# Will the exam report say you passed the FE test or the EIT test in California?



## melaniash (Jul 1, 2010)

Hi everyone! I'm a law student with a computer science graduate degree. I'd like to take the FE exam in California so that I can be eligible to take the patent bar exam.

Since the FE exam is also called the "EIT" in California, I'm not sure if the US Patent Office would accept the results if I pass the EIT. I understand the FE/EIT are the same thing, but I need to make sure that the patent office will be able to tell they are the same.

So could someone please let me know what the report says if you have seen the FE/EIT exam results in CA? Does your report say you "passed the FE test" or "passed the EIT test"? Does it mention the FE?

Thank you so much! I really appreciate your help.


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## sac_engineer (Jul 1, 2010)

melaniash said:


> Hi everyone! I'm a law student with a computer science graduate degree. I'd like to take the FE exam in California so that I can be eligible to take the patent bar exam.
> Since the FE exam is also called the "EIT" in California, I'm not sure if the US Patent Office would accept the results if I pass the EIT. I understand the FE/EIT are the same thing, but I need to make sure that the patent office will be able to tell they are the same.
> 
> So could someone please let me know what the report says if you have seen the FE/EIT exam results in CA? Does your report say you "passed the FE test" or "passed the EIT test"? Does it mention the FE?
> ...



The FE exam is nationally administered like the PE exam regardless of which state the exam is taken. After you pass the FE exam, you are an EIT in that state, but I'm certain it's transferable to other state if and when you apply to take the PE exam. So, to answer your question, both "FE" and "EIT" are synonymous regards to the exam.

Keep in mind that the prerequisites to take the FE exam include 3 years of full-time enrollment in an engineering program from an accredited college or 3 years engineering work experience; however you need to pass the FE exam and have the required work experience, in addition to the FE exam requirement, and education (or equivalent work experience) to take the PE exam.

Good luck!


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## bbrams (Jul 1, 2010)

Your EIT license will show the state it was issued but will be transferable to other states. I passed the FE exam in Indiana and passed the PE exam in Florida. Florida did not question the validity of my experience or my FE exam results.


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## melaniash (Jul 1, 2010)

Thank you so much for the answer.

Would the exam report say that you "have passed the FE exam?"

Thanks! I really appreciate the help. I have the 3 years of work experience in a chem/protein engineering company.


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 2, 2010)

melaniash said:


> Thank you so much for the answer.
> Would the exam report say that you "have passed the FE exam?"
> 
> Thanks! I really appreciate the help. I have the 3 years of work experience in a chem/protein engineering company.



Im not underestimating you but I wanted to ask you what youre getting in to, do you have good mathematics/engineering background? cuz from your degree computer science is far off probably you might do good in computer course but it is only one subject in the FE Exam, if not it will be tough for you, you might consider going to school or not review class that would give you the whole whole idea what this is all about. Good luck.


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## ELEPE (Jul 2, 2010)

STEEL MAN said:


> melaniash said:
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Please, here are the facts. Statistics show that most (about 3/4 of the people) pass the FE exam on their first try. Check out here:

http://theprofessionalengineer.com/2010/02...xam-pass-rates/

What this tells me is that if you study you will pass if you don't you won't. The raw score for passing the FE has been historically shown to be a little under 50%. Since you have a computer science background your math skills should be pretty high. Math is about 15-20% of the test. You also have a good background in chemistry from your work experience, that's another 10% or so of the test. So that's about 25-30% of the test that you should easily get over 90% of the questions correct. I would say if you did any studying at all you should be able to pass the FE without much problem.

People who have trouble passing the FE seem to be those weak in the fundamentals like math, physics, chemistry.


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 2, 2010)

ELEPE said:


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you just dont get it, her case is different, she doenst have background in higher math like advance math, applications in integration and differential and more complex differential eqns, and these course are mostly discussed only in engineering degrees only, the second highest coverage involves Mechanics Stats and Dynamics, how can she tackle problems in beam reactions etc and this is related to strength of materials, and these topics are pretty much found only in engineering degrees only.

the stats that youre showing doesnt apply in this case and it is useless, those ones are applicable only to examinees with engineering ABET degrees.


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## ELEPE (Jul 2, 2010)

STEEL MAN said:


> ELEPE said:
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The OP has a graduate degree in computer science and work experience in chemistry. Computer science students are some of the most math savvy people I know. I don't know what advance math you are referring to but on the FE the math is about first year calculus at the college level. I didn't see anything on differential equations or advanced engineering analysis. He or she probably knows a lot more math than you do. You think those beam deflection problems on the FE require higher math ? They are all plug and chuck and requires nothing more than algebra. You must have taken a different FE exam than I did.


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## EM_PS (Jul 2, 2010)

melaniash said:


> Thank you so much for the answer.
> Would the exam report say that you "have passed the FE exam?"
> 
> Thanks! I really appreciate the help. I have the 3 years of work experience in a chem/protein engineering company.


The letter you receive would probably state something like this:

Exam ID: candidate ss#

State Board: CA

Examination: Fundamentals of Engineering

Exam Result: Pass

it may come from your State Board or from NCEES. Mine (which followed this format) was from ELSES, which supposedly is rolled into NCEES now or something. at any rate, i am quite certain the US patent office would have no problem with however the results letter displays it - it is a national exam, regardless of being called the FE or EIT. Good luck!


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 2, 2010)

ELEPE said:


> STEEL MAN said:
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youre funny, you dont know what youre talking about, ill just cut off from here.


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 2, 2010)

ELEPE said:


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youre funny you obviously dont know what im talking about, ill cut off from here.


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## ELEPE (Jul 2, 2010)

STEEL MAN said:


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No I don't know what you are talking about. Even NCEES says the FE tests undergraduate knowledge typically found in the first two years of undergrade studies. It is not a difficult test, very very broad but by no means deep. I gave a link to the high passage rate of the FE exam which clearly demonstrates that it is not a difficult exam. Those who don't pass over and over and over again clearly do not have enough time to prepare or are preparing incorrectly.

Maybe you can give an example as to what higher level math you think is on the FE that Melanie would have trouble dealing with.


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## melaniash (Jul 2, 2010)

Hi everyone,

I really appreciate all the answers and discussions. I'm just taking the FE exam in order to take the patent bar exam. I did a lot of small molecule drug docking, protein engineering and systems biology modeling in my previous job, so differential equations and the maths/calculus/probability/chemistry/biology stuff do not seem to be too difficult. I'm going to concentrate on studying the things I haven't learned in college, like the civil, mechanical engieering.

I bought the FE Review Manual. Could you recommend a good review book for the Other-General afternoon section?

Thank you very much!


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 3, 2010)

melaniash said:


> Hi everyone,
> I really appreciate all the answers and discussions. I'm just taking the FE exam in order to take the patent bar exam. I did a lot of small molecule drug docking, protein engineering and systems biology modeling in my previous job, so differential equations and the maths/calculus/probability/chemistry/biology stuff do not seem to be too difficult. I'm going to concentrate on studying the things I haven't learned in college, like the civil, mechanical engieering.
> 
> I bought the FE Review Manual. Could you recommend a good review book for the Other-General afternoon section?
> ...


FERM is enough, based on expereince the Gen pm is more in depth you need to be good in differential eqns, Advance math, themordynamics, engineering circuits, fluid mechanics, application in statics and dynamics, engineering economics. these things are new to you...good luck and hope you can pass and study them in three months.


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## engineerme (Jul 3, 2010)

STEEL MAN said:


> melaniash said:
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I completely agree with steelman. It is gonna be terribly difficult for somebody with a computer science degree to answer the easiest problems in statics/dynamics/thermodynamics/ and even electrical circuits tho this is somewhat related. she might do well in math and statistics part. but anyways get the FERM ,which is the only review material u need,and give it a try. I suggest u concentrate more on the subjects i mentioned, Good luck!!


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## EM_PS (Jul 3, 2010)

i would also recommend checking into this: http://www.ncees.org/Exams/Study_materials.php?exam=FE

those sample quests &amp; solutions guides seem to be more indicative of typical questions on the FE - the FERM is generally held to be overly 'robust' in terms of difficulty of sample problems; but thats not a bad thing, as overly prepared is a good thing.


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 4, 2010)

You think those beam deflection problems on the FE require higher math ?


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## benbo (Jul 4, 2010)

I passed the FE and I only have a vague idea what "beam deflection" even is.

THe test is designed to test the ability to work a broad variety of problems quickly. A typical problem is expected to take around 2 minutes, so if you are spending a lot of time on a complicated problem you are probably doing it wrong.

And as someone up-thread said, the passing score is generally around 50%. There are a lot of problems on the test. So if you get a problem that is particularly hard you can just skip it without much risk. For me, the key was nailing the morning session, which was really pretty trivial if you can read and work the problems quickly. I found the afternoon session a little tougher, but not out of this world difficult by any means. And since I was confident on the AM, I didn't worry so much about it (well, of course I worried - I always think I failed when I walk out, but that fear was misplaced).

You do need to be able to do basic calc and algebra quickly, so if you haven't been immersed in it a bit of practice is necessary, mainly to get your speed up. I imagine the level of math / physics / chemistry varies from CS program to CS prgoram. So the only way for the OP to evaluate her chances is to buy a couple practice books and try it out.

Plus, I think the FE is relatively cheap, so what do you really have to lose.


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## engineerme (Jul 4, 2010)

benbo said:


> I passed the FE and I only have a vague idea what "beam deflection" even is.
> THe test is designed to test the ability to work a broad variety of problems quickly. A typical problem is expected to take around 2 minutes, so if you are spending a lot of time on a complicated problem you are probably doing it wrong.
> 
> And as someone up-thread said, the passing score is generally around 50%. There are a lot of problems on the test. So if you get a problem that is particularly hard you can just skip it without much risk. For me, the key was nailing the morning session, which was really pretty trivial if you can read and work the problems quickly. I found the afternoon session a little tougher, but not out of this world difficult by any means. And since I was confident on the AM, I didn't worry so much about it (well, of course I worried - I always think I failed when I walk out, but that fear was misplaced).
> ...


and what was your major? engineering?

I dont think the FE is all about beam deflection. what we were trying to point out is, it will not generally be that easy for somebody in that major to answer questions on statics/dynamics/fluid mechanics,electricity and thermodynamics. however, u can for sure pass the exam with out knowledge in beams ,but it is always good to be ready for the hardest exam.


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## benbo (Jul 4, 2010)

engineerme said:


> and what was your major? engineering?


Uh, electrical engineering. Which means I knew very little about other branches of engineering. But you don't have to. If you read the specs for the exam, most of it is math, physics, chemistry, etc. General undergrad stuff for engineers, physicists and other technical majors. I know many CS, physics, math, or other majors who cold pass this test with a little review. I'm not saying a CS major will pass without some review, they may need a little more review than the typical examinee. But the implication of some posts here is that this test will be particularly hard for anyone but an engineer. Completely untrue.

If you think the FE is a rigorous engineering exam, I'm wondering what you thought of the PE.

Here are the specs for the FE:

http://www.ncees.org/exams/fe_exam.php

By the way, I started out as a Physics major, took almost all the upper division classes before quitting to go to work (I was a young idiot and quit with less than a year to go). I'm sure I could have passed the exam at that time as well. With a little review of course.


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## ELEPE (Jul 5, 2010)

EM_PS said:


> i would also recommend checking into this: http://www.ncees.org/Exams/Study_materials.php?exam=FE
> those sample quests &amp; solutions guides seem to be more indicative of typical questions on the FE - the FERM is generally held to be overly 'robust' in terms of difficulty of sample problems; but thats not a bad thing, as overly prepared is a good thing.


I hate to break it to you, but the double integrals are covered as part of multivarible calculus that most first year engineering and physics or math students would have learned in their first year of college.

Higher level math means topics such as partial differential equations, algebraic analysis (no not algebra of the type you learn in 9th grade), differential geometry, complex analysis, etc..

Then again, you should know the FE better than anyone since you did take it six time, that's about 5 times more than most people.


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## EM_PS (Jul 5, 2010)

^ I believe you meant to quote Steel Man  - civil DS for me - one &amp; done

y'all need to stop comparing 'beam deflections' already :deadhorse:


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## aldanf (Jul 6, 2010)

I took the FE exam – General option last April, 2010. Thanks God I passed - first try, I am civil engineering Major but I love CS so I also got MIT degree from the UK.

I have been exposed to some of CS math courses. It is very close to engineering math courses with more focus on Complex numbers and numerical analysis which you won’t find lot of question about it in the FE exam.

You will need to focus on other math topic such as, differential equations, Geometric Algebra, statistics/ Probability; also you will need to focus on other topics, as economics, chemistry, Mechanic of materials and stat/dynamics.

In your case, I think you need some courses to cover these topics, or u need at lease 6 mo to study it (not reviewing it) as I don’t think u have been exposed to it in CS.

Wish you Luck


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## benbo (Jul 6, 2010)

aldanf said:


> In your case, I think you need some courses to cover these topics, or u need at lease 6 mo to study it (not reviewing it) as I don’t think u have been exposed to it in CS. Wish you Luck


I'm beginning to wonder if I took the same FE exam as other people on here.

This is the UCLA CS curriculum-

http://www.seasoasa.ucla.edu/undergraduate...ter-science-b-s



> Preparation for the MajorRequired: Chemistry and Biochemistry 20A; Computer Science 1, 31, 32, 33, 35L, M51A (or Electrical Engineering M16); Electrical Engineering 1; Mathematics 31A, 31B, 32A, 32B, 33A, 33B, 61; Physics 1A, 1B, 4AL, 4BL.


Assuming graduate students must meet these elements of the undergrad program, and assuming most CS degrees are similar this is more than enough preparation to pass the test I took. With a little review but no extra courses.


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 24, 2010)

ELEPE said:


> EM_PS said:
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> > i would also recommend checking into this: http://www.ncees.org/Exams/Study_materials.php?exam=FE
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First let me tell you some factors why I failed and took it 6 times, for so many people in this board laugh at me, they dont have any clue why it happened to me.

1. I was educated BS Civil and MSc Engineering in the Far East. We are not educated to a level where the focus was passing the FE exam was the target, not like the ABET degree holders, they dont have that much excuse if they failed as much as like me. Our system was focused on Civil Engineering major subjects and our local board was based on this.

2. I graduated 15.5 yrs ago.

3. Some courses like Materials Science was never introduce in our Engineering curriculum, even Probability and Stats wasnt included, I learned this in MSc Engineering.

4. Our Thermo and Electricity wasnt that in depth we didnt reach Cycles and AC circuits.

5. I live in place where I have to do only self review, no PPI review or any review classes are held.

So in general it was a struggle for me, it took me years to grasp everything what the North America covered in their engineering course. I would say I learned it the hard way, I have posted my several study approach for the FE exams somewhere on this forum, feel free to read it, it might benefit you. Two things I would give you a recommendation.

1. Never give up, in the end youll be victorous, and I made it.

2. revise your strategy all the time you fall down and look back why and what went wrong with your study approach and develop good studying techniques.

good luck you can do it.

Steel Man


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## STEEL MAN (Jul 25, 2010)

STEEL MAN said:


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and lastly, IM not in USA , I live Im in Canada, this is my personal goal, if I will pass the PE Exam, this will be my third license as Civil Engineer in three different countries, I dont think anybody in this board has that.


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## miteng (Jul 31, 2010)

sac_engineer said:


> the prerequisites to take the FE exam include 3 years of full-time enrollment in an engineering program from an accredited college or 3 years engineering work experience


Are you sure? I think it varies from state to state. NH for example has no requirements, see http://www.ppi2pass.com/ppi/PPIInfo_pg_map-nh.html


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