# How Much of Pay Raise after PE Certification?



## Env_Engr

Hi:

I just wanted to see what is the average pay raise that people typically get after getting their first PE license. Our company policy says that $100/month will be added to the gross salary. Please post the raise that you have received or expected to receive.

-------------------------------------------------

PE Civil - California

with Environmental section for the afternoon.

Exam date - Oct 26 &amp; 27 - first attempt

MS - Environmental Engineering


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## roadmonkey

HR in my company has been quoted at $1/hr or $160/month raise.

My question is what happens when I am signing plans for people who make twice as much as me.


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## Guest

This is one of those topics that gets a little play after the exam and then once the results start rolling out from ELSES.

From what I have read, I have learned:

1. The value of the P.E. license alone typically does not merit much of a raise WITHOUT an increase in responsibility or job duties (_e.g._ move from staff engineer to project manager); and

2. Typically if you are looking for a decent pay increase, you are better off looking outside of your company for good offers. I am not sure why, but many companies do not feel compelled to offer sizable pay raises 'internally' - they seem to save the big payouts for people they are bringing on board.

So, while you are waiting for your scores, I would spend some time to think about where you are at in terms of your current employment and then where you would like to be at once you obtain your professional license. I would definitely update your resume if you have even a 'hint' that you may leave - it is best to be prepared. Find out about when your next performance evaluation will be - use that time with your supervisor to discuss your career options with your current employment.

Just a few thoughts.

JR


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## roadmonkey

jregieng said:


> 2. Typically if you are looking for a decent pay increase, you are better off looking outside of your company for good offers.


Good thing I just a call from a recruiter this afternoon.


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## SSmith

I am not expecting any pay raise from the PE (if I pass it). The government works much differently in how and what ways pay can be increased. And this isnt one of the cases where the rules could be greased. Although there might be a small bonus for it as a performance award or something. But Im not holding my breath for that either. The big reasoning for my getting the PE wasnt for increased pay, but as a differentiating factor for future career progression as there are very few PEs in my line of government work in spite of a high number of job titled engineers.


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## mudpuppy

I got $0.00, but I didn't expect a raise. My company requires MS and PE for the upper technical ranks (non-management), and I'm hoping to get into one of those positions someday.


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## Jennifer Price

I was told I would get a raise anywhere from 5-10%. This is on top of my year end bonus. And then I will get another raise once I hit my one-year mark.


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## NCcarguy

I'm a contract employee.....I'm not sure yet how much raise I want! I'll post back if I passed!


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## ClemsonEngr

Anybody have a link to a site that lists starting salaries for P.E.'s ? My wife and I are planning to move to SC next year, and I really do not know what to expect..

I have been working for the family business in Florida. Also what benefits are normal?


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## Guest

There isn't a magic bullet because different industries and even employers within the same industry classify jobs and responsibilities slightly differently. The best thing you can do is to start doing a little research about the kind of work you want to do and use a search engine to try to match of the job description and responsibilities - do NOT work from the title alone.

Having said that, there has been some additional discussion under the tech talk threads of this forum. I pasted a link to a few of them below.

http://engineerboards.com/index.php?showtopic=3883

http://engineerboards.com/index.php?showtopic=3001

JR


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## maryannette

I got $0. My company prefers to reward a$$ki$$ers. I'm working on plan B! It depends on the company, though. Some organizations value a PE license. Mine does not. So, I'll find one that does.


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## Road Guy

wow that sucks 

I think you almost need a different thread for each discipline, I know people that are in mech or ee that havent gotten much due to there pe.

I think most civils should exepct something, but I offer to not feel like you should immediatley get $15K the same week, but if you dont get a little something something extra at your next scheduled review than I would start planning for something else.

but I wise old man once told me "You can have a PE, and still be a dumbass."


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## BORICUAZO

Road Guy said:


> wow that sucks
> I think you almost need a different thread for each discipline, I know people that are in mech or ee that havent gotten much due to there pe.
> 
> I think most civils should exepct something, but I offer to not feel like you should immediatley get $15K the same week, but if you dont get a little something something extra at your next scheduled review than I would start planning for something else.
> 
> but I wise old man once told me "You can have a PE, and still be a dumbass."



Congrats to Road Guy! He just reach post number 5,000!! :multiplespotting:

This week I had an interview with a world wide company, with one of their US offices. They offer $60k and if you get the PE proffesional registration, the rise wil be $2,000/yr = $167/month = $0.97/hr = 3.33% rise. Not enough motivation to pass the PE exam. Anyway, if you (we) pass, you are the owner of your PE licence.


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## Hockeyfan960

Although it really depends on the Company and how they are structured for responsibility of signing of plans, I have seen a $5k raise upon obtaining the PE and an additional bonus of $175/month in order to compensate for maintance of the licenses, no matter how many you have.

Other places I have seen about the same 5k raise to your base and then you are responsible for your "home" state license and the company pays for any additional states that you might have...

Again, it really depends on the size of the company, large companies have many PE's so they don't really need yours as they won't let you sign things anyways and small companies need your PE since they might only have one or two PE's in the office, so they would compensate more...

If you don't feel that you got what was coming to you you can always hit the open market, but the grass is always greener....the devil you know...and any other sayings.....

On a side note...love the new clock..!!!!...What Torture...!!!


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## JunkerJorg

Here's what you can expect to get from a large, private consulting firm:

Jack

and

Squat

Make yourself as valuable and indispensable as you can to your office. A good way to do that for young engineers is to become an expert on software (i.e. CAD, Revit, HEC programs, Water modeling) A lot of older PE's don't have the computer skills that a young person will, who probably learned a lot in college. I learned the HEC programs as well as CAD in school.

Another good way to prove your value is to try and be a "mini-expert" in a subject your office frequently does work in. It doesn't have to be super-technical either. Another EIT here got real good at putting together E &amp; SC plans and now he's the go-to-guy for all the E &amp; SC work.

As far as "PE raises" goes, though, don't expect much from a private consulting firm - you'll make the big money when you start bringing IN the big money. OR you become an indespinsable technical guru.


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## GCracker

Mine was in the neighborhood of 20%. How can a present employer not give you a raise for passing the PE? It has to make you and the company more valuable.


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## IlPadrino

Guasabara said:


> This week I had an interview with a world wide company, with one of their US offices. They offer $60k and if you get the PE proffesional registration, the rise wil be $2,000/yr = $167/month = $0.97/hr = 3.33% rise. Not enough motivation to pass the PE exam. Anyway, if you (we) pass, you are the owner of your PE licence.


Do you know how much beer $2000/year buys? I mean, even after subtracting out the registration and licensing fees (less than $500), the time studying (minimum 100 hours times the minimum wage of about $5/hr is $500), you still have about $1000 (before taxes, of course!) to buy beer. Yeah, if you go the microbrew route that could be as little as 100 six-packs, but if you go the cheap Genessee route, that's almost 400 six-packs.

You're an underachiever!


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## achristie

Pay raise depends on your company. My current company, which is a medium size structural engineering firm, gives about 5K to 6K in addition to annual raise (depending on your performance). But I know that some structural companies immediately increase the salary up to %40 if you pass your PE (SE I not civil PE) and start signing your own stuff...It all depends on the company but I do believe that there MUST be a pay raise if you are working for an engineering consulting firm. It is not easy to pass the exam and successful candidates should be rewarded.


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## udpolo15

JunkerJorg said:


> Here's what you can expect to get from a large, private consulting firm:
> Jack
> 
> and
> 
> Squat



i don't think i can agree with that. I got about 25% from a large private consulting firm (environmental). I'll admit that at least a part of the raise was related to align my salary with my responsibilities, but the PE gave them a reason to bump me outside of the normal process and for a larger increase.


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## BORICUAZO

IlPadrino said:


> Do you know how much beer $2000/year buys?



[SIZE=10pt]I respect if you want to flood your blood in beer; this can carry short/long term health consequences. Alcohol is not a priority for me. I prefer to use my money in a more efficient way.[/SIZE]


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## cocoloco

SSmith said:


> I am not expecting any pay raise from the PE (if I pass it). The government works much differently in how and what ways pay can be increased. And this isnt one of the cases where the rules could be greased. Although there might be a small bonus for it as a performance award or something. But Im not holding my breath for that either. The big reasoning for my getting the PE wasnt for increased pay, but as a differentiating factor for future career progression as there are very few PEs in my line of government work in spite of a high number of job titled engineers.


If you are young, I would consider leaving the government. I have been there, done that... Unless you are willing to go take chances in plkaces like Iraq and Afghanistan, you will never see very much money. You do get performance awards (at least in my case) of up to 1500, which was nice but you have to put up with a lot of inefficient people who just dont care because there is no profit involved or any other incentive for that matter. It seems the Government these days are moving towards Design-Build contracts anyways even in the Corps Of Engineers so many Engineers in the government have NEVER been involved in any type of design... That is why there are so many companies out there greasing their pans with the government's bacon. They just dont know any better. Sorry but it's true.


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## Jennifer Price

cocoloco said:


> If you are young, I would consider leaving the government. I have been there, done that... Unless you are willing to go take chances in plkaces like Iraq and Afghanistan, you will never see very much money. You do get performance awards (at least in my case) of up to 1500, which was nice but you have to put up with a lot of inefficient people who just dont care because there is no profit involved or any other incentive for that matter. It seems the Government these days are moving towards Design-Build contracts anyways even in the Corps Of Engineers so many Engineers in the government have NEVER been involved in any type of design... That is why there are so many companies out there greasing their pans with the government's bacon. They just dont know any better. Sorry but it's true.


As a young person who worked for the government, I agree. I did very little "engineering" and a lot of managing consultants. My job was not challenging at all and many days, I was bored out of my mind. I never felt like I had adequate training for what I was doing and unfortunately, my immediate supervisor, who worked his way up through the ranks, was very jealous of young engineers and didn't want to have much to do with me. When I left, I found out that he specifically kept me off a project that I was suppose to work on so that I wouldn't "take his job" (whatever that means).

With that being said, the particular government agency that I worked for gave awesome raises (15 - 20%) for passing the PE (not that I ever would have had to sign and seal anything with what I did). But the money did not interest me enough to keep me at that job - I needed a challenging job - not one where I was a paper pusher.


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## cocoloco

jenevans said:


> As a young person who worked for the government, I agree. I did very little "engineering" and a lot of managing consultants. My job was not challenging at all and many days, I was bored out of my mind. I never felt like I had adequate training for what I was doing and unfortunately, my immediate supervisor, who worked his way up through the ranks, was very jealous of young engineers and didn't want to have much to do with me. When I left, I found out that he specifically kept me off a project that I was suppose to work on so that I wouldn't "take his job" (whatever that means).
> With that being said, the particular government agency that I worked for gave awesome raises (15 - 20%) for passing the PE (not that I ever would have had to sign and seal anything with what I did). But the money did not interest me enough to keep me at that job - I needed a challenging job - not one where I was a paper pusher.


Yes, when I quit my job with the Government (Fed) they tried to offer me a GS13, tried to meet with me and my boss telling me that he may be leaving- GET THIS-anywhere from 6 months to 2 YEARS from now and that I could have his job when he was gone. They are running on low now because of bad management during the early 90's where it was hard to get into a government job, they were just not hiring. Now they will pay for it dearly, mostly to large Design (A&amp;E) Firms. They are antiquated, outdated and untrained. The best way to describe them is PENNY WISE_ POUND FOOLISH. Pay 40 grand to a guy to relocate 3 compressors (1 H.P.) but yet cant provide a printer to replace a 15 year old printer (FACT) for an Engineering office.I am not just saying that, it is true from my experience...


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## Capt Worley PE

^^^I quit the DoD in late 1995, and you hit the nail on the head.


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## IlPadrino

Guasabara said:


> [SIZE=10pt]I respect if you want to flood your blood in beer; this can carry short/long term health consequences. Alcohol is not a priority for me. I prefer to use my money in a more efficient way.[/SIZE]


How about wine, then? They say a glass a day keeps the heart attacks away.

Seriously, you could always donate the money... I wouldn't think even just $2000 is anything to sneeze at. There are also more reasons to licensure than just pay raise.


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## chaosiscash

cocoloco said:


> If you are young, I would consider leaving the government. I have been there, done that... Unless you are willing to go take chances in plkaces like Iraq and Afghanistan, you will never see very much money. You do get performance awards (at least in my case) of up to 1500, which was nice but you have to put up with a lot of inefficient people who just dont care because there is no profit involved or any other incentive for that matter. It seems the Government these days are moving towards Design-Build contracts anyways even in the Corps Of Engineers so many Engineers in the government have NEVER been involved in any type of design... That is why there are so many companies out there greasing their pans with the government's bacon. They just dont know any better. Sorry but it's true.


As an employee of a certified pan greaser, I completely agree. If you want government work, there is better money in the consultant side.


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## IlPadrino

Regarding Government Service, here's my perspective...

Be sure to recognize that different parts of the government will offer you a different experience. Regarding the military, there's even a big difference between the Army's Corps of Engineers and the Navy's NAVFAC. I think NAVFAC is a great organization to work for (OK... so maybe my perspective is a bit jaded!) and I think most would find it very rewarding. There are *VERY FEW* NAVFAC civil servants working in Iraq (unlike the Corps of Engineers, who own that geographic area), but I can tell you the Navy's Contingency Engineers are doing some great work as reach-back resources.

Also, regarding pay and the civil service, you "old-timers" should read up on NSPS which replaces the General Schedule (GS) pay system for non-bargaining unit employees. Who knows if it will really work as advertised, but the concepts are certainly sound.

There's certainly been a shift towards best-value contracting and design-build construction... but I'm not sure that's had a negative impact on the military engineering profession. I do agree you'll get a lot more "management" experience with government service than "get your hands dirty" engineering experience.


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## Capt Worley PE

IlPadrino said:


> Also, regarding pay and the civil service, you "old-timers" should read up on NSPS which replaces the General Schedule (GS) pay system for non-bargaining unit employees. Who knows if it will really work as advertised, but the concepts are certainly sound.


Buddy of mine works for the AF and said that NSPS is the worst thing he's seen in his career (started in 84). He says the corruption of the system is already in full swing and the troopies all have no faith in it. He said a bunch of older guys are gonna punch out at the end of the year. I'm waiting to see how much of that is talk.

I did look up where I'd be today if I had stayed with the DoD. I'd be making over twice what I make now. Still isn't wrth it to me, if I had to go back to Wormy Robins.


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## IlPadrino

Captain Worley said:


> Buddy of mine works for the AF and said that NSPS is the worst thing he's seen in his career (started in 84). He says the corruption of the system is already in full swing and the troopies all have no faith in it. He said a bunch of older guys are gonna punch out at the end of the year. I'm waiting to see how much of that is talk.
> I did look up where I'd be today if I had stayed with the DoD. I'd be making over twice what I make now.  Still isn't wrth it to me, if I had to go back to Wormy Robins.


Yeah... NSPS will only work if management puts in the effort. Regarding corruption, it can't be any worse than the civilian sector where favoritism is sure to get you promoted!


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## Capt Worley PE

IlPadrino said:


> Regarding corruption, it can't be any worse than the civilian sector where favoritism is sure to get you promoted!


It was incompetance that got you promoted when I was there.


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## cocoloco

IlPadrino said:


> Regarding Government Service, here's my perspective...
> Be sure to recognize that different parts of the government will offer you a different experience. Regarding the military, there's even a big difference between the Army's Corps of Engineers and the Navy's NAVFAC. I think NAVFAC is a great organization to work for (OK... so maybe my perspective is a bit jaded!) and I think most would find it very rewarding. There are *VERY FEW* NAVFAC civil servants working in Iraq (unlike the Corps of Engineers, who own that geographic area), but I can tell you the Navy's Contingency Engineers are doing some great work as reach-back resources.
> 
> Also, regarding pay and the civil service, you "old-timers" should read up on NSPS which replaces the General Schedule (GS) pay system for non-bargaining unit employees. Who knows if it will really work as advertised, but the concepts are certainly sound.
> 
> There's certainly been a shift towards best-value contracting and design-build construction... but I'm not sure that's had a negative impact on the military engineering profession. I do agree you'll get a lot more "management" experience with government service than "get your hands dirty" engineering experience.


I worked for USACE for 6 years and just quit NAVFAC. NAVFAC does not have NSPS yet (at least not the west coast). Some positions within USACE have switched. I do agree with you that it offers some opportunities not found elsewhere though. I can not say I regret it at all. God bless them old folks!


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## Dleg

JunkerJorg said:


> ...Make yourself as valuable and indispensable as you can to your office. A good way to do that for young engineers is to become an expert on software (i.e. CAD, Revit, HEC programs, Water modeling) A lot of older PE's don't have the computer skills that a young person will, who probably learned a lot in college. I learned the HEC programs as well as CAD in school.
> 
> Another good way to prove your value is to try and be a "mini-expert" in a subject your office frequently does work in. It doesn't have to be super-technical either. Another EIT here got real good at putting together E &amp; SC plans and now he's the go-to-guy for all the E &amp; SC work.
> 
> As far as "PE raises" goes, though, don't expect much from a private consulting firm - you'll make the big money when you start bringing IN the big money. OR you become an indespinsable technical guru.


Now THERE's some good advice. Goes for government service as well (especially bringing in new grants, or odd grant sources.)


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## Guest

JR


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## civilsid

Pay raises can be a funny thing. I worked for a bunch of different companies over the last several years because it seemed the only way to make more was to go work for someone else. Actually, there seems to be a surprising amount of turnover in the industry considering the talent level. I mean, it is like people coming and going at a fast food joint.

BUT... also consider that while I was being all money hungry trying to make as much as possible, my wife actually took a pay cut. She is not an engineer but she has a masters degree in counseling psychology. So, it is definitely not always about the money.

For her, it was all about enjoying her job and monetary reward was almost inconsequential (she took about a $8,000 pay cut to find a job she liked)

My opinion is "Same circus, different tent" so, unless there is something terrible about the work environment, I'm going to go for maximum pay.


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## MA_PE

> BUT... also consider that while I was being all money hungry trying to make as much as possible, my wife actually took a pay cut. She is not an engineer but she has a masters degree in counseling psychology. So, it is definitely not always about the money.
> For her, it was all about enjoying her job and monetary reward was almost inconsequential (she took about a $8,000 pay cut to find a job she liked)


IMHO, quality of life is defined by two quantities, time and money. If you have enough of these two resources to be satified in how you live and what you do, then quality of life is good. If you need to work to cover the bills and it doesn't leave enough time to do what you want, then quality of life diminishes. Similarly, if you have ample free time but no money to do what you want, then quality of life is less than satisfying.

It's great to be able to take a pay cut for a more satisfying and fulfilling job and still cover all the bills that come with life, as well as saving for a future, taking care of dependents, etc. etc.

Money is never a problem if you have enough of it.


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## civilsid

I think it was David Lee Roth that said money can't buy you happiness but it can buy you a big fuckin' yacht so you can pull right up next to it and party yer ass off. :multiplespotting:


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## KenC

OK guys, lets talk REAL $$. I have no PE or EIT. However that said, I bring in 75K here in Colorado in as an electrical designer. The pay is for what I know and can do. I have been in the industry for 30 years now, have a masters license and a contractors license, I QC EVERY P.E. drawings in the shop I work in, even the owners. Become an expert in the NEC, and learn ACADMEP or REVIT, and you will earn top dollar. Lets face it 100% of electricians getting their Journey license (5 years) know more about electrical engineering than anyone just graduating from college. In electrical its all about the code. Become an expert in the NEC and the rest will follow.

All this said, the big money will always be owning your own company and not working for someone else. Been there done that


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## Dark Knight

Guess we have another one.


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## Guest

KenC --

I am not going to put you down for your viewpoints - we all have a point of view. Engineering is about APPLICATION of knowledge. Learning a code book doesn't even remotely get you in the ball park if you don't have the education behind understanding the mechanics and principles upon which those codes are founded.

I would be weary of trumpeting your - I know more than you position. That is just ignorant.



KenC said:


> All this said, the big money will always be owning your own company and not working for someone else. Been there done that


I certainly do not disagree with your logic here.

JR


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## cement

I think that there is a certain satisfaction from achieving your PE-ness. but maybe that's just me.


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## Dleg

^^I like to hold mine in my hand. But so far, that's all I've gotten out of it. (satisfaction, that is)


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## Capt Worley PE

I'm still anticipating holding my PE-ness, but there's no word yet on whether they'll let me have it yet.


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## cocoloco

KenC said:


> OK guys, lets talk REAL $$. I have no PE or EIT. However that said, I bring in 75K here in Colorado in as an electrical designer. The pay is for what I know and can do. I have been in the industry for 30 years now, have a masters license and a contractors license, I QC EVERY P.E. drawings in the shop I work in, even the owners. Become an expert in the NEC, and learn ACADMEP or REVIT, and you will earn top dollar. Lets face it 100% of electricians getting their Journey license (5 years) know more about electrical engineering than anyone just graduating from college. In electrical its all about the code. Become an expert in the NEC and the rest will follow.
> All this said, the big money will always be owning your own company and not working for someone else. Been there done that


Please take no offense to this but here I am going to make a point. You say you have been in the industry for 30 years and then you brag about making 75K????? Sir, any kid graduating from college tomorrow and getting serious about learning the business and passing the EIT and PE will be making more than you in about 6 years flat. Like I said, take no offense....


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## Dark Knight

cocoloco said:


> Please take no offense to this but here I am going to make a point. You say you have been in the industry for 30 years and then you brag about making 75K????? Sir, any kid graduating from college tomorrow and getting serious about learning the business and passing the EIT and PE will be making more than you in about 6 years. Like I said, take no offense....


Ouch. Easy boys.


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## KenC

I live up in the mountains here in Colorado. To the best of my knowledge down in Denver the average pay for an Electrical PE is 70K in Colorado Springs it drops to 60K. I also took a big cut going from the field (union at 140K in San Francisco LU6) to the mountains of Colorado I am the third highest paid person in my company of 27 people. But like I said, the real money is in owing your own business. Billables are around 175K to 195K per engineer/designer per year. In California I owned a Design build company, but got tired of pulling teeth in order to get paid. Its the same thing in the consulting business, our accountant is always on the phone getting clients to pay.

All this said, what are people REALLY getting paid out there? Cough up the numbers guys. Now I know if you are in NY or California you will be making way more. But I wont trade my 37 acres and horses up in the mountains for anything down in the city


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## roadwreck

KenC said:


> I have been in the industry for 30 years now, have a masters license and a contractors license..


It would seem that 30 years of experience would help most people when it comes to salary.


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## Dark Knight

KenC said:


> But I wont trade my 37 acres and horses up in the mountains for anything down in the city


Neither I would.


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## DVINNY

Passing my PE got me $200/mo. increase = $2,400 /yr.

I agree with many above that the big jump in pay happens when you switch companies. I am with my 3rd company in the ten years since graduating, and I hate to think about jumping to a fourth.

I'd prefer to stay at one place but $$ will more than likely have me jump again.

I actually like where I'm at, but they have hired several in since I've been here, and given them signing bonuses, higher pay then me, etc. etc. and I have more projects, and more responsibility.

It's a shame that companies do that.

I guess I should have demanded more when I came, but at the time was still an E.I. and figured the P.E. would give me the 'clout' to demand more $$


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## benbo

I just ran a quick search on monster for EE's in Denver and Aurora. A lot of the jobs that listed salary paid over 75K. As for me, I now make around 100K (after a couple raises) but I'm in California so I make more than the mountains of Colorado. Although I am in government. When I was in high-tech in 1997 I made significantly more, plus stock options. And everyone I know in aerospace with a few years experience makes 6 figures.

Contrary to what this fellow says, a lot of highly paid electrical engineers have nothing to do with the NEC. Being an engineer is often very different from being an electrical system designer or electrician. The NEC is a codebook - you can look things up in it. It is a tool, just like the software you mention. Obviously an electrician or designer who uses it every day is going to have more of it memorized. Almost nobody studies this in engineering school, because you can teach this to yourself.

THe attitude here is the same I got from technicians my whole career (and I was a technician myself while going to college), and lately from skilled trades people. Every electrician thinks they are smarter than every EE, every mechanic thinks they are smarter than every ME. But you can't generalize. Some electricians do know a lot more than some EEs, and visa versa. But in general they are completely different jobs.


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## KenC

benbo said:


> I just ran a quick search on monster for EE's in Denver and Aurora. A lot of the jobs that listed salary paid over 75K. As for me, I now make around 100K (after a couple raises) but I'm in California so I make more than the mountains of Colorado. Although I am in government. When I was in high-tech in 1997 I made significantly more, plus stock options. And everyone I know in aerospace with a few years experience makes 6 figures.
> Contrary to what this fellow says, a lot of highly paid electrical engineers have nothing to do with the NEC. Being an engineer is often very different from being an electrical system designer or electrician. The NEC is a codebook - you can look things up in it. It is a tool, just like the software you mention. Obviously an electrician or designer who uses it every day is going to have more of it memorized. Almost nobody studies this in engineering school, because you can teach this to yourself.


I believe this is where the difference is. The only feild that REQUIRES a PE stamp to the besst of my knowledge is in the construction industry. One does not need to stamp any other drawings to my knowledge. Doing fault clacs/voltage drop and wire sizing and light fixture layout with photometrics. This is the Industry in which I am. Yes the other side of EE gets paid MUCH more than we do.

Part of the problem is back in the early 80's when they combined Electrical (power) with Electronics and called them ALL Electrical. They are as different form one another as English is from History. The real degree for a PE is ArchEng which is in only 14 universities according to ABET.

So tell me, outside of construction engineering, what good is a PE


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## benbo

I'll let other people argue the value of the PE, because to a certain degree, I agree with what you are saying - at least for EEs. I am not in construction, I deal with the power industry, from a government point of view. I was required to get the PE, but I'll admit I haven't stamped anything. I do think it is much more important in construction and related industries, and especially for civil engineers.


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## DVINNY

Cement said:


> my office is over 11,000' asl


I'll look down and try to see ya, because when I finally passed the PE, it put me on Cloud 9.

^^^ ha ha. Get it?


----------



## Dleg

benbo said:


> I just ran a quick search on monster for EE's in Denver and Aurora. A lot of the jobs that listed salary paid over 75K. As for me, I now make around 100K (after a couple raises) but I'm in California so I make more than the mountains of Colorado. Although I am in government. When I was in high-tech in 1997 I made significantly more, plus stock options. And everyone I know in aerospace with a few years experience makes 6 figures.
> Contrary to what this fellow says, a lot of highly paid electrical engineers have nothing to do with the NEC. Being an engineer is often very different from being an electrical system designer or electrician. The NEC is a codebook - you can look things up in it. It is a tool, just like the software you mention. Obviously an electrician or designer who uses it every day is going to have more of it memorized. Almost nobody studies this in engineering school, because you can teach this to yourself.
> 
> THe attitude here is the same I got from technicians my whole career (and I was a technician myself while going to college), and lately from skilled trades people. Every electrician thinks they are smarter than every EE, every mechanic thinks they are smarter than every ME. But you can't generalize. Some electricians do know a lot more than some EEs, and visa versa. But in general they are completely different jobs.


Oops - I was wrong: THIS is your best post ever, benbo. Well spoken. Cracks me up, too: I used to get sh!# all the time from my operators in the oil field because I didn't know anything about repairing and maintaining diesel engines. They would always laugh at me and say "and you call yourself a MECHANICAL engineer?" Most of them were smart enough to just be joking. _Most_ of them.

I also agree with much of what KenC is saying. Not that the way he first said it doesn't rub me the wrong way a little. But he's got a good point and I generally respect experience over certification. (I only got my certification this year, after 17 years of doing what I consider to be PE-level work).

Good call on trading a little salary for a nice place in the mountains, too.


----------



## benbo

Dleg said:


> Oops - I was wrong: THIS is your best post ever, benbo. Well spoken. Cracks me up, too: I used to get sh!# all the time from my operators in the oil field because I didn't know anything about repairing and maintaining diesel engines. They would always laugh at me and say "and you call yourself a MECHANICAL engineer?" Most of them were smart enough to just be joking. _Most_ of them.
> I also agree with much of what KenC is saying. Not that the way he first said it doesn't rub me the wrong way a little. But he's got a good point and I generally respect experience over certification. (I only got my certification this year, after 17 years of doing what I consider to be PE-level work).
> 
> Good call on trading a little salary for a nice place in the mountains, too.


Thanks Dleg. You're right - often people make good points but they come across the wrong way in emails and on the internet. I uderstand what KenC is getting at. And opinions on the PE exam run strong on this message board, especially since most of us but our hearts and soul into it. I've said my peace on the issue in past threads, I'll let other's debate that from now on.

As far as the other thread about Tom - well, he is the gift that keeps on giving around here.


----------



## Dleg

Yeah, I will leave the "what good is a PE" comment alone too, having also jumped into that battle before. It's impossible to sway people's opinions, especially people who do not have a PE and think it should not matter. I've been in that position before, but the truth is I am far better off with my PE license then I was before. Even though I have yet to stamp anything or even get a pay raise.

Tom - sometimes I think they should let that guy back in just for entertainment's sake.


----------



## PE-ness

^^It's called PE-ness envy. Very common.


----------



## KenC

I never said I did not believe in the PE, just in the way that it is administered. I will be sitting for it next year, my points are more toward the antiquated rules governing it. If the test is so consuming, why the disparity between ABET and non ABET schools in allowing admittance to the exam. You either pass or you dont. That said I restate my point. By law the only industry that a PE MUST stamp and sign is building construction, therefore if the main entrance is schooling, it should be limited to an archeng degree. Like I said before, a degree in glass engineering from an ABET school is crazy but the rules allow it. It is just as crazy to allow any PE in most not all states to sign any drawing. Their own rules invalidate and weaken the value of a PE to where it is almost a joke. There isn't an electrical PE I know (after over 30 years I know a lot) that wont defer to a master electrician every time.


----------



## Guest

KenC said:


> By law the only industry that a PE MUST stamp and sign is building construction


Incorrect sir.

There are other industries that DO require PE stamps. My industry - environmental remediation, for instance requires a PE stamp. Moreover, it is not your industry that requires the stamp it is ENGINEERING that requires the stamp.

Recommendation:

You better learn more about engineering before professing you KNOW a lot after 30 yrs. For instance, the definition of engineering might be good for starters.

JR


----------



## Dleg

I'm listening. Not entirely convinced, but listening.

correction - it's not just "buildings" but all other civil works that require PE certifications as well, including roads, bridges, traffic control systems, water and sewer systems, etc. I'd say those are pretty important subjects in terms of public health and safety. So, I'd add "civil" engineering to your list of only one worthwhile degree above, an all the subsets of civil, as well.

But having worked in other fields where licensing isn't even considered, I have a broader view than some here, and overall I agree. The value of a PE is pretty much zero outside the civil and building industry.

But after thinking about this quite a bit over the past few months of debate (you should read the threads in the general engineering forum), I am more convinced than ever that all engineers need to band together to protect themselves, and I can't think of a better way to do that than through the PE licensing system. Although, it certainly needs improvement to be able to provide value for the "exempted" industries. Nevertheless, as long as there is such a large proportion of engineers who refuse to entertain the subject of licensing, we will continue to be a split profession, and will continue to get paid second-rate wages compared to other professions who look out for themselves better, like attorneys and doctors. I'm not in favor of labor unions, but I think engineers as a whole need to at least adopt the "solidarity" qualities of unions if we ever expect to do better, as a whole.


----------



## KenC

I consider "civil" to be part of the construction industry. I also believe that all PE's at leat electrical must pass the masters (I do not know if other trades have masers exams) test as well as work with the tools on for at least 2 years. I work with several people from other countries and the all have told me that in their countries they must work with the tools on before sitting for the PE


----------



## Flyer_PE

I'm ok with letting the market determine the prevailing wage. I know what I'm worth in the market place and I know the things I have to do to maintain or increase that worth. The problem with the whole solidarity idea is that getting engineers to band together is a lot like trying to herd cats. I think we're independent thinkers by nature and that just doesn't square well with everybody pulling on the same end of the rope.

:2cents:


----------



## Dleg

^^So are attorneys and doctors, in my opinion. Yet, they manage to stick together.


----------



## Dark Knight

KenC said:


> I never said I did not believe in the PE, just in the way that it is administered. I will be sitting for it next year, my points are more toward the antiquated rules governing it. If the test is so consuming, why the disparity between ABET and non ABET schools in allowing admittance to the exam. You either pass or you dont. That said I restate my point. By law the only industry that a PE MUST stamp and sign is building construction, therefore if the main entrance is schooling, it should be limited to an archeng degree. Like I said before, a degree in glass engineering from an ABET school is crazy but the rules allow it. It is just as crazy to allow any PE in most not all states to sign any drawing. Their own rules invalidate and weaken the value of a PE to where it is almost a joke. There isn't an electrical PE I know (after over 30 years I know a lot) that wont defer to a master electrician every time.


I am sure you are posting based on your experiences but this is a big world after all. The engineers in your company, or the companies you have worked, are not the only ones in the world and for that reason a label cannot be used based on your experiences. It is possible that you really believe what you are saying. But that does not mean you are right. You will change your mind after passing the test. You will see.


----------



## Dleg

KenC said:


> I consider "civil" to be part of the construction industry.


Well, I think you're very wrong if you also then still believe that "architectural engineering" is the only suitable degree for someone who designs sewage treatment plants or highways, etc. etc. etc.


----------



## KenC

I should have been more specific. I meant to state designs MEP systems.


----------



## IlPadrino

KenC said:


> I believe this is where the difference is. The only feild that REQUIRES a PE stamp to the besst of my knowledge is in the construction industry. One does not need to stamp any other drawings to my knowledge....
> 
> .
> 
> .
> 
> So tell me, outside of construction engineering, what good is a PE


It is a matter of State law. In Oregon,




Code:


672.007 Acts constituting practice of engineering, land surveying.
(1) Within the meaning of ORS 672.002 to 672.325, a person shall be considered practicing or offering to practice engineering who:
(a) By verbal claim, sign, advertisement, letterhead, card or in any other way implies that the person is or purports to be a registered professional engineer;
(b) Through the use of some other title implies that the person is an engineer or a registered professional engineer; or
(c)  Purports to be able to perform, or who does perform, any service or work that is defined by ORS 672.005 as the practice of engineering.






Code:


672.005 Additional definitions.
As used in ORS 672.002 to 672.325, unless the context requires otherwise:
(1) “Practice of engineering” or “practice of professional engineering” means doing any of the following:
   (a) Performing any professional service or creative work requiring engineering education, training and
experience.
   (b) Applying special knowledge of the mathematical, physical and engineering sciences to such professional
services or creative work as consultation, investigation, testimony, evaluation, planning, design and services
during construction, manufacture or fabrication for the purpose of ensuring compliance with specifications
and design, in connection with any public or private utilities, structures, buildings, machines, equipment,
processes, works or projects.
   (c) Surveying to determine area or topography.
   (d) Surveying to establish lines, grades or elevations, or to determine or estimate quantities of materials
required, removed or in place.
   (e) Surveying required for design and construction layout of engineering and architectural infrastructure.
   (f) Performing photogrammetric mapping.


applies to those who can advertise for engineering services. You *must* be a registered PE to engage in the "practice of engineering" (unless, of course, you're working under a PE).


----------



## Capt Worley PE

Dleg said:


> ^^So are attorneys and doctors, in my opinion. Yet, they manage to stick together.


I don't think those guys are independent thinkers at all. Groupthink seems to be big with the lawyers I know...they are forever seeking concensus. I'm not saying that's bad, it just is.


----------



## C-Dog

KenC said:


> I never said I did not believe in the PE, just in the way that it is administered. I will be sitting for it next year, my points are more toward the antiquated rules governing it. If the test is so consuming, why the disparity between ABET and non ABET schools in allowing admittance to the exam. You either pass or you dont. That said I restate my point. By law the only industry that a PE MUST stamp and sign is building construction, therefore if the main entrance is schooling, it should be limited to an archeng degree. Like I said before, a degree in glass engineering from an ABET school is crazy but the rules allow it. It is just as crazy to allow any PE in most not all states to sign any drawing. Their own rules invalidate and weaken the value of a PE to where it is almost a joke. There isn't an electrical PE I know (after over 30 years I know a lot) that wont defer to a master electrician every time.


Soon you will be required to have over 30 credits of graduate level schooling (ie Master's Degree). I think this is a good requirement. I don't like the idea of going to electronic tests...

http://www.ncees.org/licensure/licensure_e.../le_2007_10.pdf

Odds are if you were a glass engineer, you would not sit for a civil or arch. exam. Most likely sit for the metallurgy and materials exam. This is why there are over 18 exams!


----------



## DVINNY

good point C-Dog,

and we have a big thread around here somewhere about the 30 additional credits, I'll have to look for it.


----------



## Dleg

It's in the general engineering section, pretty close to the top


----------



## DVINNY

Good call Dleg, we appreciate it

http://engineerboards.com/index.php?showtopic=4350


----------



## GSavant

IlPadrino said:


> Regarding Government Service, here's my perspective...
> Be sure to recognize that different parts of the government will offer you a different experience. Regarding the military, there's even a big difference between the Army's Corps of Engineers and the Navy's NAVFAC. I think NAVFAC is a great organization to work for (OK... so maybe my perspective is a bit jaded!) and I think most would find it very rewarding. There are *VERY FEW* NAVFAC civil servants working in Iraq (unlike the Corps of Engineers, who own that geographic area), but I can tell you the Navy's Contingency Engineers are doing some great work as reach-back resources.
> 
> Also, regarding pay and the civil service, you "old-timers" should read up on NSPS which replaces the General Schedule (GS) pay system for non-bargaining unit employees. Who knows if it will really work as advertised, but the concepts are certainly sound.
> 
> There's certainly been a shift towards best-value contracting and design-build construction... but I'm not sure that's had a negative impact on the military engineering profession. I do agree you'll get a lot more "management" experience with government service than "get your hands dirty" engineering experience.


I work for the USACE and I can tell you the only place that actually has challenging work is the ERDC.


----------



## Melanie11

I got 5% but I work for the government and it is true if you leave and go somewhere else you can do better it seems!


----------



## engr_tam

All we get is $100 per month extra.

But then, they were willing to pay for the prep course, the books, the application fee, test fee, and the first year's registration fee.

So it's not all that bad.

I think they maybe put you on a different pay scale, but I'm not sure. I'm happy with letters at the end of my name!


----------



## Chrispy

engr_tam said:


> All we get is $100 per month extra. But then, they were willing to pay for the prep course, the books, the application fee, test fee, and the first year's registration fee.
> 
> So it's not all that bad.
> 
> I think they maybe put you on a different pay scale, but I'm not sure. I'm happy with letters at the end of my name!


But if you do the math even $100 a month adds up -- as you will ALWAYS make $100 a month more (assuming you stay at the same place). Your next raise will be higher if it is percentage based, and so on...


----------



## Desert Engineer

I cant remember if I posted my increase yet, so here it is. I received a 4k bonus (I had to sign a contract that I would return a prorated amount of money, if I am fired or quit within 4 yrs), and a 7.7% increase because of a promotion.


----------



## LindaM

KenC said:


> I never said I did not believe in the PE, just in the way that it is administered. I will be sitting for it next year, my points are more toward the antiquated rules governing it. If the test is so consuming, why the disparity between ABET and non ABET schools in allowing admittance to the exam. You either pass or you dont. That said I restate my point. By law the only industry that a PE MUST stamp and sign is building construction, therefore if the main entrance is schooling, it should be limited to an archeng degree. Like I said before, a degree in glass engineering from an ABET school is crazy but the rules allow it. It is just as crazy to allow any PE in most not all states to sign any drawing. Their own rules invalidate and weaken the value of a PE to where it is almost a joke. There isn't an electrical PE I know (after over 30 years I know a lot) that wont defer to a master electrician every time.


I'm sure you don't know what an engineer with a degree in Ceramic Engineering does! It is ignorant of you to say that a "degree in glass engineering from an ABET school is crazy" when you don't even know what you are talking about! I have a degree in Metallurgical Engineering from one of the top Engineering universities in the country and studied with many Ceramic Engineers. One very talented ceramic engineer designed tiny glass microspheres that are able to be irradiated and are now used to treat advanced Kidney and liver cancer, which previously were fatal within less than a year! Without Metallurgical and Ceramic Engineers, many advances in medicine would never have occurred! Know what you are talking about before you offer your "opinions as fact."

I worked on several projects in the automobile industry where mechanical engineers had specified the WRONG metal for an application. After all the testing required (on the road), they came to us after the application was "approved" but was failing at an unacceptable level during manufacture. When we told them that the material was incorrect for the application (it could not make the necessary 180 degree bends), they didn't want to go through the years-long reapproval process. We had to figure out how to manufacture the specified "wrong" material with tighter than industry-standard tolerances to meet the demanding application, which still resulted in 10-15% defects. In the end, there was a recall on the engine that used those parts and the material was ultimately changed. ALL due to a mechanical engineer specifying the wrong material because material selection is really way beyond what most mechanical engineers are experts at. Half the battle for ALL engineers, *whether with PE or not, is knowing when they are working beyond their scope of expertise and calling in the appropriate expert when necessary.*


----------



## Nick

If there isn't one out there, can we start a poll on this topic?

How much of a raise did you receive? 1-2% 3-5% 6-10% &gt;10% or in $$$

Also,

Did you recieve a one-time Bonus? No $$ &lt;$1000 &lt;$3000 &lt;$5000

I assume most of us will receive word via our yearly evaluation here in a couple of weeks...


----------



## BoogieDownPE

I work for a consulting firm and we get $25/week bonus ($1300/year) for passing the PE.


----------



## Nick

I'm also w/ a private consulting firm and get a one-time $3K bonus and I hope  I get a pretty big raise here soon! :beerchug:


----------



## Sara

I am expecting a 20% raise. Or, that is what I have been told I would get. Let's hope so!

Sara :winko:


----------



## BoogieDownPE

I've been doing the private consulting thing in NYC for 10 years and the only significant salary increases I have gotten have been by threatening to leave and making my company match the offer or by actually leaving.

private consulting firms (at least in NYC) are notoriously bad for not giving their people decent raises. I've been at my current job over 4 years and I got 3.5% raise each year. doesn't really help when the cost of living is going up 5-7% each year. Once I get my 5 years and vested in the company stock ownership program, I am outta here hopefully with a PE to command even more money at my next stop


----------



## danm9

minimum 15% increase. i'm hoping for a bit more though. yeah right.


----------



## busbeepbeep

very large consulting firm, one time $500 bonus


----------



## Longhorn ChE 02

Same here... company policy is one time $500 bonus.

Plus they paid for the test, prep books and a course if you took one. Also, you get paid for the 8 hours you're taking the test. I think all that is pretty standard though... or is it not?


----------



## SSmith

Im a Engineer for the Army (TRADOC not USACE) and Im expecting close to 0% increase in pay.

Hopefully they will surprise me.


----------



## dmercado_PE

Longhorn ChE 02 said:


> Same here... company policy is one time $500 bonus.
> Plus they paid for the test, prep books and a course if you took one. Also, you get paid for the 8 hours you're taking the test. I think all that is pretty standard though... or is it not?


No bonus for me, but most likely I'll get a "promotion" (3-4% raise) to Senior Engineer. I paid for all PE related expenses out-of-pocket. My company reimburses me for the application fee, registration fee, and prep course only after I pass the test. Other costs like prep books, calculator, etc. are not reimbursed. I'm glad I passed. Now I can pay off my credit card.


----------



## JunkerJorg

So, in the boards opinion, what should the following person make for salary?

Civil PE w/4 yrs experience who works for large, private consulting firm (&gt;6000 employees) who also has a M.S. in Civil from ABET school

Take your best shot - winner gets a beer on the house :eyebrows:


----------



## Brianne

JunkerJorg said:


> So, in the boards opinion, what should the following person make for salary?
> Civil PE w/4 yrs experience who works for large, private consulting firm (&gt;6000 employees) who also has a M.S. in Civil from ABET school
> 
> Take your best shot - winner gets a beer on the house :eyebrows:


I think location would make a big difference.


----------



## jascia1919

It depends on you company. My previous pay is low. So my company gave me about 10% raise. (about 6k)

Then half year later I passed StrI, and in the salary review my company offered me another 10%. So that is 20% in one year. More than all of the raises I got since I started my job.

I feel it is very worthy to take the exam, considering company also reimbursed books, fees and day off for the exam.


----------



## JunkerJorg

Brianne said:


> I think location would make a big difference.


OK, medium sized city in the Southeast. Like Nashville, or Raleigh, or similar


----------



## dmercado_PE

JunkerJorg said:


> OK, medium sized city in the Southeast. Like Nashville, or Raleigh, or similar



78K base salary.

Am I close?


----------



## pucci

My company gives you a $1000 raise (payable hourly). Promotions are where you get most of the increase. My next promotion (whenever it comes) requires that you have passed the PE, so I am excited that I passed the October exam.


----------



## mudpuppy

Longhorn ChE 02 said:


> Plus they paid for the test, prep books and a course if you took one. Also, you get paid for the 8 hours you're taking the test. I think all that is pretty standard though... or is it not?


See this thread for an answer to this question. In short, the policies of different employers seem to vary a lot.


----------



## mudpuppy

JunkerJorg said:


> So, in the boards opinion, what should the following person make for salary?
> Civil PE w/4 yrs experience who works for large, private consulting firm (&gt;6000 employees) who also has a M.S. in Civil from ABET school
> 
> Take your best shot - winner gets a beer on the house :eyebrows:


Based on this thread your salary should be in a range with an average of $65000 and standard deviation of $13000.


----------



## JunkerJorg

mudpuppy said:


> Based on this thread your salary should be in a range with an average of $65000 and standard deviation of $13000.


you nailed it. standard deviation was right on.


----------



## JunkerJorg

dmercado_PE said:


> 78K base salary.
> Am I close?



Pfffffft!!! not even! :vadar:


----------



## dmercado_PE

JunkerJorg said:


> you nailed it. standard deviation was right on.


So 65,000 - 13,000 = 52,000 ? Wow, that was my starting salary out of college four years ago.


----------



## ingluis

Well... we just received our yearly "salary adjustment" 5.48% pretty much the same as last year... so obviously passing the PE (April 2007) and finishing my masters degree (Water Resources) did not count for anything.

Surprising to me since on my review I "exceeded expectations" (corporate jargon for: gets work done and then some...) and my supervisor is always telling me he doesn't want me to leave...

Hmm... Time to start looking at other options? What do you guys think?


----------



## udpolo15

ingluis said:


> Well... we just received our yearly "salary adjustment" 5.48% pretty much the same as last year... so obviously passing the PE (April 2007) and finishing my masters degree (Water Resources) did not count for anything.Surprising to me since on my review I "exceeded expectations" (corporate jargon for: gets work done and then some...) and my supervisor is always telling me he doesn't want me to leave...
> 
> Hmm... Time to start looking at other options? What do you guys think?


I went through the same crap for a while. I finally started making it clear what I thought my contributions and what my expectations were. They finally got the hint that I was going to leave and have come a long way.

you can always look. what industry are you in? location?


----------



## Tido

ingluis said:


> Well... we just received our yearly "salary adjustment" 5.48% pretty much the same as last year... so obviously passing the PE (April 2007) and finishing my masters degree (Water Resources) did not count for anything.Surprising to me since on my review I "exceeded expectations" (corporate jargon for: gets work done and then some...) and my supervisor is always telling me he doesn't want me to leave...
> 
> Hmm... Time to start looking at other options? What do you guys think?


I think you should be compesated: getting a PE PLUS getting a masters! That should bring a title change, not just a raise. Good luck. How do they call you, Sr. Engineer?


----------



## roadwreck

How about a congratulatory lunch and a pay *cut*. I was informed by my supervisor that since I am now a 'professional' I am no longer eligible for overtime, which I had anticipated, but I didn't get a raise, so effectively I just got bumped down in pay. Hooray.


----------



## SteveR

roadwreck said:


> How about a congratulatory lunch and a pay *cut*. I was informed by my supervisor that since I am now a 'professional' I am no longer eligible for overtime, which I had anticipated, but I didn't get a raise, so effectively I just got bumped down in pay. Hooray.


Wow. I would be checking Monster &amp; Career Builder on my lunch break after that.


----------



## cbchua78

I work in a small consulting engineers. I received year end pay increase .. not as much as last year but still a little higher than inflation rate. And then, few days later (last week), my boss called me in and told me they would pay me more on top of what they told me previously because I passed the PE exam. I'm happy  . It is a good feeling to know that they appreciate my work there. This morning, I received a congratulatory card with all principal's signatures and a gift card, too!


----------



## Dave

For those of you who did receive pay raises, was this an immediate effect of getting your test results? Or did it occur after you got your license number / certificate(s)? I'm trying to gauge whether my employers are ignoring the fact that they've previously promised a pay raise - it hasn't even been mentioned - and I am the first employee in this young company's existence to have taken and passed the PE exam while employed here. I suppose I have to give them the courtesy of waiting until the state issues my license.


----------



## cocoloco

Dave said:


> For those of you who did receive pay raises, was this an immediate effect of getting your test results? Or did it occur after you got your license number / certificate(s)? I'm trying to gauge whether my employers are ignoring the fact that they've previously promised a pay raise - it hasn't even been mentioned - and I am the first employee in this young company's existence to have taken and passed the PE exam while employed here. I suppose I have to give them the courtesy of waiting until the state issues my license.


I would send a nice/professional email (to add a little 'formal' tone). Its hard to hire PE's these days- I know of a firm actively looking to hire a Mechanical PE for almost a year now. You are already there and you deserve a raise. After all, it does present the opportunity to your employer to market their capabilities (which include YOUR PE). Go for it, I would think they would be expecting you to make the move. Remember if they can retain a PE at a lower salary they sure as hell will. It will still increase their marketability and profits and the only cost would be to YOU because you probably will have to step up and handle a bit more responsibility. Your boss may still be the only one stamping but you STILL have your PE... Remember- ASK AND YOU SHALL RECEIVE.


----------



## TXengrChickPE

We get a $500 bonus... but not until we have a certificate in hand. I have a license number... but no certificate yet.

But, I did get an 8% end-of-year raise... which I believe was based entirely on my performance review, which was in November. So, I had taken the exam (which was one of my goals for 2007) but had not gotten my results yet. I don't know if the raise was higher than what I would have gotten if I hadn't passed... it was a little higher than last year's end-of-year raise... but I started mid-year last year, so maybe last year's raise was a little lower than it would have been if I had been here a full year.


----------



## jroyce

I get a raise also and a job change to a senior engineer but none of that happens until the certificate arrives. Many of the states actually say in the laws that you are not a PE until you receive the certificate and license number. At least that is what my boss told me.


----------



## Capt Worley PE

They put in for mine as soon as I bought in the letter saying I had passed.


----------



## cocoloco

Captain Worley said:


> They put in for mine as soon as I bought in the letter saying I had passed.


I think that is why a lot of people were saying on previous posts that they had found it easier to get a higher salary in a different company. Lots of times (in bigger companies) it is due to the crippling amount of regulations, policies and procedures that the company has to abide by. Example: In my case, last year I had two different jobs lined up. One was with NAVFAC and one with a big A&amp;E. I was a GSXX and because I was not applying for a higher grade, the regulations prohibited the hiring manager to jump me more than 2 steps. The only thing they would be willing to do was give me a 17,000 bonus payable during the course of one full year. After that year went by, guess what? I’d be going down 17K in annual salary (minus the 3.X percent yearly COLA increase in January). The hiring manager said “Because you already are a Government employee, I can not offer you a higher pay at the GSXX. If you were a NEW employee, I would be authorized to pay you at GSXX Step 10 (which is the highest step per grade)… I told him I was going to go ahead and formally decline the offer and I was sorry it didn’t work out- took the other job… 


----------



## ndekens

cocoloco said:


> I think that is why a lot of people were saying on previous posts that they had found it easier to get a higher salary in a different company. Lots of times (in bigger companies) it is due to the crippling amount of regulations, policies and procedures that the company has to abide by. Example: In my case, last year I had two different jobs lined up. One was with NAVFAC and one with a big A&amp;E. I was a GSXX and because I was not applying for a higher grade, the regulations prohibited the hiring manager to jump me more than 2 steps. The only thing they would be willing to do was give me a 17,000 bonus payable during the course of one full year. After that year went by, guess what? I’d be going down 17K in annual salary (minus the 3.X percent yearly COLA increase in January). The hiring manager said “Because you already are a Government employee, I can not offer you a higher pay at the GSXX. If you were a NEW employee, I would be authorized to pay you at GSXX Step 10 (which is the highest step per grade)… I told him I was going to go ahead and formally decline the offer and I was sorry it didn’t work out- took the other job… 


I get a $666 (No im not trying to be demonic) dollar a month raise and I get reimbursed for my testing fees and periodic renewal fees!!!!!!! (Civil service rocks!)


----------



## Capt Worley PE

^^That's a hell (pun intended) of a raise. When I was in the silly service, the PE got you the big goose egg.


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## dfweyer

No raise here...but I may get a lump sum for all my PE related expenses (Whoopty fricken do!)


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## gymrat1279 PE

No raise for my masters or for my PE. I have gotten very generous raises each year that I have been at the company though. My boss did give me a $100 for both my masters and my PE however which I thought was very nice of him. He's also going to take me and some friends from work out for drinks. :beerchug:


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## MarcG

I'll be getting a 2k/yr increase. I work for a mid-sized consulting firm, that only allows a select few sign drawings, so I'm not entirely sure why I get the 2k/yr...But I'll take it :woot:


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## SteveR

To all the new PEs, keep in mind that if you are now signing drawings or even being represented as a P.E. (on your business card, ads, e-mail, etc), then you are accepting some personal liability. That should come with additional compensation. If you or your company screws something up, and you are associated with it, then you share in the liability, and your future career could be affected. Accepting that liability for the sake of the company's profits demands increased compensation.


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## meschroder

Well, totally unexpected, I got a raise. I got a $4k per year raise in November that was timely (it had been over a year since my last raise) and all the boss knew was that I had taken the exam. Nothing happened after I found out that I passed, the end of year bonus was even smaller than last year. My boss was on vacation when I got my number and seal, but yesterday he called me into his office and gave me another $8k raise retroactive to the beginning of the pay period. I still have no benefits other than two weeks of vacation and a week of sick time.

I still want independence.

Mark


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## Brianne

My company decided to hold up their promise to give me a 5% raise and reimburse me for my prep course and test fee.

Plus, it feels like I'll be getting another bonus by selling all these PE review materials I don't need anymore.


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## busbeepbeep

I got a $500 one time bonus, and reimbursement of the test/application fees. No raise. :BS:


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## boltz

I got 0% raise for PE exam. Only got the regular raise that we get every year. :brickwall: I did make lot of noise though. I will post again if things change.


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## Sschell

boltz said:


> I got 0% raise for PE exam.


Hey, that's better than nothing!


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## benbo

sschellhase said:


> Hey, that's better than nothing!


:lmao:

Be more specific, so we can quantify it. 0% of what? And when does it take effect?


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## C-Dog

My full time position will get me nil, but it will get me about $10 more a credit hour in my adjunt professor position at the local uni.


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## 1234oj

nothing yet for me...

but wish me luck as i wait with my fingers crossed as my superiors wait on the decision....


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## ACLakey

I recieved about a $7100/yr raise for passing....my bosses "IN" box just became my "IN" Box 

Andrew


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## bas

Finally got a $5k raise after 2 months of PEdom. I am pretty happy about it, seems fair to me.


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## Dave

Well I've officially been told that the company's finances are not currently in a position where they can afford to give me a raise to which I am entitled. Add to that the fact that I have recently become aware of the age-old story of other people making 50% more than me while doing 100% less, and you will find a very unhappy PE in your midst.


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## maryannette

The "age old story" will never change. I really think that if the company you work for is not willing to recognize your efforts and adjust your salary accordingly, you should look for an employer who will. You're not alone. I got nothing for passing PE. And, engineers are not really valued in my current company. I try not to let it bother me much, but I still think it's not fair.


----------



## Techie_Junkie_PE_LEED_AP

I got a promotion as a result of passing the PE, which included a 7.5% raise. Also reimbursement for all fees and and my review course with the EERM, so that's about another $1,000.


----------



## MEPE2B

In my experience, most companies will readily take a faithful employee for granted, and usually will not value the experience that you have gained with them as much as the experience of a new candidate who got his experience form elsewhere. It makes no sense really, but I have seen it over and over again. I think it may be a version of the grass is always greener on the other side. My pay was fairly flat for the first 5 years out of school, and I later found out that new hires with less experience were being brought in at higher pay rates. When I started being willing to take other opportunities, I found that my pay grew almost exponentially. If your company is hurting so much that they can't pay you what you are worth, then my advice is to look in earnest for other opportunities, and when you find one, take it. Then tell your current employer to pound sand. And don't let them buy you back at that point, because then they will really feel like they own you. There are just too many opprtunities right now for experienced engineers. Many companies just seem to reward employee loyalty only with an attitude of "he or she isn't going anywhere." My two cents for what it's worth.


----------



## maryannette

My company has created a horrible situation. To advance within the company, you have to wait for your replacement to be hired and train the replacement before moving on to your new job. That makes no sense to me.


----------



## MEPE2B

maryannette said:


> My company has created a horrible situation. To advance within the company, you have to wait for your replacement to be hired and train the replacement before moving on to your new job. That makes no sense to me.


I think that policy will ultimately bite them in the arse, because the employee worthy of advancement will get impatient, sail towards bluer waters, and leave them with nobody carrying that load, experienced or inexperienced.


----------



## rudy

I got no bonus and no raise for my PE. I work in the private sector; my company doesn't recognize it. I guess my bonus is that I get to keep my job with all the layoffs going around. I can't complain much. I did get a promotion last year, even in the midst of layoffs. I also have a very flexible schedule and can sometimes work from home, which works out great with my family.


----------



## MEPE2B

rudy said:


> I got no bonus and no raise for my PE. I work in the private sector; my company doesn't recognize it. I guess my bonus is that I get to keep my job with all the layoffs going around. I can't complain much. I did get a promotion last year, even in the midst of layoffs. I also have a very flexible schedule and can sometimes work from home, which works out great with my family.


I'm surprised to hear that there are a lot of layoffs going on. That is not at all the case in my sector, EPC of power projects. My company has a huge and growing backlog of work and are scouring for more engineers to try and keep our projects adequately manned.


----------



## bas

Yeah, we are a full service AE in OK and can't find licensed engineers and architects for the most part. Definitely not laying any off right now. Market still seems to be pretty strong.


----------



## chaosiscash

MEPE2B said:


> In my experience, most companies will readily take a faithful employee for granted, and usually will not value the experience that you have gained with them as much as the experience of a new candidate who got his experience form elsewhere. It makes no sense really, but I have seen it over and over again. I think it may be a version of the grass is always greener on the other side. My pay was fairly flat for the first 5 years out of school, and I later found out that new hires with less experience were being brought in at higher pay rates. When I started being willing to take other opportunities, I found that my pay grew almost exponentially. If your company is hurting so much that they can't pay you what you are worth, then my advice is to look in earnest for other opportunities, and when you find one, take it. Then tell your current employer to pound sand. And don't let them buy you back at that point, because then they will really feel like they own you. There are just too many opprtunities right now for experienced engineers. Many companies just seem to reward employee loyalty only with an attitude of "he or she isn't going anywhere." My two cents for what it's worth.


I agree 100%.


----------



## rudy

MEPE2B said:


> I'm surprised to hear that there are a lot of layoffs going on. That is not at all the case in my sector, EPC of power projects. My company has a huge and growing backlog of work and are scouring for more engineers to try and keep our projects adequately manned.


I work in the semiconductor industry. It is cyclical -- good bonuses during the good times; layoffs during the bad. These past few years, its seems that we cannot get out of the bad cycle. If and/or when I get let go, I'll be looking for a career change. For now, I'm enjoying the ride.



bas said:


> Yeah, we are a full service AE in OK and can't find licensed engineers and architects for the most part. Definitely not laying any off right now. Market still seems to be pretty strong.


This is the main reason I got the my PE. It gives me peace of mind that PE's are in demand.


----------



## Guest

As part of my most recent employee evaluation (which actually hasn't been completed yet) I was given a promotion and pay increase of 5.5% for having 1-yr of post professional engineering experience.

Given that my job duties remain essentially the same, I shouldn't bitch too much. However, I am still well below my 'market pay' given that I work for the state gubment. With this last pay raise I have hit my ceiling without entering the ranks of 'at-will' management.

The pay raise from :burgerking: is more significant because it draws attention to the 'good' job I am doing rather than the actually $$ compensation. At some point in the future, I am hoping to parlay that into a decent private sector job. Until then ....

:bio:

JR


----------



## Tido

Got a 10% raise for passing PE and a promotion to a senior level. I still think my market value is higher but no complaint here especially because of the fact that I live in one of the most desirable areas of Forida where a ton of people in other states save all year long just to come here for a week and enjoy the beach that I walk/run every morning in the weekends, and the fact that I do really enjoy my work with all its challenges and I like the working atmospher including my great boss. So, I guess I am just thankfull and happy..

Good luck to everyone..


----------



## GT ME

This is the problem I have with being an engineer for a company.

I currently make 128k base for a Fortune 10 firm with 1st tier MBA &amp; Engineering degrees, and I hope to quit my job in a year or two -- the poor engineers make squat.

With the business I operate parttime with fulltime workers, I garnish $250 to $350 an hour doing HVACR engineering &amp; contracting; for example, my company designed and installed a 1.5 MBTU Boiler where I cleared 35k for 1 week's work -- that some sexy cheese. I'm also getting acquainted with large Law firms where I can make $1000 to $1500 a day doing engineering consulting.

I have a PE, and I know where the money is -- not being an employee.



udpolo15 said:


> I went through the same crap for a while. I finally started making it clear what I thought my contributions and what my expectations were. They finally got the hint that I was going to leave and have come a long way.
> you can always look. what industry are you in? location?


----------



## maryannette

GT ME said:


> I have a PE, and I know where the money is -- not being an employee.


I don't get people who think that life is just all about the money.


----------



## Flyer_PE

mary said:


> I don't get people who think that life is just all about the money.



The interesting part is that if all they are interested in is the money, they usually never get where they want to go and they are never happy. Like anybody, I would like to make more than I do right now. However, the price for making more is spending less time with my family. Time with my son at this age can't be bought later. In short, I'm a happy employee.


----------



## Mike in Gastonia

mary said:


> I don't get *GT ME*.


There. I fixed your post for you. Now it makes sense........


----------



## maryannette

mary said:


> I don't WANT GT_ME


There, I really fixed it.


----------



## Desert Engineer

GT ME said:


> This is the problem I have with being an engineer for a company.
> I currently make 128k base for a Fortune 10 firm with 1st tier MBA &amp; Engineering degrees, and I hope to quit my job in a year or two -- the poor engineers make squat.
> 
> With the business I operate parttime with fulltime workers, I garnish $250 to $350 an hour doing HVACR engineering &amp; contracting; for example, my company designed and installed a 1.5 MBTU Boiler where I cleared 35k for 1 week's work -- that some sexy cheese. I'm also getting acquainted with large Law firms where I can make $1000 to $1500 a day doing engineering consulting.
> 
> I have a PE, and I know where the money is -- not being an employee.



According to your post, assuming it took you about 5 minutes to read the board and write the post, we all owe you about $25 (minimum, it really should be more) for the pearls of wisdom. I think we should all start paying you for your insights. I'll start passing the hat around the board.

Have you ever thought of becoming a motivational speaker? Or maybe even write a book, about your success? You could preview it on the board, we might learn something from you (seriously you should start a new topic about your life). I would certainly be inspired by your story, and maybe become more successful in my life.


----------



## squishles10

:banhim: I'm tired of listening to this crap. There are more than a few people on this board making more than him and they aren't on here spewing about it.


----------



## MEPE2B

He is truly a legend in his own mind.


----------



## maryannette

Desert Engineer said:


> According to your post, assuming it took you about 5 minutes to read the board and write the post, we all owe you about $25 (minimum, it really should be more) for the pearls of wisdom. I think we should all start paying you for your insights. I'll start passing the hat around the board.


We have NO BUDGET to pay for unsolicited comments. I guess the polite thing to do would be to say, "Thank you, GT ME, for your advice, but you are losing money here since we do not offer compensation. Someone with your earning potential should use every opportunity to increase income. We wish you the best in maximizing your income elsewhere."


----------



## MEPE2B

mary said:


> We have NO BUDGET to pay for unsolicited comments. I guess the polite thing to do would be to say, "Thank you, GT ME, for your advice, but you are losing money here since we do not offer compensation. Someone with your earning potential should use every opportunity to increase income. We wish you the best in maximizing your income elsewhere."


Very good point. How does a man of such extraordinary importance have the time to squander with such plebian discourse? Undoubtedly, he could be earning thousands of dollars in the minutes he has graciously offered to us pro-bono.


----------



## GT ME

The most important thing is you love what you do, and I love being a business owner for a fully licensed Mechanical Engineering &amp; Contracting Co.

I'm confident my current business will be worth several million in 5 to 10 years (I sold my first business for nearly a mill in 97) -- I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.

You sound like an disgruntled dependent employee Mike  :Locolaugh:



Mike in Gastonia said:


> There. I fixed your post for you. Now it makes sense........


----------



## PE-ness

GT ME said:


> I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.


From what I understand, most of us diminish in size in our 50s anyway, so what's the big deal? Have you found the secret? I sincerely hope you don't believe those e-mails that promise otherwise, because in my experience, those can actually hasten the down-sizing, and in worst-case-scenario, make it fall off!

You're my hero, GT_ME. I don't care what enyone else says. When I read your messages, I hold my head high, and proudly proclaim to everyone, that you're one of us. Or one of me. If you get what I am saying.


----------



## maryannette

GT ME said:


> I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.


OH MY GOD!!!!!!! I'm 50. Do you think I'm in danger of being downsized? (Not in the way you were, PE-ness. That stuff won't happen to me.)

Anyway, I'm not worried about being 50 and easily replaced. I plan to retire some day not too far in the future and would hate to mess up my leisure worrying that I might have left a gap that cannot be filled.

Let's face it, every one of us will some day leave our career. We will either retire, quit, get fired, get laid off, or die. And, whatever gap is left will be filled by someone else.

When I die, I hope I am remembered more for the stuff that is not related to engineering and businesss. I would hate to think that my greatest contribution in life was creating a multi-million-dollar engineering firm. The risks I prefer to take are not about the money. They are about life.


----------



## Mike in Gastonia

GT ME said:


> The most important thing is you love what you do, and I love being a business owner for a fully licensed Mechanical Engineering &amp; Contracting Co.
> I'm confident my current business will be worth several million in 5 to 10 years (I sold my first business for nearly a mill in 97) -- I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.
> 
> You sound like an disgruntled dependent employee Mike :Locolaugh:


Yeah. I'm disgruntled. Maybe if I start make absurd (read: made up) comments about my career and proudly beat my chest and keep telling everyone how great I am and how much better I am than they are, I won't be so disgruntled. There's hope!!


----------



## CbusPaul

This guy is great reading. However, isn't this super-engineer with multimillion dollar salary the same guy who wondered why the conversion is 1 psi = 2.31 ft/ psi.


----------



## CivilPEHopeful

GT ME said:


> The most important thing is you love what you do, and I love being a business owner for a fully licensed Mechanical Engineering &amp; Contracting Co.
> I'm confident my current business will be worth several million in 5 to 10 years (I sold my first business for nearly a mill in 97) -- I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.
> 
> You sound like an disgruntled dependent employee Mike :Locolaugh:


I received a 5% raise and placed into a higher pay scale. I work for a municipality as does my wife. Together we make pretty good wages and can feel like we have made it in life. I have worked in the private sector for 11 years and now 3 in the public. I have come across a few small business owners that either went under or just sold it off because they had to work like dogs to keep it going. I'm sure there was a great feeling of acccomplishment when they were succeeding initially, but at some point just had to step back and ask themselves if it was really worth it. I personally like what I do, the office enviornment i'm in and feel challenged every day. I would never knock anyone for what direction they take in life, especially if they are enjoying it. Where would this country be with out those crazy dreamers that start thier own business (Bill Gates, Henry Ford, the Rubiks Cube guy) I know by my personallity that starting my own business would keep me up at night, and I don't feel any amount of money would allow me to enjoy that kind of life style. I think GT ME should be proud of what he has accomplished, but labling others as poor engineers is probably out of bounds. A lot of us may not have the bank account he does, but we don't feel poor. I like leaving at the same time alomst every day and picking up my daughter from school and finding out how her day went. I get to make her dinner every night, we play with our dog, help her with homework and squeeze in a little sponge bob square pants. I almost get a speeding ticket at times racing to get to her school. To me, those are the most valuable items in my life. :unitedstates:


----------



## Tido

CivilPEHopeful said:


> I received a 5% raise and placed into a higher pay scale. I work for a municipality as does my wife. Together we make pretty good wages and can feel like we have made it in life. I have worked in the private sector for 11 years and now 3 in the public. I have come across a few small business owners that either went under or just sold it off because they had to work like dogs to keep it going. I'm sure there was a great feeling of acccomplishment when they were succeeding initially, but at some point just had to step back and ask themselves if it was really worth it. I personally like what I do, the office enviornment i'm in and feel challenged every day. I would never knock anyone for what direction they take in life, especially if they are enjoying it. Where would this country be with out those crazy dreamers that start thier own business (Bill Gates, Henry Ford, the Rubiks Cube guy) I know by my personallity that starting my own business would keep me up at night, and I don't feel any amount of money would allow me to enjoy that kind of life style. I think GT ME should be proud of what he has accomplished, but labling others as poor engineers is probably out of bounds. A lot of us may not have the bank account he does, but we don't feel poor. I like leaving at the same time alomst every day and picking up my daughter from school and finding out how her day went. I get to make her dinner every night, we play with our dog, help her with homework and squeeze in a little sponge bob square pants. I almost get a speeding ticket at times racing to get to her school. To me, those are the most valuable items in my life. :unitedstates:


This post?.........priceless!


----------



## Dleg

^^I agree!! Plus, there's room enough and need for everyone in this world. There will always be a need for folks like CivilPEHopeful and myself, who prefer the satisfaction of public service, and the free time to raise our children to the best of our abilities.

And there will always be a need for the hard-core entrepreneur, and the overpriveleged, undersupervised, Paris Hilton-like chlidren that they bring into the world for our entertainment.


----------



## Dark Knight

CivilPEHopeful said:


> I received a 5% raise and placed into a higher pay scale. I work for a municipality as does my wife. Together we make pretty good wages and can feel like we have made it in life. I have worked in the private sector for 11 years and now 3 in the public. I have come across a few small business owners that either went under or just sold it off because they had to work like dogs to keep it going. I'm sure there was a great feeling of acccomplishment when they were succeeding initially, but at some point just had to step back and ask themselves if it was really worth it. I personally like what I do, the office enviornment i'm in and feel challenged every day. I would never knock anyone for what direction they take in life, especially if they are enjoying it. Where would this country be with out those crazy dreamers that start thier own business (Bill Gates, Henry Ford, the Rubiks Cube guy) I know by my personallity that starting my own business would keep me up at night, and I don't feel any amount of money would allow me to enjoy that kind of life style. I think GT ME should be proud of what he has accomplished, but labling others as poor engineers is probably out of bounds. A lot of us may not have the bank account he does, but we don't feel poor. I like leaving at the same time alomst every day and picking up my daughter from school and finding out how her day went. I get to make her dinner every night, we play with our dog, help her with homework and squeeze in a little sponge bob square pants. I almost get a speeding ticket at times racing to get to her school. To me, those are the most valuable items in my life. :unitedstates:


My respect to you. One of the best and most honest posts I have read in this Board.


----------



## kellyhayes

> How about a congratulatory lunch and a pay cut. I was informed by my supervisor that since I am now a 'professional' I am no longer eligible for overtime, which I had anticipated, but I didn't get a raise, so effectively I just got bumped down in pay. Hooray.


WOWWW....this is new...  This always happen when we are professional. Smetimes people will abuse us. I've been working for 4 years now yet my salary still the same since the 1st year. 

regards,

kelly

_______________

Simulation pret


----------



## Photo Engineer

I got a 0% annual raise and a 0% one time bonus, but significant amounts of prestige from the other Professional Engineers in my group. My company paid $0 toward my P.E. license and $0 toward my PE application.

But my company has some other awesome benefits (paid overtime) and are great to work for, so I can't complain.


----------



## XOXOXO

Env_Engr said:


> Hi:
> I just wanted to see what is the average pay raise that people typically get after getting their first PE license. Our company policy says that $100/month will be added to the gross salary. Please post the raise that you have received or expected to receive.
> 
> -------------------------------------------------
> 
> PE Civil - California
> 
> with Environmental section for the afternoon.
> 
> Exam date - Oct 26 &amp; 27 - first attempt
> 
> MS - Environmental Engineering


My company used to give $500/mo increase, but now its down to $250/mo. just for passing. Its immediate. They also have very nice ee referral bonuses (I believe $1000 to refer a licensed PE).


----------



## XOXOXO

kellyhayes said:


> How about a congratulatory lunch and a pay cut. I was informed by my supervisor that since I am now a 'professional' I am no longer eligible for overtime, which I had anticipated, but I didn't get a raise, so effectively I just got bumped down in pay. Hooray.
> 
> 
> 
> WOWWW....this is new...  This always happen when we are professional. Smetimes people will abuse us. I've been working for 4 years now yet my salary still the same since the 1st year.
> 
> regards,
> 
> kelly
> 
> _______________
> 
> Simulation pret
Click to expand...

May be time to cut and run!


----------



## XOXOXO

Photo Engineer said:


> I got a 0% annual raise and a 0% one time bonus, but significant amounts of prestige from the other Professional Engineers in my group. My company paid $0 toward my P.E. license and $0 toward my PE application.
> But my company has some other awesome benefits (paid overtime) and are great to work for, so I can't complain.


My company pays for the first exam fee, and exam materials OR a study course. I guess they are pretty nice!!


----------



## Kaldric

I don't get an immediate raise, but now that I have my PE, in another 9 months I'm eligible for a promotion, which presumably includes a raise. Hopefully we'll be done with budget cuts by then and I can get a decent raise.

My company did pay for the exam and will pay for my license fees, but I bought my own study materials.

Oh, and my boss bought a cake when I got my results. That counts as a raise, right?


----------



## roman501

CONGRATULATIONS FOR THE ONES WHO PASSES THE OCT. 2009!! I PASS THE TEST FINALLY.... AFTER 6 TIMES!! arty-smiley-048:


----------



## papuanomad

haha...ahh the raise issue. My old firm gave 2 raises per year guaranteed. kind of performance based...but more kiss-A$$ed based. Well, it's great to have passed the PE exam


----------



## KEG

I passed the PE in April '09. My company reimbursed me for my exam fees (for all 4 tries) and gave me a $1000/yr raise. That was in June. I just had my year end review and my boss told me that I'm underpaid, he appreciates the work that I do and he'll work to get my salary where it should be. Then he gave me a $10k/year raise. NICE!


----------



## Chucktown PE

Dang, I don't know what I'd do with $10k a year right now. I'm sure my wife would figure out a way to spend it rapidly.


----------



## RevMen

Out of the blue my boss cut me a check for $500 yesterday as a reward for passing the exam. Very nice surprise. We'll see what happens to my salary in the next week or so. A $10k raise would be nice but I'm not holding my breath.


----------



## z06dustin

KEG said:


> I passed the PE in April '09. My company reimbursed me for my exam fees (for all 4 tries) and gave me a $1000/yr raise. That was in June. I just had my year end review and my boss told me that I'm underpaid, he appreciates the work that I do and he'll work to get my salary where it should be. Then he gave me a $10k/year raise. NICE!


KEG, your books had good luck for me on the exam.... I hope they also have good luck in the pay department! 10k would be amazing. There'd be an SRT10 in the garage next to the Z06.


----------



## KEG

z06dustin said:


> KEG, your books had good luck for me on the exam.... I hope they also have good luck in the pay department! 10k would be amazing. There'd be an SRT10 in the garage next to the Z06.


Glad they helped and congrats on passing.

Chucktown PE Posted Today, 11:16 AM

Dang, I don't know what I'd do with $10k a year right now. I'm sure my wife would figure out a way to spend it rapidly.

Pretty sure the wife will figure out a way to spend it but I'm going to bump up my 401k and divert some to my secret savings account before she sees it!


----------



## CivilHokie

My company gives a $500 one-time bonus for the PE...

I will likely have to move companies to get my "raise".


----------



## chaocl

Chucktown PE said:


> Dang, I don't know what I'd do with $10k a year right now. I'm sure my wife would figure out a way to spend it rapidly.


Do you mind to share the money with me?

............Just kidding!

Happy New Year


----------



## VGAC

All expenses (books, travel, etc) covered.

$2,500 spot bonus for passing the exam (Uncle Sam took a nice chunk out of it thought)

Probably the regular 5-6% raise. Given the market conditions, I am not complaining.


----------



## XOXOXO

roman501 said:


> CONGRATULATIONS FOR THE ONES WHO PASSES THE OCT. 2009!! I PASS THE TEST FINALLY.... AFTER 6 TIMES!! arty-smiley-048:



CONGRATS! I'm working on my fifth attempt. Will get there...someday. Glad to hear you made it!

Happy New Year!


----------



## jeb6294

VGAC said:


> All expenses (books, travel, etc) covered.$2,500 spot bonus for passing the exam (Uncle Sam took a nice chunk out of it thought)
> 
> Probably the regular 5-6% raise. Given the market conditions, I am not complaining.


Similar where I was at the time that I passed, although they didn't pay for any expenses because I already had my books and was already signed up for the exam. I did get an extra $2500 bonus on top of the regular bonus we got that year, but no salary increase. I think that was more a reflection on how poor the business was doing rather than how they felt about my worth after passing the exam.


----------



## mike123

I was in the middle of a salary negotiation and got an extra $50 per week added to my job offer.


----------



## RevMen

This morning the boss man gave me a promotion and a $7k a year salary increase as a result of earning my license. I was really not expecting that. What a nice way to start the day.


----------



## arada

I will wait and see


----------



## arada

So, how do you initiate the "sit-down" with your boss to discuss a "potential raise" ?


----------



## Dexman1349

Bring in a copy of your license and show him. "You know, now that I've received my P.E. I am able to increase my billable rate to our clients. I think that because I am now able to bring in more money to the company and am more valuble to the company..."

I would also suggest working more closely with PM's (if you're a consultant), to pickup what they do and to start training yourself to be a PM. This will only increase your value to the company. Conversely, I would also start working more with engineers would are working up to your position. Remember, you can't be promoted unless they can find a replacement for you.


----------



## Moe_Eng_79

cocoloco said:


> KenC said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK guys, lets talk REAL $$. I have no PE or EIT. However that said, I bring in 75K here in Colorado in as an electrical designer. The pay is for what I know and can do. I have been in the industry for 30 years now, have a masters license and a contractors license, I QC EVERY P.E. drawings in the shop I work in, even the owners. Become an expert in the NEC, and learn ACADMEP or REVIT, and you will earn top dollar. Lets face it 100% of electricians getting their Journey license (5 years) know more about electrical engineering than anyone just graduating from college. In electrical its all about the code. Become an expert in the NEC and the rest will follow.
> All this said, the big money will always be owning your own company and not working for someone else. Been there done that
> 
> 
> 
> Please take no offense to this but here I am going to make a point. You say you have been in the industry for 30 years and then you brag about making 75K????? Sir, any kid graduating from college tomorrow and getting serious about learning the business and passing the EIT and PE will be making more than you in about 6 years flat. Like I said, take no offense....
Click to expand...

I guess that would be me, 6 years out of college making &gt; 80K with no PE yet, just tried it for the first time and waiting for my results.

BTW, any one here knows if California updated the data base? I have to wait for my mail to get forwarded to my new mail, (last guy to know if he passed for October 2009 PE in the nation)


----------



## Moe_Eng_79

POed Mommy said:


> kellyhayes said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How about a congratulatory lunch and a pay cut. I was informed by my supervisor that since I am now a 'professional' I am no longer eligible for overtime, which I had anticipated, but I didn't get a raise, so effectively I just got bumped down in pay. Hooray.
> 
> 
> 
> WOWWW....this is new...  This always happen when we are professional. Smetimes people will abuse us. I've been working for 4 years now yet my salary still the same since the 1st year.
> 
> regards,
> 
> kelly
> 
> _______________
> 
> Simulation pret
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> May be time to cut and run!
Click to expand...


Cut and run Cut and run, please, you are here abusing other PEs for getting paid low.

Cut and run, shoot for a 100 K, I am serious...


----------



## TBSS

VGAC said:


> All expenses (books, travel, etc) covered.$2,500 spot bonus for passing the exam (Uncle Sam took a nice chunk out of it thought)
> 
> Probably the regular 5-6% raise. Given the market conditions, I am not complaining.


No expenses covered, no bonus (I did get a nice xmas bonus unrelated to PE), and no talk of any raise (yet?).

On the bright side, my seal is being used for *all* outgoing drawings now. :blink: Ummmm, am I getting hosed?

I love my company, I'm just a little surprised that compensation of any kind for the use of my seal has gone completely unmentioned. I just have to assume it won't last long.


----------



## Santiagj

That sucks!

I stamped about 6-7 drawing packages before I was given a raise. It did take a while for me to get the raise since HR was implementing a new promotion system. At first I didn't believe them but it was legit. I was pondering about not using my stamp and making them suck up the costing of farming that out. You can do that but it kind of burns the bridges down.


----------



## TBSS

Santiagj said:


> That sucks!
> I stamped about 6-7 drawing packages before I was given a raise. It did take a while for me to get the raise since HR was implementing a new promotion system. At first I didn't believe them but it was legit. I was pondering about not using my stamp and making them suck up the costing of farming that out. You can do that but it kind of burns the bridges down.


Yeah, I'm not gonna go there, it's not worth it in the end. They'll deliver I'm sure.


----------



## alison

My "congrats on passing the PE, now here's more responsibility" raise has finally gone through - of course, I had to bug the bossman about it after I noticed that my first paycheck of the year was identical to all of my paychecks before I passed the PE. There were no performance based raises company wide this past year, but I still had the opinion that I should receive at least the standard raise that folks get when they pass the PE, and he agreed completely. Long story short, I received word this past Friday that I've received a promotion that places me in a higher pay scale, amounting to a 20% raise. Not too shabby!

Mind you, the standard "congrats on passing the PE" raise is typically small (3-5%, depending on your current pay scale at the time of passing), so the raise is partially due to that, but mainly due to the fact that I've taken on a ton more responsibility over the past few months.


----------



## TBSS

alison said:


> My "congrats on passing the PE, now here's more responsibility" raise has finally gone through - of course, I had to bug the bossman about it after I noticed that my first paycheck of the year was identical to all of my paychecks before I passed the PE. There were no performance based raises company wide this past year, but I still had the opinion that I should receive at least the standard raise that folks get when they pass the PE, and he agreed completely. Long story short, I received word this past Friday that I've received a promotion that places me in a higher pay scale, amounting to a 20% raise. Not too shabby!
> Mind you, the standard "congrats on passing the PE" raise is typically small (3-5%, depending on your current pay scale at the time of passing), so the raise is partially due to that, but mainly due to the fact that I've taken on a ton more responsibility over the past few months.


Congrats! I need to set up a certiain time by which I'll say something about it. I hate being made to feel that I'm greedy by asking for what I think I deserve because I worked hard to get it and we, the company and I, benefit from it.


----------



## alison

TBSS said:


> Congrats! I need to set up a certiain time by which I'll say something about it. I hate being made to feel that I'm greedy by asking for what I think I deserve because I worked hard to get it and we, the company and I, benefit from it.


By all means, speak up! While I didn't ask for a specific raise (I was honestly expecting the typical 3-5% that I originally mentioned), the "big bossman" who I spoke to is based out of another office (in another state), so he didn't even know that I had passed the exam. Color me silly for not sending out a mass "OMFG I passed!" e-mail to the entire company  Once he heard that I passed, the paperwork was filed near immediately and I found out 2 weeks later that a far more significant raise went through.


----------



## sac_engineer

alison said:


> TBSS said:
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats! I need to set up a certiain time by which I'll say something about it. I hate being made to feel that I'm greedy by asking for what I think I deserve because I worked hard to get it and we, the company and I, benefit from it.
> 
> 
> 
> By all means, speak up! While I didn't ask for a specific raise (I was honestly expecting the typical 3-5% that I originally mentioned), the "big bossman" who I spoke to is based out of another office (in another state), so he didn't even know that I had passed the exam. Color me silly for not sending out a mass "OMFG I passed!" e-mail to the entire company  Once he heard that I passed, the paperwork was filed near immediately and I found out 2 weeks later that a far more significant raise went through.
Click to expand...

Congrats alison!

My raise was 10% for passing the PE. My company kept cost-of-living and merit pay nearly to zero for everyone (or so I'm told), so most, if not all of the raise was promotional. Honestly, I was expecting something in the 12-15% range, but because of lean times, they obliged with 10%. Can't complain though - the raise covers daycare plus additional fun money.


----------



## PA_Mining_Engr

A promotion is in the works which would translate into 4%, however; I'll end up giving back that 4% since I would now be considered management. :smileyballs:

Why you ask: the lovely people in charge of PA's state gov't thought it nice to freeze managers pay (Dec. 2008 - June 2011). So, the 6.25% pay increase that still remains on the unions contract goes bye-bye for me once the promotion goes through........can someone please explain what my motivation was for getting a PE?! :brickwall:

I suppose the self-gratification thing and the ability to sell myself to the highest consulting firm!


----------



## Dexman PE

PA_Mining_Engr said:


> ...the ability to sell myself to the highest consulting firm!


We really are whores. But I'm ok with it.


----------



## _Gambit_

$1.50/hr raise.....


----------



## TBSS

_Gambit_ said:


> $1.50/hr raise.....


$.865 per hour for me! That barely covers what it cost to take a PE review course, buy study materials, application fee, exam fee, and set up NCEES record. However, I still feel like a greedy whore because I think I deserve a little more than that.


----------



## Kephart P.E.

GT ME said:


> The most important thing is you love what you do, and I love being a business owner for a fully licensed Mechanical Engineering &amp; Contracting Co.
> I'm confident my current business will be worth several million in 5 to 10 years (I sold my first business for nearly a mill in 97) -- I'd rather take business risk than be a dependent employee that usually gets downsized in their 50's.
> 
> You sound like an disgruntled dependent employee Mike :Locolaugh:
> 
> 
> 
> Mike in Gastonia said:
> 
> 
> 
> There. I fixed your post for you. Now it makes sense........
Click to expand...

I must disagree, sure guys get downsized in their 50's -but the majority of engineers I have worked with of that age where really invaluable engineers. Heck some of the guys in their late 60's who have already retired we have called and begged them into working off and on over the years.

Basically if you are a good engineer in your 30-40's and continue to stay current with marketable skills I can't see why you couldn't find work in your 50's.

Let me preface my post with this though, I work as and engineering consultant and almost every engineer is a PE and we work in a large variety of Heavy Industrial Engineering.


----------



## rppearso

PA_Mining_Engr said:


> A promotion is in the works which would translate into 4%, however; I'll end up giving back that 4% since I would now be considered management. :smileyballs:
> Why you ask: the lovely people in charge of PA's state gov't thought it nice to freeze managers pay (Dec. 2008 - June 2011). So, the 6.25% pay increase that still remains on the unions contract goes bye-bye for me once the promotion goes through........can someone please explain what my motivation was for getting a PE?! :brickwall:
> 
> I suppose the self-gratification thing and the ability to sell myself to the highest consulting firm!


I agree with that last sentence, im just buying my time until I can find a fatty opprotunity, I got a 0% raise but moving contractors it could result in a 130% raise so I am very anxious to see what happens. Also who here is working for something other than fun money lol, people talk down about fun money but thats the only reason I do what I do, otherwise I would have got a PhD in math.


----------



## yatkins

My company paid for my prep material and the exam and registration, but there is no raise involved and I didn't really expect there to be. I also won't be stamping any drawings any time soon since I am still the most junior around here. My small company is in need of more business and billable hours so I'm happy to be employed. If the rest of this year picks up, my bonus will be bigger.

Further, while passing a test is commendable, I don't think it has any bearing on being an engineer. This whole industry is based on experience and ability and I doubt anyone really gains any ability or experience just by passing the exam.


----------



## buick455

How much of a raise or bonus you get depends on your value to the company and if they need you to be a PE or not and how good a manager you have. The other factor is where you are in the pay scale for the position. A good company should at a minimum give you a bonus to recognize your achievement. I was told I would get a $500 award which is the same as what they give for a masters degree but at least for a masters they pay for your books and classes. They did not pay for any of this for the PE.


----------



## TBSS

TBSS said:


> _Gambit_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> $1.50/hr raise.....
> 
> 
> 
> *$.865 $0.00* per hour for me! That barely covers what it cost to take a PE review course, buy study materials, application fee, exam fee, and set up NCEES record. However, I still feel like a greedy whore because I think I deserve a little more than that.
Click to expand...

Correction made. Apparently the whopping $.865/hr. is being reconsidered. How that for a big effing thank you?! "You worked your ass off for years to get your PE and now we're going to use your seal but after thinking about it a little more, we're not going to pay you for it." I think it may be time to start the job search. What a great Monday!


----------



## rppearso

TBSS said:


> TBSS said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Gambit_ said:
> 
> 
> 
> $1.50/hr raise.....
> 
> 
> 
> *$.865 $0.00* per hour for me! That barely covers what it cost to take a PE review course, buy study materials, application fee, exam fee, and set up NCEES record. However, I still feel like a greedy whore because I think I deserve a little more than that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Correction made. Apparently the whopping $.865/hr. is being reconsidered. How that for a big effing thank you?! "You worked your ass off for years to get your PE and now we're going to use your seal but after thinking about it a little more, we're not going to pay you for it." I think it may be time to start the job search. What a great Monday!
Click to expand...

Just refuse to stamp, and start documenting email and get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them. Strong arming someone into stamping something is highly illegal you just have to make sure you rigoursly document all the cases where they asked you to stamp something and the negitive results when you refuse. You may want to talk to a lawyer before hand to see what you need to collect because they may do something sneaky like ask you to stamp and then try to find something unrelated to fire you for to avoid the law suite but good lawyers have seen this type of dodging before same thing for firing someone for being in the national guard they will try to find some non protected reason to get rid of you. In the mean time look for a new job and if you can find a new job for more money before issues start to arise from non stamping then you dont have to worry about it but no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.


----------



## roadwreck

rppearso said:


> Just refuse to stamp, and start documenting email and get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them. Strong arming someone into stamping something is highly illegal you just have to make sure you rigoursly document all the cases where they asked you to stamp something and the negitive results when you refuse. You may want to talk to a lawyer before hand to see what you need to collect because they may do something sneaky like ask you to stamp and then try to find something unrelated to fire you for to avoid the law suite but good lawyers have seen this type of dodging before same thing for firing someone for being in the national guard they will try to find some non protected reason to get rid of you. In the mean time look for a new job and if you can find a new job for more money before issues start to arise from non stamping then you dont have to worry about it but no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.


Don't take advice from this guy


----------



## rppearso

roadwreck said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just refuse to stamp, and start documenting email and get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them. Strong arming someone into stamping something is highly illegal you just have to make sure you rigoursly document all the cases where they asked you to stamp something and the negitive results when you refuse. You may want to talk to a lawyer before hand to see what you need to collect because they may do something sneaky like ask you to stamp and then try to find something unrelated to fire you for to avoid the law suite but good lawyers have seen this type of dodging before same thing for firing someone for being in the national guard they will try to find some non protected reason to get rid of you. In the mean time look for a new job and if you can find a new job for more money before issues start to arise from non stamping then you dont have to worry about it but no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't take advice from this guy
Click to expand...

So your saying its legal and ethical to strong arm people into stamping? Its you they should not be taking advice from if you are suggesting people do illegal or unethical things.


----------



## roadwreck

:withstupid:


----------



## rppearso

roadwreck said:


> :withstupid:


Cool you realize that there is potential jail time if you are found neglegent and your stamp is on something, you dont post like a PE or act like a professional.


----------



## roadwreck

rppearso said:


> roadwreck said:
> 
> 
> 
> :withstupid:
> 
> 
> 
> Cool you realize that there is potential jail time if you are found neglegent and your stamp is on something, you dont post like a PE or act like a professional.
Click to expand...


----------



## TBSS

Let me just say that no one is strong arming me into stamping anything. There has just always been a verbal agreement that in exchange for stamping drawings, that I either design or oversee the design of (since I got tasked with more responsibilities as well) there would be extra compensation. It appears that they are reneging on me. I guess it works out better for them if I have all of the responsibility without any of the compensation.


----------



## mrt406

rppearso said:


> get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them......





rppearso said:


> no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.


:screwloose:

Hi Pot! My name's Kettle! Nice to meet you!


----------



## rppearso

mrt406 said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> :screwloose:
> 
> Hi Pot! My name's Kettle! Nice to meet you!
Click to expand...

I still dont get that analogy, calling the kettle black or something, I am guessing its suppose to be inflamitory but I just dont understand it ..... sorry.


----------



## wilheldp_PE

Troll.

:deadhorse:


----------



## MechGuy

rppearso said:


> mrt406 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> :screwloose:
> 
> Hi Pot! My name's Kettle! Nice to meet you!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I still dont get that analogy, calling the kettle black or something, I am guessing its suppose to be inflamitory but I just dont understand it ..... sorry.
Click to expand...

Just continues to prove that either you're 12 or you're an idiot. never mind, even a 12 year old can figure that one out. You're the latter.


----------



## TBSS

wilheldp_PE said:


> Troll.
> :deadhorse:


Who's the troll?


----------



## wilheldp_PE

TBSS said:


> Who's the troll?


rppearso


----------



## Dark Knight

He is not a troll. He just likes to have fun posting...whatever is called what he posts.

Besides that, I am not sure he will understand what a troll is.


----------



## mrt406

rppearso said:


> mrt406 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> get a voice recorder, if they fire you for failure to stamp something you sue them......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> no one should be strong armed into stamping something, its highly illegal and unethical.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> :screwloose:
> 
> Hi Pot! My name's Kettle! Nice to meet you!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I still dont get that analogy, calling the kettle black or something, I am guessing its suppose to be inflamitory but I just dont understand it ..... sorry.
Click to expand...


I pity da foo.


----------



## Road Guy

I was threatned to be disbarred for not stamping stuff.........


----------



## rppearso

Road Guy said:


> I was threatned to be disbarred for not stamping stuff.........


Disbarred isent that for lawyers? Im not following you. If they threatened to fire you for not stamping something and you have voice recording or email or someother such thing you can sue there a** and the person who made the threat may even face criminal penalties/jail time, the PE exists to protect public safety and if someone is trying to extort someone into stamping something thats bad mojo.


----------



## Dexman PE

Road Guy said:


> I was threatned to be disbarred for not stamping stuff.........


I remember that. It was a very serious threat


----------



## Dark Knight

Road Guy said:


> I was threatned to be disbarred for not stamping stuff.........


I remember that too. It was bad.


----------



## Capt Worley PE

I know a guy who was disbarred for not stamping stuff. He was pretty much unable to find any position after that.

I was really worried RG was gonna find himself in the wrong boat.


----------



## Kephart P.E.

I am only posting this for people that might stumble upon this thread. I know most of you are licensed so you understand these laws perfectly well:

All the drawings and calculations you do (at least in every state I am familiar with) need to have at the minimum a stamp on them. States differ somewhat, but say you make a preliminary drawing for review, strictly following the rules means you add your stamp, but it would not need to be signed and dated. And really this is a good thing for us licensed engineers, the more a stamp becomes the standard for every design and drawing the better it is to have a license. It effectively raises the bar on engineering work and mostly I agree with it.

However, all record drawings would need a stamp and signature/date.

BUT, if you did not do the design work on a drawing you do not need to stamp it, in fact most states have laws that specifically forbid you to stamp any work that isn't your own. So if you refuse to stamp something you did not do, I can't see the State Board trying to take away your license.


----------



## rppearso

Kephart P.E. said:


> I am only posting this for people that might stumble upon this thread. I know most of you are licensed so you understand these laws perfectly well:
> All the drawings and calculations you do (at least in every state I am familiar with) need to have at the minimum a stamp on them. States differ somewhat, but say you make a preliminary drawing for review, strictly following the rules means you add your stamp, but it would not need to be signed and dated. And really this is a good thing for us licensed engineers, the more a stamp becomes the standard for every design and drawing the better it is to have a license. It effectively raises the bar on engineering work and mostly I agree with it.
> 
> However, all record drawings would need a stamp and signature/date.
> 
> BUT, if you did not do the design work on a drawing you do not need to stamp it, in fact most states have laws that specifically forbid you to stamp any work that isn't your own. So if you refuse to stamp something you did not do, I can't see the State Board trying to take away your license.


I have never seen anywhere in the statues that requires you to stamp drawings that you worked on (just because I work on a drawing does not mean im ready to stamp it when a project manager says so, I may need time which = a huge fatty raise before the drawings can go forward or someone else can stamp them), I worked on all kinds of drawings as an EIT and obvously I never stamped them. Also the need for more stamping is only good if the stamping engineers are in very short supply and are getting HUGE fatty near 200k wages for it, otherwise its just a liability you are taking on for free so your company can rake it in.

I have never heard of someone loosing there licence for NOT stamping something, I have heard of people loosing there licence FOR stamping something that was unsafe/incorrect/etc. The stamp is there to protect public safety so no stamp no construction no public saftey at risk but more important its leverage over your employer (as long as stamping engineers are more rigourusly required by states AND in short supply).

I would like to hear more about people loosing there licence for NOT stamping something irregardless if they worked on it or not. I will also contact my state board becuase thats a pretty heavy statement.


----------



## roadwreck

rppearso said:


> Also the need for more stamping is only good if the stamping engineers are in very short supply...


So if I'm understanding you correctly, you assert the need for a shortage of licensed engineers in order to drive up their value. Since there are so many of us already out there I assume you are proposing to eliminate as many PE's as you can. Should I fear for my life?

hmy:


----------



## Dexman PE

Playing devils advocate here:

Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?

I can understand not stamping anything if the work you do is under the supervision of another PE who then stamps it (such as the PM or OM). Everyone in my office is licensed, but only about half actually do the stamping (typically the PM or the office manager who stamp only what they supervise). In fact, 4 of us haven't stamped a thing in our careers. We also don't have anyone dedicated as the "stamper" of the office. Don't get me wrong, we are compensated for having our license, but we are NEVER forced to use it.


----------



## Dark Knight

Dexman PE said:


> Playing devils advocate here:Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?


Why would a licensed engineer refuse to sign a work he did?


----------



## Dexman PE

Dark Knight said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> Playing devils advocate here:Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?
> 
> 
> 
> Why would a licensed engineer refuse to sign a work he did?
Click to expand...

That appears to be rppearso's point above. He's stating that he may refuse to stamp drawings if the employer won't give him a "fatty raise."


----------



## Dark Knight

Dexman PE said:


> That appears to be rppearso's point above. He's stating that he may refuse to stamp drawings if the employer won't give him a "fatty raise."


rlyflag:

That is a classic example of someone lucky to have a job in this economy.

For some reason I remember the words of our fearless leader...You can be a PE and still be an...(fill the blank).


----------



## rppearso

Dexman PE said:


> Playing devils advocate here:
> Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?
> 
> I can understand not stamping anything if the work you do is under the supervision of another PE who then stamps it (such as the PM or OM). Everyone in my office is licensed, but only about half actually do the stamping (typically the PM or the office manager who stamp only what they supervise). In fact, 4 of us haven't stamped a thing in our careers. We also don't have anyone dedicated as the "stamper" of the office. Don't get me wrong, we are compensated for having our license, but we are NEVER forced to use it.


I see your point, and I had a job offer a few months ago that I turned down because they wanted me to stamp something that another project team had done and was post PHA, I said no way, obvoiusly he did not hire me (the pay was not even close to what I needed to be a "stamper" anyways) and then he hired a non PE and had someone else stamp the drawings, I was kind of glad I was a PE and did not take that job becuase it was like amature hour/3 ring circus there.

Now regarding drawings that I worked on, on the front end of a project I would let them know that I will not be the stamping engineer (unless the compensation is to my liking) and I can work on drawings but someone else needs to stamp. If they dont like that then they dont have to have me on the project and over time I will see how much this PE is really working for me and I may even take it off my resume and work as an EIT since im being paid the same anyways and I wont be faced with dilemas that can get me fired. The whole idea of going through the rigor of getting your engineering degree and a PE is to make money, I did not go to school and test for charity lol so we will see how it goes.


----------



## Capt Worley PE

Dark Knight said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> Playing devils advocate here:Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?
> 
> 
> 
> Why would a licensed engineer refuse to sign a work he did?
Click to expand...

1) No fatty raise (aka the rpearso disorder)

2) The engineer has multiple personalities and some other personality did the design. it would be unethical to stamp another personality's work, since it isn't yours.


----------



## rppearso

Dark Knight said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> That appears to be rppearso's point above. He's stating that he may refuse to stamp drawings if the employer won't give him a "fatty raise."
> 
> 
> 
> rlyflag:
> 
> That is a classic example of someone lucky to have a job in this economy.
> 
> For some reason I remember the words of our fearless leader...You can be a PE and still be an...(fill the blank).
Click to expand...

Who is the fearless leader and what is the fill in the blank. Like d*ck head or something. I dont buy into that lucky to have a job bit thats a scare tactic for companies to skim more of your bill rate off the top. I did not spend 10 years getting my PE to be "lucky to have a job" I did it to make fatty money. I have been on contracting web sites and there is money to be made out there, granted this economy can force you to work overseas for a few years (if your american company whats to treat you like a 3rd world immigrant lol) but the money is out there, dont let anyone fool you.


----------



## Ble_PE

I don't know how you came across this belief that getting your PE was going to get you fatty money, but it is flawed. I was told multiple times throughout college that if I wanted to get rich, don't major in engineering. It's the truth. Engineers are well paid, but we are never going to get rich off of our salaries and the sooner you accept that, the more you'll start enjoying life. You just seem like a whiny little bitch if you ask me, but I digress.


----------



## Dexman PE

I've made this point before: Your pay rate is all about what you bring to the company. You may be a certified ______, but what value does that have for your employer? A PE does have a certain base-line value to it, but what YOU do with your PE gives it the real value.

My first employer actually discouraged it's engineers from getting their PE's. This was for several reasons:

A - we did very little design work so there was no need for them

B - they didn't want to pay the additional costs for professional liability insurance

C - they didn't want to have to give any raises for things not used/needed

D - a PE typically indicated that the employee is on the verge of leaving because of the previous 3 reasons

If you tell them you're going to work as an EIT, they will pay you as one. Don't get mad at them if YOU refuse to be proactive and show what added value you have. They know what the PE is worth, they just want to see what YOU are worth once you get your PE. If you have a PE, but they don't need one, you may not be paid accordingly. I have seen this multiple times, hence the stereotype: change jobs to get a raise. This is more because the new company needs what you have, whereas your old company didn't.

Look at the people who did get raises after getting their PE. What else changed between them and the company? The ones who got the biggest raises took on more responsibility than just the PE. They became project managers (what I did); they became team leaders; they essentially provided more "value" to the company.


----------



## Dark Knight

rppearso said:


> Who is the fearless leader and what is the fill in the blank. Like d*ck head or something. I dont buy into that lucky to have a job bit thats a scare tactic for companies to skim more of your bill rate off the top. I did not spend 10 years getting my PE to be "lucky to have a job" I did it to make fatty money. I have been on contracting web sites and there is money to be made out there, granted this economy can force you to work overseas for a few years (if your american company whats to treat you like a 3rd world immigrant lol) but the money is out there, dont let anyone fool you.


If you became an engineer because the fatty money...sorry dude. Flash News...Somebody tricked you. But it is your right to keep trying.

Now, from a mere mortal, you have issues. You believe that because you are a PE you deserve the world and that is just wrong. The PE did not make anybody smarter, even if you felt that the day after getting the results. You are the same that applied and took the test. Period. Going around your office with an attitude because you passed a test is, excuse my Spanish, stupid and gives engineers a bad reputation. Unfortunately you are not alone. There are many like you.

Another thing; You use the term 3rd World inmigrant in a derogatory form. Who the heck do you think you are? Again...you have issues.

Quit behaving as a 4th grade kid and start behaving like an engineer, if you really are one. Looks like you know where the money is. Shut up and go after it.

Last but not least...Who is our fearless leader? Find it

What word fills the blank? When I took English 101 I was taught that after the "an" comes a vocal (yes...a,e,i,o,u). Looks like you, Mr. Fatty Money Super Engineer, do not know that. To let you know, I would use the world idiot, but somebody else may use the world ass-hole. Chances are.


----------



## MechGuy

rppearso said:


> Also the need for more stamping is only good if the stamping engineers are in very short supply and are getting HUGE fatty near 200k wages for it


What world are you living in? I don't know of any engineers with your experience making $200K. I don't know of any engineers with 20 years experience making $200K (as an engineer). I don't even think the head of my business unit or President of my division is making $200K. So what makes you think you deserve that kind of money with your limited experience (and obvious lack of a brain), just because you're a PE?

I think you're lucky to be working somewhere other than Wal-Mart my friend. I think you may even have a hard time with that profession.


----------



## Capt Worley PE

Watch out for the


----------



## picusld

Dark Knight said:


> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> Playing devils advocate here:Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?
> 
> 
> 
> Why would a licensed engineer refuse to sign a work he did?
Click to expand...

I can speak to this from the Land Development side and a situation that I have run into...In PA, Landscape Architects have gained significant traction as to what they can stamp. Some companies allow an LA to stamp a Land Development record plan and be the responsible party for the plan while the engineer's role is to certify that the plan meets stormwater requirements.

As an example, a project that I worked on involved a building addition, new parking lot, and new storm water facilities. I did the stormwater design, but had no role in the site layout and grading. There are items on the plan that I would not want to defend if something were to happen but since I am not the responsible party, it is my obligation to bring up my objections. In the end, it is the design proffessional (in this case an LA) responsible for the plan to stand by what he has put on paper.

For most record plans that I have seen, the engineer's signature block is just a place where the engineer signs and seals.

In this case, though, there are clearly areas on the site that could be defined as "traffic engineering" involving signage and striping. Since my objections were ignored, I obviously would not want to be the only PE stamp on a record plan involving something that could be assumed to be my work.

My compromise is to have a disclaimer on the plan stating that I was only responsible for the stormwater design so that if anything does happen regarding the plan layout, I can minimize my liability in the future.

If the LA refuses to put this note on the plan... Then I won't stamp


----------



## rppearso

Dexman PE said:


> I've made this point before: Your pay rate is all about what you bring to the company. You may be a certified ______, but what value does that have for your employer? A PE does have a certain base-line value to it, but what YOU do with your PE gives it the real value.
> My first employer actually discouraged it's engineers from getting their PE's. This was for several reasons:
> 
> A - we did very little design work so there was no need for them
> 
> B - they didn't want to pay the additional costs for professional liability insurance
> 
> C - they didn't want to have to give any raises for things not used/needed
> 
> D - a PE typically indicated that the employee is on the verge of leaving because of the previous 3 reasons
> 
> If you tell them you're going to work as an EIT, they will pay you as one. Don't get mad at them if YOU refuse to be proactive and show what added value you have. They know what the PE is worth, they just want to see what YOU are worth once you get your PE. If you have a PE, but they don't need one, you may not be paid accordingly. I have seen this multiple times, hence the stereotype: change jobs to get a raise. This is more because the new company needs what you have, whereas your old company didn't.
> 
> Look at the people who did get raises after getting their PE. What else changed between them and the company? The ones who got the biggest raises took on more responsibility than just the PE. They became project managers (what I did); they became team leaders; they essentially provided more "value" to the company.


Yes I agree, if there is no expectation of stamping and I can work as an EIT then I dont have a problem but if there are expectations of even being in responsible charge or having to sign anything (not nessicarily just stamping) then I am no longer working as an EIT but as a PE. I know of several engineers that are making either close to 200k or more than 200k, I think it depends on the disipline of engineer, the industry and the area. I am surprised that none of you have contracting offices in your area that are giving out 83% of bill rate, unless of course the raw bill rate is much lower in the lower 48.


----------



## rppearso

Ble_PE said:


> I don't know how you came across this belief that getting your PE was going to get you fatty money, but it is flawed. I was told multiple times throughout college that if I wanted to get rich, don't major in engineering. It's the truth. Engineers are well paid, but we are never going to get rich off of our salaries and the sooner you accept that, the more you'll start enjoying life. You just seem like a whiny little bitch if you ask me, but I digress.


Im actually not whiny I just like to blow off some steam from time to time.


----------



## Ble_PE

^Your "time to time" has been pretty much constantly since you joined last July. That's being whiny in my book.

But we all know I'm just :deadhorse:


----------



## rppearso

picusld said:


> Dark Knight said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dexman PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> Playing devils advocate here:Why would an employer keep a licensed engineer on staff who refuses to stamp his own work? You designed it, right? Why would you not stamp your own work?
> 
> 
> 
> Why would a licensed engineer refuse to sign a work he did?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I can speak to this from the Land Development side and a situation that I have run into...In PA, Landscape Architects have gained significant traction as to what they can stamp. Some companies allow an LA to stamp a Land Development record plan and be the responsible party for the plan while the engineer's role is to certify that the plan meets stormwater requirements.
> 
> As an example, a project that I worked on involved a building addition, new parking lot, and new storm water facilities. I did the stormwater design, but had no role in the site layout and grading. There are items on the plan that I would not want to defend if something were to happen but since I am not the responsible party, it is my obligation to bring up my objections. In the end, it is the design proffessional (in this case an LA) responsible for the plan to stand by what he has put on paper.
> 
> For most record plans that I have seen, the engineer's signature block is just a place where the engineer signs and seals.
> 
> In this case, though, there are clearly areas on the site that could be defined as "traffic engineering" involving signage and striping. Since my objections were ignored, I obviously would not want to be the only PE stamp on a record plan involving something that could be assumed to be my work.
> 
> My compromise is to have a disclaimer on the plan stating that I was only responsible for the stormwater design so that if anything does happen regarding the plan layout, I can minimize my liability in the future.
> 
> If the LA refuses to put this note on the plan... Then I won't stamp
Click to expand...

I have done similar things as an EIT for the PE I was working under regarding pipeline surge analysis which was done by a 3rd party contractor but the surge valves and closure times had to show up on our drawings so we had to put thoes disclaimers on there and then the PE stamped them (the PE that is making over 200k). It was not that we agreed or disagreed but the calcs behind there software was propriatary so we could not validate anything so the PE could not stamp it. They agreed and the drawings went forward.


----------



## FLBuff PE

rppearso said:


> I have done similar things as an EIT for the PE I was working under regarding pipeline surge analysis which was done by a 3rd party contractor but the surge valves and closure times had to show up on our drawings so we had to put thoes disclaimers on there and then the PE stamped them (the PE that is making over 200k). It was not that we agreed or disagreed but the calcs behind *there* software was propriatary so we could not validate anything so the PE could not stamp it. They agreed and the drawings went forward.


Should be 'their'


----------



## rppearso

Ble_PE said:


> ^Your "time to time" has been pretty much constantly since you joined last July. That's being whiny in my book.
> But we all know I'm just :deadhorse:


Yea thats ok though, as long as you enjoy beating a dead horse. Thats why you dont kill the horse you just turn a bottle of compressed air upside down and spray it in the eyes, then you have a good time, the JT effect should get it pissed.


----------



## chaosiscash

MechGuy said:


> What world are you living in? I don't know of any engineers with your experience making $200K. I don't know of any engineers with 20 years experience making $200K (as an engineer). I don't even think the head of my business unit or President of my division is making $200K.


I promise I'm not trying to encourage RP, but I feel like I should say that I know several (20-year) engineers in my industry making that kind of money. HOWEVER, I work in a very specialized industry, and those guys that make that kind of money are generally more willing to travel and work OT than others I know. I'd say Flyer knows some folks in that pay range as well. I'm just trying to say that when RP says that kind of money is out there, he's not wrong, but I do think it is limited (in general) to some specialized fields, and there are some sacrifices (travel, lots of OT) necessary to make it.


----------



## FLBuff PE

rppearso said:


> Ble_PE said:
> 
> 
> 
> ^Your "time to time" has been pretty much constantly since you joined last July. That's being whiny in my book.
> But we all know I'm just :deadhorse:
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah thats ok though, as long as you enjoy beating a dead horse. Thats why you don't kill the horse; you just turn a bottle of compressed air upside down and spray it in the eyes. Then you have a good time. The JT effect should get it pissed off.
Click to expand...

Corrected.


----------



## Flyer_PE

chaosiscash said:


> MechGuy said:
> 
> 
> 
> What world are you living in? I don't know of any engineers with your experience making $200K. I don't know of any engineers with 20 years experience making $200K (as an engineer). I don't even think the head of my business unit or President of my division is making $200K.
> 
> 
> 
> I promise I'm not trying to encourage RP, but I feel like I should say that I know several (20-year) engineers in my industry making that kind of money. HOWEVER, I work in a very specialized industry, and those guys that make that kind of money are generally more willing to travel and work OT than others I know. I'd say Flyer knows some folks in that pay range as well. I'm just trying to say that when RP says that kind of money is out there, he's not wrong, but I do think it is limited (in general) to some specialized fields, and there are some sacrifices (travel, lots of OT) necessary to make it.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Most of the guys I know in that range are not even PE's. They are highly experienced (20+ years) and still like working the typical 6-12s that goes with the refuel outage schedule or plant recovery. They are also very mobile. The two most often heard terms for them are "road warrior" and "road whore". It's a hard life and they are compensated accordingly. I don't envy them one bit.


----------



## mrt406

rppearso said:


> loosing there licence


:withstupid:


----------



## Kephart P.E.

rppearso said:


> Kephart P.E. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am only posting this for people that might stumble upon this thread. I know most of you are licensed so you understand these laws perfectly well:
> All the drawings and calculations you do (at least in every state I am familiar with) need to have at the minimum a stamp on them. States differ somewhat, but say you make a preliminary drawing for review, strictly following the rules means you add your stamp, but it would not need to be signed and dated. And really this is a good thing for us licensed engineers, the more a stamp becomes the standard for every design and drawing the better it is to have a license. It effectively raises the bar on engineering work and mostly I agree with it.
> 
> However, all record drawings would need a stamp and signature/date.
> 
> BUT, if you did not do the design work on a drawing you do not need to stamp it, in fact most states have laws that specifically forbid you to stamp any work that isn't your own. So if you refuse to stamp something you did not do, I can't see the State Board trying to take away your license.
> 
> 
> 
> I have never seen anywhere in the statues that requires you to stamp drawings that you worked on (just because I work on a drawing does not mean im ready to stamp it when a project manager says so, I may need time which = a huge fatty raise before the drawings can go forward or someone else can stamp them), I worked on all kinds of drawings as an EIT and obvously I never stamped them. Also the need for more stamping is only good if the stamping engineers are in very short supply and are getting HUGE fatty near 200k wages for it, otherwise its just a liability you are taking on for free so your company can rake it in.
> 
> I have never heard of someone loosing there licence for NOT stamping something, I have heard of people loosing there licence FOR stamping something that was unsafe/incorrect/etc. The stamp is there to protect public safety so no stamp no construction no public saftey at risk but more important its leverage over your employer (as long as stamping engineers are more rigourusly required by states AND in short supply).
> 
> I would like to hear more about people loosing there licence for NOT stamping something irregardless if they worked on it or not. I will also contact my state board becuase thats a pretty heavy statement.
Click to expand...

I mostly disagree, rppearso.

Most state boards are taking the following stance: All engineering drawings need a stamp even preliminary ones. Just like 20 years ago in many states you could have a company providing Engineering services but were not required to have a Licensed Engineer on staff, they changed that in most every state to my knowledge. It is becoming the same with stamped drawings.

There are drawings I have stamped, where I did not do 100% of the design -as I did my part then the EE did his and so therefore we BOTH stamp. I was basically stamping the mechanical portion and him the controls stuff. We do agree however that if you don't design it you don't stamp it. People do this, but it seems epically shortsighted.

And finally if I was your boss, and you tried to weasel a raise out of me before you would stamp a set of drawings (which you designed) I would give your precious money then can you a week later.


----------



## rppearso

Kephart P.E. said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kephart P.E. said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am only posting this for people that might stumble upon this thread. I know most of you are licensed so you understand these laws perfectly well:
> All the drawings and calculations you do (at least in every state I am familiar with) need to have at the minimum a stamp on them. States differ somewhat, but say you make a preliminary drawing for review, strictly following the rules means you add your stamp, but it would not need to be signed and dated. And really this is a good thing for us licensed engineers, the more a stamp becomes the standard for every design and drawing the better it is to have a license. It effectively raises the bar on engineering work and mostly I agree with it.
> 
> However, all record drawings would need a stamp and signature/date.
> 
> BUT, if you did not do the design work on a drawing you do not need to stamp it, in fact most states have laws that specifically forbid you to stamp any work that isn't your own. So if you refuse to stamp something you did not do, I can't see the State Board trying to take away your license.
> 
> 
> 
> I have never seen anywhere in the statues that requires you to stamp drawings that you worked on (just because I work on a drawing does not mean im ready to stamp it when a project manager says so, I may need time which = a huge fatty raise before the drawings can go forward or someone else can stamp them), I worked on all kinds of drawings as an EIT and obvously I never stamped them. Also the need for more stamping is only good if the stamping engineers are in very short supply and are getting HUGE fatty near 200k wages for it, otherwise its just a liability you are taking on for free so your company can rake it in.
> 
> I have never heard of someone loosing there licence for NOT stamping something, I have heard of people loosing there licence FOR stamping something that was unsafe/incorrect/etc. The stamp is there to protect public safety so no stamp no construction no public saftey at risk but more important its leverage over your employer (as long as stamping engineers are more rigourusly required by states AND in short supply).
> 
> I would like to hear more about people loosing there licence for NOT stamping something irregardless if they worked on it or not. I will also contact my state board becuase thats a pretty heavy statement.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I mostly disagree, rppearso.
> 
> Most state boards are taking the following stance: All engineering drawings need a stamp even preliminary ones. Just like 20 years ago in many states you could have a company providing Engineering services but were not required to have a Licensed Engineer on staff, they changed that in most every state to my knowledge. It is becoming the same with stamped drawings.
> 
> There are drawings I have stamped, where I did not do 100% of the design -as I did my part then the EE did his and so therefore we BOTH stamp. I was basically stamping the mechanical portion and him the controls stuff. We do agree however that if you don't design it you don't stamp it. People do this, but it seems epically shortsighted.
> 
> And finally if I was your boss, and you tried to weasel a raise out of me before you would stamp a set of drawings (which you designed) I would give your precious money then can you a week later.
Click to expand...

Hey 200k to stamp some drawings I could afford to be laid off for a little while, if I had to extort the raise I would want it all up front or I would just walk out without stamping them. Of course in reality I would tell you up front if I were being paid enough to perform the function of a stamper or not and if we agreed that I would not stamp but would be acting as an EIT and someone else would stamp thats fine. If after everything was done you wanted me to stamp then there would be a problem and I would defer to the top sentence, in that case it would be your fault though.


----------



## wilheldp_PE

If you "extort" your employer, then you will be walking out of a lot of places. If you plan on "selling your stamp", I see a non-pleasant run-in with your state licensure board in the not too distant future. What you are talking about is not only unethical, it is also illegal in several states. Regardless of whether you designed what was on the drawing yourself, oversaw the design, or just reviewed it after it was done, it is illegal to get paid solely for putting your stamp on a drawing.


----------



## Dark Knight

Bottom line. This guy is a joke. No one can be so arrogant and ignorant at the same time.


----------



## rppearso

Dark Knight said:


> Bottom line. This guy is a joke. No one can be so arrogant and ignorant at the same time.


If that were the case (keep in mind that is just your opinion), but if your statement were true that means that a computer would have to be generating these posts without any human input.


----------



## benbo

rppearso said:


> Dark Knight said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bottom line. This guy is a joke. No one can be so arrogant and ignorant at the same time.
> 
> 
> 
> If that were the case (keep in mind that is just your opinion), but if your statement were true that means that a computer would have to be generating these posts without any human input.
Click to expand...

Dude, you are a trip. I can't understand about half the stuff you write. I have no idea what this comment means. But I have to admit it is entertaining.


----------



## Dark Knight

rppearso said:


> If that were the case (keep in mind that is just your opinion), but if your statement were true that means that a computer would have to be generating these posts without any humanintelligent input.


Fixed it for you. You are welcome


----------



## Dleg

I enjoy rppearso's posts. Without them, there wouldn't be half the entertainment this Board is currently offering.

I usually understand what he is trying to say, too. That's a little scary. I don't agree with it at all, but I understand it.

(must be from all my time working with all those "third world engineers". LOL)


----------



## rppearso

Dleg said:


> I enjoy rppearso's posts. Without them, there wouldn't be half the entertainment this Board is currently offering.
> I usually understand what he is trying to say, too. That's a little scary. I don't agree with it at all, but I understand it.
> 
> (must be from all my time working with all those "third world engineers". LOL)


There are acutally some really good 3rd world engineers but they usually dont go back if they are in fact good. The last post was a joke, if there are no people this dumb and this arrogant then that means that no human person could be typing these messages therefore some sort of AI/automated software must be generating these messages. Anyways I have to get back to advanced engineering math.


----------



## Dleg

LOL. Be careful with that!


----------



## Capt Worley PE

rppearso said:


> Anyways I have to get back to advanced engineering math.


Qucick! Which is the numerator and which is the denominator?


----------



## EM_PS

Capt Worley PE said:


> Watch out for the


Yah no sh!t! The trolling downriggers were singing yesterday!



Capt Worley PE said:


> 2) The engineer has multiple personalities and some other personality did the design. it would be unethical to stamp another personality's work, since it isn't yours.


I've wondered this lately...if you have mulitiple personalities, would you necessarily know? and thus if you did, wouldn't you be able to count the other pesonality's area of expertise avoiding 'working outside of your area'? but then would you know where the other personality keeps his stamp....or would you use your own...?


----------



## Psycho

rppearso said:


> I have never seen anywhere in the statues that requires you to stamp drawings that you worked on *(just because I work on a drawing does not mean im ready to stamp it when a project manager says so, I may need time which = a huge fatty raise before the drawings can go forward or someone else can stamp them), *I worked on all kinds of drawings as an EIT and obvously I never stamped them.


I would wholeheartedly terminate you for that before you could even start with any BS excuse of why you're not ready to stamp your work.

As a EIT, yes you did plans, specs, etc... then passed it on to your PE to stamp and take responsibility for those stamped plans, specs, etc... When you passed on your work as an EIT you were passing on work that had been completed to your best ability and to your knowledge, was stamp worthy.

Now your a PE and can stamp your work. Are you now telling me that the work you do now is not stamp worthy, or you don't know what stamp worthy is, or that it's not your best effort, any excuse that you pull from your bag of tricks can be considered as a regression in your ability to do your job as per your work description (even if your description says nothing about you stampnig your own work), and a regression in your ability to do your work per your job description is legal grounds for termination in any state, unless of course the regression is due to being legally impaired/disabled... which now that I think about it all the PEs I've worked with could be considered legally retarded so I guess you can't get fired.


----------



## Dexman PE

Psycho said:


> ... which now that I think about it all the PEs I've worked with could be considered legally retarded so I guess you can't get fired.


Some more retarded than others...


----------



## mrt406

rppearso said:


> a huge fatty raise



For some reason, every time rppearso talks about getting a "huge fatty raise" I imagine he's talking about pot....

Which if that were the case, at least he'd have an excuse for his nonsensical ramblings.


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## rppearso

Psycho said:


> rppearso said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have never seen anywhere in the statues that requires you to stamp drawings that you worked on *(just because I work on a drawing does not mean im ready to stamp it when a project manager says so, I may need time which = a huge fatty raise before the drawings can go forward or someone else can stamp them), *I worked on all kinds of drawings as an EIT and obvously I never stamped them.
> 
> 
> 
> I would wholeheartedly terminate you for that before you could even start with any BS excuse of why you're not ready to stamp your work.
> 
> As a EIT, yes you did plans, specs, etc... then passed it on to your PE to stamp and take responsibility for those stamped plans, specs, etc... When you passed on your work as an EIT you were passing on work that had been completed to your best ability and to your knowledge, was stamp worthy.
> 
> Now your a PE and can stamp your work. Are you now telling me that the work you do now is not stamp worthy, or you don't know what stamp worthy is, or that it's not your best effort, any excuse that you pull from your bag of tricks can be considered as a regression in your ability to do your job as per your work description (even if your description says nothing about you stampnig your own work), and a regression in your ability to do your work per your job description is legal grounds for termination in any state, unless of course the regression is due to being legally impaired/disabled... which now that I think about it all the PEs I've worked with could be considered legally retarded so I guess you can't get fired.
Click to expand...

Yes I agree that if you start onto the work it should be to the best of your ability and "stamp worthy" however I would simply not start on the project without a compensation negotiation prior and if the compensation was not to my liking I simply would nto start the project and there is nothing unethical about that.


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## Dexman PE

Nothing unethical at all. However, you have to realize that you may not last long with that company if that's the route you take...


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## wilheldp_PE

rppearso said:


> however I would simply not start on the project without a compensation negotiation prior and if the compensation was not to my liking I simply would nto start the project and there is nothing unethical about that.


Maybe not unethical, but definitely not productive for your employer. That would definitely be grounds for termination from any company, and it would certainly hold up in court if you were stupid enough to sue (which I'm pretty sure you are that stupid).


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## CbusPaul

I don't post a whole lot but I keep coming back for the entertainment. Tmcckeon, GT_ME, and rppearso....This is great. Best entertainment on the web.


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## wilheldp_PE

We don't have many trolls, but ours tend to be epic.


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## humner

Dark Knight said:


> Bottom line. This guy is a joke. No one can be so arrogant and ignorant at the same time.


Obama comes to mind


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## billymac00

my company requires PE for some positions and doesn't compensate for those. It provides 5% differential otherwise. For a top step Asst Engin here that represents over $400/mo. Because of the incentive, we typically have 100% of engineers with their PEs.


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## mustangcobra93

I should see a 10% raise.


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## addi

BoogieDownPE said:


> BoogieDownPE said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've been doing the private consulting thing in NYC for 10 years and the only significant salary increases I have gotten have been by threatening to leave and making my company match the offer or by actually leaving.
> 
> private consulting firms (at least in NYC) are notoriously bad for not giving their people decent raises. I've been at my current job over 4 years and I got 3.5% raise each year. doesn't really help when the cost of living is going up 5-7% each year. Once I get my 5 years and vested in the company stock ownership program, I am outta here hopefully with a PE to command even more money at my next stop
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I can completely relate with you. I am also in the NYC area. The raises are laughable b/c it's just so expensive to live here. I don't know how they expect folks to make a living. I might have to hop soon as well
Click to expand...


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## Phantom PE

Go work for the Pennsylvania Dept. of Transportation. You get a $2000 one time bonus(pre tax). Speaking of bouncing soon...


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