# REFERENCES FOR AM PORTION



## Sandra (Apr 2, 2009)

DOES ANY ONE KNOW IF WE NEED ALL THE REFERENCE THAT THE NCEES LIST FOR CONSTRUCTION, STRUCTURAL AND TRANSPORTATION. THERE ARE A LOT OF THEM THAT THEY HAVE LISTED. FOR EXAMPLE DO I NEED TO BUY THE $250 HCM 2000 MANUAL JUST FOR THE AM EXAM?

THANKS IN ADVANCE (I'M NOT SCREAMING IT WAS ON CAPS BY ACCIDENT)


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## Vishal (Apr 2, 2009)

As far as I know, Transportation AM section covers Geometry (Design) aspect and does not cover any operational characterisstics type questions. You should be good with AASHTO Green Book (highly recommended - 2004 version) and Roadside Design Guide with CERM in the morning for Transportation. I am sure that you can deal with Structural just with the CERM as it has several useful tables in the back.


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## Dexman1349 (Apr 2, 2009)

It was my experience that the CERM covers most (if not all) of the necessary information for the morning portion of the exam. If you go through the NCEES outline on their website and compare it to the table of contents of the CERM you will find most of what you need there. The NCEES outline was spot on as far as content of the exam.


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## jeb6294 (Apr 2, 2009)

You didn't specify what exam you'll be taking, but if you're not taking an afternoon exam that has some portion that's transportation then you should be fine without the HCM. For the most part the only reference you will probably use in the morning is the CERM. It's been a while, but I seem to remember that there are transportation questions in the morning so you still need to study it but they provide you with enough info that you don't need anything as specialized as the HCM.


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## Sandra (Apr 2, 2009)

oh yeah sorry, I'm doing structual pm. The reason I was worried about needing the HCM is because the CERM has questions that use values out of the HCM tosolve problems. Specially chapter 21 and 23 :huh:


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## Sandra (Apr 2, 2009)

Sandra said:


> oh yeah sorry, I'm doing structural pm. The reason I was worried about needing the HCM is because the CERM has questions that use values out of the HCM tosolve problems. Specially chapter 21 and 23 :huh:


I just noticed that I was wasting my time on chapters that are not geometric design chapters #$%^&amp;^&amp;*( They are on the study schedule of the other board and probably for people that are going to do transportation depth exam. Thanks every one for your feed back!


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## BPCW (Apr 6, 2009)

Sandra said:


> I just noticed that I was wasting my time on chapters that are not geometric design chapters #$%^&amp;^&amp;*( They are on the study schedule of the other board and probably for people that are going to do transportation depth exam. Thanks every one for your feed back!


I suggest only studying topics listed on the NCEES Outline. I don't remember a question that dealt with something not on that outline.

Also, the CERM (and I'd recommend having a CE Dictionary) should be plenty for the AM section...


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## init2winit (Apr 27, 2009)

BPCW said:


> Also, the CERM (and I'd recommend having a CE Dictionary) should be plenty for the AM section...



I wish I would've brought my 2004 Green Book for the AM portion. I can think of one question that the CERM didn't cover.


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## Adrock (Apr 27, 2009)

init2winit said:


> I wish I would've brought my 2004 Green Book for the AM portion. I can think of one question that the CERM didn't cover.



Ya that pissed me off too. Why would they ask something so specific like that and why wasn't it in the CERM?


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## mattsffrd (Apr 28, 2009)

i know which question you're talking about, luckily i was doing trans. PM so i had the green book lol. yeah i'm really surprised they would ask that though...maybe they'll toss the question if too many people got it wrong


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## pugsx (Apr 28, 2009)

init2winit said:


> I wish I would've brought my 2004 Green Book for the AM portion. I can think of one question that the CERM didn't cover.



I know that question too! And I didn't have the green book! :angry:


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## soboman52 (Apr 28, 2009)

init2winit said:


> I wish I would've brought my 2004 Green Book for the AM portion. I can think of one question that the CERM didn't cover.


I left the Green Book on my kitchen table and brought HCM instead. That question made me mad!


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## Santiagj (May 5, 2009)

I also remember "that question". That was complete BS. The only way to answer it was if you had the green book. I think it was unfair to expect people who were not taking the afternoon Transportation section to have that reference.


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## humner (May 5, 2009)

Santiagj said:


> I also remember "that question". That was complete BS. The only way to answer it was if you had the green book. I think it was unfair to expect people who were not taking the afternoon Transportation section to have that reference.


Had my green book, of course I was one of those guys who people grinned at for having 3, 6 gallon milk crates full of books. Flat bed cart was the only way to go!


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## RockyMtnHigh (May 5, 2009)

"that question" sucked without the green book! It would have been more fair if they asked for a partition coefficient for an obscure chemical.


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## SPSUEngineer (May 5, 2009)

yep question was unfair (IMO) to people not taking the transportation pm.

I've voiced my opinion to NCEES and suggest others do the same. Here is the link: http://www.ncees.org/exams/comments/index.php

By the way, I got the question correct because I had a Transportation College Textbook that just happened to have the information I needed. I still think its unfair and should not count against anyone that did not get it correct.


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## T2D4 (May 11, 2009)

Seems like everyone got screwed over by "that question." Which was total BS by the way, since NCEES specifically states you only need those type of references for the depth module.


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## livingwaterman (May 15, 2009)

Without saying any detail I can tell you that having references beyond the CERM saved me at least 4 questions on the morning exam....

I think the key ones are an enviro/civil dictionary, a basic geotech textbook, a basic transportation eng textbook that has many of the tables from the Green book etc..., and while I did not have it I really could have used some scheduling info text (i.e. project management material beyond what was in the CERM). I had a surveying book but never had to use it.

I took water in the pm and I had Wastewater Engineering, Gupta's hydro systems, as well as other water related books but only ended up using those two and the dicitionaries I had along with the CERM.

Everyones background is a little different. I can tell you in the PM I did approximately 2/3 of the problems without even opening any text simply from studying and in the morning that number was close to 1/2. I would not probably of passed with no references (closed book). I probably would have been passing but too close for comfort with just the CERM and passed with a cushion having the additional references.


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## mattsffrd (May 15, 2009)

i agree, there were at least 5-6 morning questions that i wouldn't have been able to answer with the CERM alone...i had another civil book, a civil dictionary, and another conversion book that i used in the morning, and the aforementioned green book that was necessary. and just studying problems wouldn't have been enough to pass either,you really need to know your reference materials. the other civil book i used was the chen book:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0849309581

i put that in the "how did it go" topic too, but its a REALLY good book to have on hand, i couldn't have answered a bunch of questions (morning and afternoon combined) without it. and the NCEES practice exam specifically mentions it so its definitely worth getting.


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## doveymum (Jun 21, 2009)

I agree with the others that you need more than the CERM. The day before the test I panicked and packed my college transportation book, a project management book, a construction management book, a properties of concrete book, the navy's soil UFCs (which I use at work anyway), and a civil engineering dictionary. I used every one of them in the morning portion. The civil engineering dictionary saved me on several problems in the morning and the afternoon.


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## SPSUEngineer (Jun 21, 2009)

I took every book I could (23 or so) and used a lot of them.

My method was to take the NCEES outline and know where to find each topic/item in each reference I had. I developed a reference sheet that had a shortcut to each reference. This worked wonders for me and I think my chances of passing would have been diminished without doing that.

There were 5-6 questions the CERM didn't help me with and luckily I had other sources to cover them.


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## EnvEngineer (Jun 22, 2009)

I thought that I found everything for the morning in CREM except the transpotation problem being mentioned. I am not sure why but I had a copy of the required table, I think it was part of someone elses notes that were posted, or I just added them to mine since I was stupid and did not follow the outline when I first started studying.

Dont be stupid like me .... Follow the outline... that is what they want, it must be close to 90% accurate, there are a couple of strays but not worth studying all that extra stuff for.


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