# License plates for bikes and other dumb ideas in proposed bill



## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

Watch out Wolv, if some Georgia legislators get their way you'll have to get your bike licensed AND have a 4"x7" license plate mounted to your ride. Highlights of the bill include:


Every owner of a motor vehicle, ... every owner of a bicycle, and every owner of a trailer shall, during the owner's registration period in each year, register such vehicle as provided in this chapter and obtain a license to operate it for the 12 month period until such person's next registration period."

"Any person purchasing or acquiring a bicycle shall register and obtain, or transfer, a license plate to operate such bicycle upon streets with motor vehicle traffic from the county tag agent in his or her county of residence no later than 30 days after the date of purchase or acquisition of the bicycle."

"...License plates which shall be at least four inches wide and not less than seven inches in length..."

*"Persons riding bicycles upon a roadway shall ride single file except on bicycle paths, bicycle lanes, parts of roadways set aside for the exclusive use of bicycles, or when a special event permit issued by a local governing authority permits riding more than single file. Persons riding bicycles upon a roadway shall ride no more than four riders per single file line, and at least four feet shall separate each bicycle. At least 50 feet shall be maintained between each line of four riders at all times."*

You can check out the full bill here:

http://www.legis.ga.gov/legislation/en-US/display/20132014/HB/689

I realize that some groups of cyclists can be a little annoying and if you are in a hurry it isn't much fun to get stuck behind a slow moving cyclist, but this is absurd.


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## engineergurl (Sep 26, 2013)

we had to register our bikes in the city of Syracuse in college, and they would ticket you if you used the wrong kind of lock on the bike racks... stupid.


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## Sapper PE LS (Sep 26, 2013)

One day all transportation will be by bicycle... When the oil companies fail!!!! Bwaaaaa haaaa haaaa!

No? You mean this won't happen?


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 26, 2013)

Looks look the Leaf driver will have to pay his fair share after all.


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## snickerd3 (Sep 26, 2013)

growing up we had to to register our bikes. College it was optional but the cops were more likely to help with stolen bikes if they were registered.

Trailers in IL already have to have plates/tags.

IL is looking at registering ATVs though


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 26, 2013)

When i was in elementary school, the headmistress got some grand idea to force kids to pay for license plates to ride their bikes to school. This being SC, and folks not taking kindly to such over-reach by authorities, more than a few folks called the office with questions like, "Do you really want to lose $2K in tuition over a four dollar license plate?"

The idea never came to fruition.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 26, 2013)

I remember registering my bike as a kid with the local police department. It was more to prevent bike thefts and to create a database in case your bike was stolen. I have no idea how much it cost, but it wasn't a requirement.


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 26, 2013)

^The Man just wants a registry of bikes so the PTB caan seize them in the middle of the night.


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## knight1fox3 (Sep 26, 2013)

Dexman PE said:


> I remember registering my bike as a kid with the local police department. It was more to prevent bike thefts and to create a database in case your bike was stolen. I have no idea how much it cost, but it wasn't a requirement.


+1. Same here. It was kind of like the bike was "officially yours" at that point.


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## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

knight1fox3 said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> > I remember registering my bike as a kid with the local police department. It was more to prevent bike thefts and to create a database in case your bike was stolen. I have no idea how much it cost, but it wasn't a requirement.
> ...


Because licensing automobiles has all but wiped out car thefts.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 26, 2013)

But it was one of those special stickers that you cannot remove without an angle grinder...


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

Anything that's gets the freeloaders of asphalt usage paying a little into the tax kiddy is fine by me....


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## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

like kids?


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 26, 2013)

The usage tax for my 6-yr old's bike (if based on the vehicle's weight, purchase price, and age like my car), would be something like $0.03 per year...


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

The bill is strictly aimed at cyclist to use the road for business and leisure


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## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

kids don't use roads for leisure?


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

I don't think they intend this for subdivision roads but for yahoos that drive down barrett Parkway on the side of the road they are welfare queens of transportation and should pay their fair share wether they are in a cat or on a bike


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## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

I'd be willing to wager that 99% of those yahoos also own and drive cars and thus do pay their fair share.


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 26, 2013)

roadwreck said:


> I'd be willing to wager that 99% of those yahoos also own and drive cars goddam Priusesand thus do pay their fair share.




FXT.


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## roadwreck (Sep 26, 2013)

^^

You may have a point, Wolv. seems to be a pretty avid cyclist and he drives a Leaf!!! hmy:

I know a number of people who ride bikes on the roads, none of them do it as a commute alternative and none of them drive Priuses. They do it for exercise and recreation, and typically they don't ride during rush hour. That's just a death wish. This bill is targeted against people who ride for recreation and exercise. Dissuading people from exercising isn't a good long term practice, especially in state with one of the higher obesity rates in the nation.


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

Y'all are missing the point...

If you can't get on a transit system without paying a "fare", why should you be able to ride a bike on a public road without paying for said road?

Roads are paid for by vehicle fees and gas taxes for the most part...

We need to also figure out a way to make those electric car owners pay also...

Of course I am in bike hell where the bikes have more rights than cars (&amp; they aren't even paying for the fucking right to be on the road!!!)))

Fucking disgusting!


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 26, 2013)

^^^ call him a dumbass and find out...


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## Sapper PE LS (Sep 26, 2013)

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Road Guy thinks bicyclists should pay to use the road just like people pay to use all other forms of transportation. Just a hunch. And he might just have a point, but if that is the case, then they should pay for the amount of damage they do to it, because the gas tax is there to pay for maintenance of the roads from deterioration due to vehicle use. By that metric, cyclists should pay about a penny every decade or so.


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## Slugger926 (Sep 26, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> Y'all are missing the point...
> 
> If you can't get on a transit system without paying a "fare", why should you be able to ride a bike on a public road without paying for said road?
> 
> ...


Lets privatize all roads, and let the private companies charge tolls.


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## Sapper PE LS (Sep 26, 2013)

On this topic NGNRD, I am not in disagreement with you, which is why I think a penny every decade is more than fair... Or in other words such a ridiculous statement because it's ridiculous.


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

I agree that the motor fuel tax should only be spent on asphalt and bridges not for trails sidewalks transit or any of the above it won't happen but that is my firm belief of what the money that you put in your car when you buy gasoline and pay a gas text should not go to anything that doesn't involve a vehicle

But it is being spent on a lot of things that have nothing to do with construction and maintenance of roadways and that is one of the main reasons why there is not enough funding for transportation in this country


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## Road Guy (Sep 26, 2013)

Not saying I want a new tax but I want the existing motor fuel tax used for the purpose of things that actually use "motor fuel"

This is a pet peeve of mine and bikers (peddle power) are a group that always show up at road projects wanting bike lanes and trails added to roads, which cost money but they don't actually participate in funding said improvements(if that makes sense)...

Take a 10 mile road project and add. 4' of pavement to both sides and that adds up to a lot of money...

So I say he'll yes tax them!


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## engineergurl (Sep 26, 2013)

ngnrd - PE said:


> Traffic Fines (indirect taxation)




Ummmm... I respectfully disagree on this one. Traffic Fines occur when you decide not to follow the rules...


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## wilheldp_PE (Sep 26, 2013)

> This is a pet peeve of mine and bikers (peddle power) are a group that always show up at road projects wanting bike lanes and trails added to roads, which cost money but they don't actually participate in funding said improvements(if that makes sense)...





If a bike lane is provided and it actually succeeds in encouraging people to commute by bike instead of car (overzealous engineering assumption conceded), then the wear on the road should be reduced. Therefore, the need for future re-paving or maintenance cost should be reduced. Therefore, investing in bike lanes should, theoretically, pay for itself in the long run.



Road Guy said:


> I don't think they intend this for subdivision roads but for yahoos that drive down barrett Parkway on the side of the road they are welfare queens of transportation and should pay their fair share wether they are *in a cat *or on a bike




It's hard to ride a bike while "in a cat."


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 27, 2013)

I ride a mountain bike. I don't need roads.

Personally, I really don't think bikes belong on roads with cars. The speed and acceleration differentials are too high. Bike and walking trails work better and are safer. I'm all for dedicated trails of such nature because they can be made and maintained far more cheaply.

But how to fund it fairly?

:dunno:

As if the gov really thinks of fair &lt;---sarcastic, cynical editorial.


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## sycamore PE (Sep 27, 2013)

So I do bike commute 1.3 miles each way to and from work, and 0.9 miles each way to and from daycare drop off at my friends' house. That's all on city roads funded, at least partially, by my property taxes, so I pay my share. And I do register 2 vehicles in Wisconsin, because winter is prohibitive to bike commuting. Since property taxes factor into municipal road work, seems like anyone who is not homeless is paying into the road coffers.


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## mudpuppy (Sep 27, 2013)

^Same thing here.

I got into an argument with a city council member about repaving the local bike path. It came down to spending the money on the bike bath or a police car. Nothing to do with road funding.


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

On average most city and county road departments get 10% , if that, out of property taxes.... Most of your property taxes, nationwide average is 2/3 go to the school district..

But state routes are funded 99% with gas taxes so that's what this bill is referring to.

My old job we had a 1% sales tax for transportation and we would include bike and ped stuff In there but that's what sold it to the voters...


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

Your missing the point and if you had to deal with some of these nut job biker people you would see mine but you don't...


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## roadwreck (Sep 27, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> Your missing the point and if you had to deal with some of these nut job biker people you would see mine but you don't...


I see your point, but I don't agree with your position. Some places embrace cyclist and don't see them as freeloaders of the transportation system. I don't think writing a statewide bill to dissuade people from riding bikes on public roads is a good idea.


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 27, 2013)

roadwreck said:


> Road Guy said:
> 
> 
> > Your missing the point and if you had to deal with some of these nut job biker people you would see mine but you don't...
> ...




I with rw on this one.


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

Ngrd- you know I like a good argument but I didn't take it personal with you so why don't you go fuck yourself?


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 27, 2013)

^LOL,


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

And I don't see this as hurting a group...bikers say all the time they want the same rights as cars so here you go....

Why shouldn't bikers be ticketed for disobeying traffic laws and I see this all the time....

Now if this is for subdivisions that's insane...,,


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## engineergurl (Sep 27, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> But state routes are funded 99% with gas taxes so that's what this bill is referring to.


Okay, let me just point out... (and this is a bit ironic coming from me)... while all these people are going about their environmentally hippie way of riding their bikes to work and to the store and all that, they aren't putting gas in the car, decreasing tax revenue available to fund the infrastructure that they are so willing to use for their commutes via a nearly completely tax free mode. As cars turn more towards hybrids, electric, pedal power... the infrastructure will continue to get used, continue to experience wear and tear, and continue to need repairs and the funding that has historically provided a budget (albeit a small one) will decrease as revenues decrease.

IF we want services provided to us, then we need to pay for them. The pavement being there for us to drive or ride on is a service provided and it needs to be funded.

And taxation by citation is a crock concept, if you don't want to pay the fine, fee, tax (what ever you want to call it) then obey the law and you won't have to.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 27, 2013)

Capt Worley PE said:


> ^LOL,


DAMN!


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## roadwreck (Sep 27, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> And I don't see this as hurting a group...bikers say all the time they want the same rights as cars so here you go....
> 
> Why shouldn't bikers be ticketed for disobeying traffic laws and I see this all the time....
> 
> Now if this is for subdivisions that's insane...,,


Bikers should be ticketed for not obeying traffic laws. Although technically I break the law on my bike all the time because I will ride on the sidewalk. Did you know it's illegal in Georgia to ride a bike on the sidewalk? It's a law that I've never seen enforced though.

I don't think the bill makes a distinction between neighborhood streets vs. major thoroughfares although this bill is clearly aimed at the groups of cyclists you see in spandex suits riding in large groups. I think requiring them display license plates and limit them to groups of 4 riders is nuts. I don't ride my bike like that. If I do ride it's usually on neighborhood streets. Sometimes I'll ride to the gym or to the store or other short trips just so I don't have to start up my car. I figure I'm doing my part for the environment and getting some exercise so it's win-win. I stick to smaller back roads, bike trails or sidewalks to make those trips. I pretty much won't ride on a road with a speed limit over 35mph unless it has a bike trail, just because I don't want to get run over.

I don't feel like this bill is aimed at me but I don't like the idea that if this bill were to pass I'd have to register my bike, display a license plate and I would be restricted on how many other people I ride with. I don't feel like this is a problem in our area. We have bike lanes around and I think this would impinge on the pretty active bike groups in our community who ride for exercise, recreation and to socialize with other bikers. These people pay their fair share of motor fuel taxes. They aren't riding their bikes to avoid driving a car, they are doing it to workout. These are the people that would be impacted by a bill like this.


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

Bikers even here in boulder are supposed to ride single file


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## roadwreck (Sep 27, 2013)

Road Guy said:


> Bikers even here in boulder are supposed to ride single file




I believe bikers here have to ride single file too, but this bill states that each bike would have to be a certain distance apart and is limited to a group of 4. Groups of 4 bikes must remain at least 50' apart. That's going a little to far IMO.


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 27, 2013)

Bicyclists here in CO can get outright stupid. They can and will shut down US highways through the mountains because they're riding in large groups, completely oblivious to the dangers they are causing to other vehicles. The concept of the bill is on the right track, but I think it's a bit extreme and difficult to enforce.


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

This bill was written by an engineer at the state DOT and that part of the bill had safety in mind in terms of trying to prevent accidents that's all

Truthfully, I am gonna start riding my bike around town also now that I live in an area that is conducive to do so. And I don't think that if the folks who own the road ask me to buy a bike tag to get on their road . Then I don't see that as a huge inconvenience as those things they provide (underpasses and bike lanes) cost money..

&amp; yes the people who own the road is "us" and we elect dumbass politicians to represent us.. 

I am pretty flexible person but call me butt hurt or whatever and your gonna get gone.. Unless you want to start paying the bills....


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## not ngnrd-PE (Sep 27, 2013)

OK, so dumbass and butt-hurt are both off the table. Nice to know where the line is...


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## sycamore PE (Sep 27, 2013)

I honestly wouldn't see a problem with requiring all cyclists over 16 to pay a registration. Many would ignore a req't like that, but some would comply. In a way, we already do this with bike passes for state trails. I also think bikes can and should be ticketed for traffic violations. Bicyclists break the rules for the same reason drivers do, it gets them where they're going faster and they can get away with it.


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## knight1fox3 (Sep 27, 2013)

Dexman PE said:


> Capt Worley PE said:
> 
> 
> > ^LOL,
> ...


For sure!


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 27, 2013)

Fascinating Worley trivia for the day: The Good Roads movement was begun by and for bicyclists.


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## Sapper PE LS (Sep 27, 2013)

knight1fox3 said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> > Capt Worley PE said:
> ...


I was standing in line at lunch when I read that butt-hurt comment and chuckled, I knew what was coming... if I wasn't about to order, I would have done him a favor and edited his response before RG saw it, but... well, he gets on my nerves, so Junior Bacon Cheeseburger came first.


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## Sapper PE LS (Sep 27, 2013)

What the heck is wrong with EB.com and the multiple posts and buttons not working and crazy stuff when trying to post pictures.

I'm getting all butt-hurt about it.


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## sycamore PE (Sep 27, 2013)

Sapper said:


> What the heck is wrong with EB.com and the multiple posts and buttons not working and crazy stuff when trying to post pictures.
> 
> I'm getting all butt-hurt about it.


I thought I was just image-posting incompetent, so I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one having trouble. I feel less incompetent now.


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## knight1fox3 (Sep 27, 2013)

It has to be something on IP Board's end. I'm checking their tech. support forums.


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## Road Guy (Sep 27, 2013)

chrome is giving a double click...its google stealing your sole


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## Dexman PE PMP (Sep 27, 2013)

Sapper said:


> What the heck is wrong with EB.com and the multiple posts and buttons not working and crazy stuff when trying to post pictures.
> 
> I'm getting all butt-hurt about it.


Once you hit post, just refresh the page. It should be posted.


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## mudpuppy (Sep 28, 2013)

I ride a bike quite a bit, and there are some really bad riders out there that need to be ticketed or have their drivers licenses revoked. Here in MI it is legal to ride side-by-side but you are required to go single-file when traffic approaches.

I generally try to stay away from busy state highways, but I do occasionally ride on them. A wider shoulder really benefits everyone so I don't see the problem with the gas tax funding it. In any case the majority of riding is done on local roads, so as someone else pointed out, passing a state-wide law to regulate this stuff is ridiculous.


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## Capt Worley PE (Sep 30, 2013)

Sapper said:


> knight1fox3 said:
> 
> 
> > Dexman PE said:
> ...


Wise move, my friend. Junior Bacon Cheeseburger should always come before rescues of the inpertinant.


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## Capt Worley PE (Mar 4, 2014)

roadwreck said:


> Watch out Wolv, if some Georgia legislators get their way you'll have to get your bike licensed AND have a 4"x7" license plate mounted to your ride. Highlights of the bill include:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




What, if anything, became of this?


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## Road Guy (Mar 4, 2014)

did i forget to unban NGRD?


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## Dexman PE PMP (Mar 4, 2014)

Now that you mention it, I haven't seen him in a while...


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## roadwreck (Mar 4, 2014)

Dexman PE said:


> Now that you mention it, I haven't seen him in a while...


Well would you hang around after the owner of a website banned you for calling him names? Oh, wait...


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## Dexman PE PMP (Mar 4, 2014)

I wasn't banned. It just took me a day or so to realize my log-in had been deleted.


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## Capt Worley PE (Mar 25, 2014)

Now the idiocy has spread to SC.



> COLUMBIA, SC — A new bill filed in the S.C. House of Representatives would require bicycle and moped riders to get a permit from the S.C. Department of Motor Vehicles and have liability insurance.





> It would only apply to bicycle riders over 15 years old and only to those riders who rode on streets “whose maximum speed is at least 35 mph,” according to the bill.




Read more here: http://www.thestate.com/2014/03/25/3347252/new-sc-bill-would-require-bicycle.html?sp=/99/205/&amp;ihp=1#storylink=cpy


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