# PE exam without the 4 years of experience



## bristol (Apr 29, 2015)

Hi there,

I am an internationally educated engineer (Civil) living in Alberta, Canada. Last year I passed the FE exam (on my first try!). Unfortunately, that didn't impress any employers so I am still working as a GIS tech. Nothing wrog with that except that we GIS techs are support people with zero decison power or responsability on anything (and the pay reflects that, by the way).

So, I thought, perhaps if I pass the structural PE exam I may get an oportunity with an engineering company. I asked the local enginner association (APEGA) and they told me that without the mandatory 4 years of experience I cannot take any PE exam. I wouldn't mind waiting the 4 years if I was working as an EIT doing actual engineer work, but since all my experience is on GIS... :shakehead:

I would like to confirm that rule with the forum because the person I asked didn't seem to familiar with the regulations (sorry if this is a silly question).

Thanks a lot!

Bristol


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## Ramnares P.E. (Apr 30, 2015)

You may want to read this and ask any follow-up questions. NCEES covers it quite clearly:

http://ncees.org/audience-landing-pages/international/


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## John QPE (Apr 30, 2015)

You're not even going to be eligible to sit for the PE. You need 4 years of engineering design experience, a GIS tech job isn't going to cut it most likely.

It seems to me you are working in the wrong firm if they aren't even giving you qualifying work to progress to the PE


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## Judowolf PE (Apr 30, 2015)

There are states that allow you to take the PE exam before you gain your experience, but you will not get your PE registration until all requirements are met. You can look over each state's requirements and pick one that may allow you to sit for the exam. This still will not make you a PE, but if you can demonstrate that you can take and pass the exam, it may make you desirable for a company looking for a new engineer. Best of luck!


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Apr 30, 2015)

California requires 6 years of experience, but you get 4 years of credit for an ABET degree.


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## snickerd3 (Apr 30, 2015)

just be careful with taking the test early. some states require the experience first so reciprocity might be an issue .


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Apr 30, 2015)

snickerd3 said:


> just be careful with taking the test early. some states require the experience first so reciprocity might be an issue .


good point. Some places require "4 years exp *AND *pass the PE test". Other place require "4 years exp *THEN *pass the PE test". It's a stupid technicality but could lock you out of some states.


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## bristol (Apr 30, 2015)

These are sad news to me as I am in my early 40's so hardly I will be considered for junior, or just out of school, engineer positions ...

So, I guess it's time for plan "B": become a Registered Land Surveyor. I've heard there is good money in that :eyebrows:

Thank you for your answers!


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## John QPE (May 1, 2015)

Just find a designer job somewhere and get the experience needed.


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## jeb6294 (May 1, 2015)

State of Ohio used to require 4 years of experience working under a P.E. but I just looked it up and they must have changed that because you still need 4 years of engineering experience that must be verified by your supervisor. Doesn't specify that it has to be under a P.E. You do, however, need to provide 5 references and at least 3 of them have to be registered P.E.'s.


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## glockjacket P.E. (Aug 27, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> snickerd3 said:
> 
> 
> > just be careful with taking the test early. some states require the experience first so reciprocity might be an issue .
> ...


Like what states?!


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Aug 27, 2015)

glockjacket said:


> cupojoe PE PMP said:
> 
> 
> > snickerd3 said:
> ...


When I was considering doing the test early in California, I was reading this article and a few others like it. I don't know of which states specifically. But the possibility of that being the case was enough to just wait and do it at 4 years.

http://www.nspe.org/resources/blogs/pe-licensing-blog/taking-pe-exam-early


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## ZcoreX29 (Aug 27, 2015)

Louisiana now allows EITs to sit for the PE with no experience. Mississippi requires the experience to sit, though Mississippi would still allow a PE by comity even if the exam was passed prior to experience gained.


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## John QPE (Aug 27, 2015)

This worries me .... PA requires you to have 4 years experience after the FE to sit for the PE, so I took it in MD because you can take with just 12 years experience. I was planning on applying for reciprocity when that 4 year gap is up. I'll have a total 22 years experience at that point. Seems like this is really mincing words, and not using common sense.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Aug 27, 2015)

I still don't understand how you can have a nationally administered test with 50+ variations on how it is implemented. Rather annoying in my opinion.


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## glockjacket P.E. (Aug 27, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> glockjacket said:
> 
> 
> > cupojoe PE PMP said:
> ...


Im not going to believe this until someone tells me what states and I can verify myself. This sounds unbelievable.


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Aug 28, 2015)

glockjacket said:


> cupojoe PE PMP said:
> 
> 
> > glockjacket said:
> ...




That's fair, it might be an urban legend that just wont die. But honestly I don't care enough to research it more. It was a scary enough proposition, that I waited for my four years rather than taking early in California (CA of course requires six years but gives four years credit for an ABET degree). I didn't want to get some point in my career with a shiny new project in some random state and getting passed over because I wouldn't be able to get a license there. Good luck.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Aug 28, 2015)

This 'kind-of' spells it out, but I guess you have to read it closely.

https://www.pcshq.com/?page=engineeringandrelatedfields,umassachusettspebycomityeligibilityrequi

EDIT: I swear I have seen in some sites where it talks about having met the requirements at the time of the exam, which goes back to my nationally administered test comments.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Aug 28, 2015)

From Florida, this one might actually stick...

[SIZE=10pt](b) The applicant holds a valid license to practice engineering issued by another state or territory of the United States, provided that the criteria for issuing the license was substantially the same as the licensure criteria which existed in Florida at the time the license was issued.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Post 1500![/SIZE]


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## glockjacket P.E. (Aug 28, 2015)

Ken 3.0 said:


> From Florida, this one might actually stick...
> 
> [SIZE=10pt](b) The applicant holds a valid license to practice engineering issued by another state or territory of the United States, provided that the criteria for issuing the license was substantially the same as the licensure criteria which existed in Florida at the time the license was issued.[/SIZE]
> 
> [SIZE=10pt]Post 1500![/SIZE]


Florida is on the list of states I'd like to get so I guess I'll be calling or emailing then. I'll let ya know what they say.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Aug 28, 2015)

Calling them is always the safest bet.


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## glockjacket P.E. (Aug 28, 2015)

glockjacket said:


> Ken 3.0 said:
> 
> 
> > From Florida, this one might actually stick...
> ...


Just called, the lady said it was not an issue. Didn't get it in writing but good enough that I'm not going to worry about it.


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## andrewm24 (Sep 4, 2015)

In Louisiana most forms of mapping are considered engineering as well as surveying. Only mapping that requires a surveyor as opposed to an engineer is boundary surveys. I am a GIS Professional and PE in Louisiana and Florida. GIS experience can count as engineering experience. However, if you want to get licensed in other states that don't consider mapping as engineering, you'll have to show other engineering experience as well. I had to re-write my experience when I established my NCEES record for that exact reason.


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Dec 15, 2015)

glockjacket said:


> Like what states?!


Ken PE mentioned in another thread that Ohio may be a state that does not let you get comity unless you took the exam after reaching 4 years.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 15, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> > On 8/26/2015, 11:11:36, glockjacket said:   Like what states?!
> 
> 
> Ken PE mentioned in another thread that Ohio may be a state that does not let you get comity unless you took the exam after reaching 4 years.


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Dec 16, 2015)

Good to know. I had always heard there were some states which scared me away from taking the PE early. On the bright side for everyone who would be affected by this, I'm pretty sure nothing has been built in Ohio in a while.


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Dec 16, 2015)

Good to know. I had always heard there were some states which scared me away from taking the PE early. On the bright side for everyone who would be affected by this, I'm pretty sure nothing has been built in Ohio in a while.

I went through the list, looks like the only other states that might have some restrictions is Minnesota &amp; South Dakota, but they both answered no with a qualifying statement. Rhode Island and Northern Marina Islands didn't answer that question. Seeing how short that list is, I kinda wish I would've taken it in California way back when.


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## matt267 PE (Dec 16, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> Rhode Island and Northern Marina Islands didn't answer that question.


RI probably didn't understand the question.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> Good to know. I had always heard there were some states which scared me away from taking the PE early. On the bright side for everyone who would be affected by this, I'm pretty sure nothing has been built in Ohio in a while.


Ohio is no where near as bad as what people think. We have our problems, but having lived and visited a lot of areas in this country, it's no different than any other areas.

Besides, Cedar Point is only 30 minutes from my house. Best park in the country!


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Dec 16, 2015)

Ken PE 3.0 said:


> Ohio is no where near as bad as what people think. We have our problems, but having lived and visited a lot of areas in this country, it's no different than any other areas.
> 
> Besides, Cedar Point is only 30 minutes from my house. Best park in the country!


I live in Kansas, have to take the shot while I can.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> > 1 minute ago, Ken PE 3.0 said: Ohio is no where near as bad as what people think. We have our problems, but having lived and visited a lot of areas in this country, it's no different than any other areas. Besides, Cedar Point is only 30 minutes from my house. Best park in the country!
> 
> 
> I live in Kansas, have to take the shot while I can.


When I was in the navy I had some kid making fun of Ohio, I asked where he was from and he said Idaho.

My response was "when did they open the gate to let you idiots out?"


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## glockjacket P.E. (Dec 16, 2015)

Ken PE 3.0 said:


>


I cannot trust anyone who has their font as comic sans


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

I do it to annoy everyone here.


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## knight1fox3 (Dec 16, 2015)

But mainly @thekzieg PE


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## thekzieg (Dec 16, 2015)




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## thekzieg (Dec 16, 2015)

Actually, I was wrong. That god awful font is "Choco cooky" and it's a billion times worse than comic sans.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

thekzieg PE said:


> Actually, I was wrong. That god awful font is "Choco cooky" and it's a billion times worse than comic sans.


When you start paying my phone bill, you can choose my font. [emoji6]


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## snickerd3 (Dec 16, 2015)

I like the font you are using Ken.


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## cupojoe PE PMP (Dec 16, 2015)




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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

snickerd3 said:


> I like the font you are using Ken.


Thanks Chewie!


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 16, 2015)

thekzieg PE said:


> Actually, I was wrong. That god awful font is "Choco cooky" and it's a billion times worse than comic sans.


Better???


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## freei (Dec 17, 2015)

cupojoe PE PMP said:


> good point. Some places require "4 years exp *AND *pass the PE test". Other place require "4 years exp *THEN *pass the PE test". It's a stupid technicality but could lock you out of some states.


If that is the case, I would suggest you to get PE first from the first one, and transfer the one stating "4 years exp then pass the test"


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## MI-Roger (Dec 17, 2015)

Ken PE 3.0 said:


> I still don't understand how you can have a nationally administered test with 50+ variations on how it is implemented. Rather annoying in my opinion.


There is a single nationally administered test because it saves each State money by not requiring them to create and administer their own exam.  Additionally it makes it easier, or should, for those of us seeking commity between States.

PE since 1983.  Early in my career I heard that Michigan's license requirements at one time were as simple as driving to the State Capital, signing a Log Book, and paying the licensing fee.  No exam required at all.  This was from an engineer who was at or beyond the standard retirement age when I was obtaining my license, so his experience may have been from the 1935-1940 time period.


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## Ken PE 3.1 (Dec 17, 2015)

MI-Roger said:


> > On Thursday, August 27, 2015 2:43:58, Ken PE 3.0 said: I still don't understand how you can have a nationally administered test with 50+ variations on how it is implemented. Rather annoying in my opinion.
> 
> 
> There is a single nationally administered test because it saves each State money by not requiring them to create and administer their own exam.  Additionally it makes it easier, or should, for those of us seeking commity between States.
> PE since 1983.  Early in my career I heard that Michigan's license requirements at one time were as simple as driving to the State Capital, signing a Log Book, and paying the licensing fee.  No exam required at all.  This was from an engineer who was at or beyond the standard retirement age when I was obtaining my license, so his experience may have been from the 1935-1940 time period.


Not so sure about the easier part of your statement. Some states might be, but others might not.


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## matt267 PE (Dec 17, 2015)

@Ken PE 3.0, that's a good point.


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