places here don't hire teenagers...they are all middle age or older


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## matt267 PE (May 17, 2016)

snickerd3 said:


> fast food places here don't hire teenagers...they are all middle age or older


There's a mix of age groups in my area. But non of them deserve $15/hr.


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## Road Guy (May 17, 2016)

you wont be getting a bump you'll be getting a DIP!


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