When to take? Oct 18 vs Apr 19?

Hello,

  It's been a few years since I've been here... boy oh boy did get a few surprises!!!

  The test changed from 100 to 80 questions for 2018!!!  It's going to be computerized starting in 2019 and you can't take any references in with you!!!(Yes, I understand we will have access to the PDF version of the NCEES reference.)

  I was going to take the test some time back in 2016, and started to study/collect many resources, but had to put it on hold due to family obligations. 

  Now, I feel I can consider taking it.  I've never sat for the Environmental PE, it will be my first time. 

  Please everyone, advise me, do I try for the Oct 2018 test (last paper test/able to bring in resources) OR wait and be part of the first group who takes the computer based test (CBT) in April?

  Here is the main question, will the CBT questions be "less complicated/more straight forward" since we will only have access to their PDF reference guide?   I mean, we can't even bring in the standard Lindeburg one?

  Clearly I need some guidance.  Dleg?  CU07? 

  Can I ask NCEES directly if the CBT will be structured to where we only need THEIR PDF reference to pass?

  I'm sorry if this post is too long!!!!  I really wanted to explain my conundrum in hopes someone could offer some sound advice. Thanks for listening!!! 

Appreciatively,

peacock321

Since it is your first time, I think it is better to try the paper test and I hope you will pass. If not, you can still try the CBT, in this way you wont miss the paper test. Also it depends on which one (paper vs CBT) you feel more comfortable with.

Maryam and kmill23, thank you for your responses. 

kmill23, please share your experience once you take the exam.  

So to clarify, I've sat for the Civil PE (Water Resources) before, so I've had the paper experience.  I was able to bring in anything and everything.  Unfortunately, I think I relied on that too much. Maybe a CBT will force me to truly learn the concepts since I won't be able to rely on solved problems.  Also, from a person stance, my Spring is much more open than Fall due to birthdays and holidays. 

I'm curious as to how companies like School of PE are going to change their approach.  Their website states they have already changed for the Chemical PE.  

I encourage others to please give more advice!  Thanks!!!!

[SIZE=11pt]If you’ve already purchased references for the Environmental Exam, I would take the October 2018 Exam.  [/SIZE]Print out the reference handbook provided by NCEES and use that as one of your references as well.  That way, if you don’t pass in October, you’ll be familiar with the only reference you’re allowed to use for the April 2019 Exam.  Good luck!

peacock321 said:

I'm curious as to how companies like School of PE are going to change their approach.  Their website states they have already changed for the Chemical PE. 




 

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There are two main factors we look at when changing our review courses for the new CBTs. The first is that we look at the new NCEES guidelines and change our courses to work with the new format. The second is that we offer our Live Online courses on a quarterly schedule rather than twice a year.

If you have any specific questions about how our courses will be changing for the new format, please feel free to call us at 614-873-7475 or email us at [email protected] and we will be able to assist you more.

Good luck on your exam! 

I couldn't tell you - tough choice.  PErsonally, I would think the CBT might be the way to go- at least you won't have to guess at which references to practice with.  The NCEES reference manual looks pretty comprehensive, I would think it would make a decent study guide. (I guess Lindberg is going to go out of business at this rate, though)

peacock321 said:

Maybe a CBT will force me to truly learn the concepts since I won't be able to rely on solved problems.  

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This has been my advice all along. I find no value at all in bringing along solved problems.  The process of solving them while studying, though, is everything. 

Dleg,

  Thank you for your input!  One must still study with all the other books (such as LaGrega, Metcalf, etc.) recommended on the consolidated advice thread, don't you think?  Isn't that how one would learn the difference concepts and not just learn from the NCEES allowed reference?  

  Also, with an 80 qu CBT, will there be those random qualiltative (conceptional) questions anymore that one would find the answer to in one of their many books they brought in?  Or would all the qualitiative questions be able to be answered through the NCEES reference?

  Anyone know any Chem E that took the CBT exam?

Thanks all!!!

Yes, I think you would still need to use all the recommended texts when studying, but for practicing problems you would only be allowed to use the NCEES reference, so that's the one you would need to train yourself to rely on. The other references should just be there to expand on topics you discover you don't understand as you come across them. 

I don't see how they could ask any of the old-style qualitative questions, which part of me thinks is a shame. It forced you to invest in some pretty useful references, and to read up on stuff that you ordinarily might not.  Things like radiation safety, noise, food, swimming pools, etc. In my career I have had occasion to work with all of those things. Most enviro engineers probably won't, but the ability to know where to go for that stuff - and to work side-by-side with sanitarians (REHS's) and actually have some quantitative skills that they often don't, is something that sets us apart from the civil-enviros, who I would view as strictly design ad construction type folks. The enviro PE to me should remain differentiated by this broader application of the principles, and losing that aspect of the exam doesn't do us any favors in that regard. 

Dleg,

  Thank you for all your advice!  It's all very helpful!

Anyone know if the new CBT for 2019 will remain at 80 questions, or back to 100?

Hockey Eng said:

Anyone know if the new CBT for 2019 will remain at 80 questions, or back to 100?

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I believe its going to be 80 questions from here on.

It wouldn't surprise me if the April and OCt 2018 80 question pencil/paper exams are the shake-down test for the CBT.

RBHeadge PE said:

It wouldn't surprise me if the April and OCt 2018 80 question pencil/paper exams are the shake-down test for the CBT.

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I'm thinking that too.  I have a copy of the printed Environmental PE handbook and will bring it with me to the exam.  

RBHeadge PE said:

It wouldn't surprise me if the April and OCt 2018 80 question pencil/paper exams are the shake-down test for the CBT.

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txjennah said:

I'm thinking that too.  I have a copy of the printed Environmental PE handbook and will bring it with me to the exam.  

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Likewise. It would be the “sensible” thing to do. But engineers aren’t always as sensible as they should be

In/PE/Out said:

Likewise. It would be the “sensible” thing to do. But engineers aren’t always as sensible as they should be

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Hahaha. Fingers crossed this sensibility rewards us and puts us on the good side of the cut score.

In/PE/Out said:

Likewise. It would be the “sensible” thing to do. But engineers aren’t always as sensible as they should be

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ikr.

It probably goes without saying, but for the lurkers out there, just don't print it out and bring it with you, but also make sure you are properly familiar with it prior to taking the test.

txjennah said:

Hahaha. Fingers crossed this sensibility rewards us and puts us on the good side of the cut score.

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LOL yeah. But sensible, common sense, and being prepared, and being well prepared for all eventualities are different things.

The tea leaves are easy to read, but only if you know what to look for. I sort of question how many EnvE test takers next week know that:

1. The test goes CBT on Jan 1;
   
2. that there is a handbook on the ncees dashboard to download;
   
3. that can find the F#$%ing thing on the dashboard. I knew it was there and had trouble locating it this morning!;
   
4. that that handbook will be the only allowable reference on the CBT;
   
5. that this exam could be a dry run for the CBT, even if only in paper/pencil format, if not future questions
   

I suspect the overall number is pretty low. And I seriously doubt that there are any first time takers, without help who would be able to figure it out for themselves.

RBHeadge PE said:

ikr.

It probably goes without saying, but for the lurkers out there, just don't print it out and bring it with you, but also make sure you are properly familiar with it prior to taking the test.

LOL yeah. But sensible, common sense, and being prepared, and being well prepared for all eventualities are different things.

The tea leaves are easy to read, but only if you know what to look for. I sort of question how many EnvE test takers next week know that:

1. The test goes CBT on Jan 1;
   
2. that there is a handbook on the ncees dashboard to download;
   
3. that can find the F#$%ing thing on the dashboard. I knew it was there and had trouble locating it this morning!;
   
4. that that handbook will be the only allowable reference on the CBT;
   
5. that this exam could be a dry run for the CBT, even if only in paper/pencil format, if not future questions
   

I suspect the overall number is pretty low. And I seriously doubt that there are any first time takers, without help who would be able to figure it out for themselves.

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It took me forever to find it on the dashboard! Hahaha!

Honestly, it wasn't on the top of my list of things to bring until I saw how many of the Schneiter practice exam solutions referred to it.  Then the gears slowly started turning.

txjennah said:

Honestly, it wasn't on the top of my list of things to bring until I saw how many of the Schneiter practice exam solutions referred to it.  Then the gears slowly started turning.

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Okay, I didn't realize that commercial study guides are now referencing the manual. The essentially confirms our hypothesis.

That might also allow a few newbies to also figure it out on their own too.

Take any legal and ethical edge you can get.

txjennah said:

It took me forever to find it on the dashboard! Hahaha!

Honestly, it wasn't on the top of my list of things to bring until I saw how many of the Schneiter practice exam solutions referred to it.  Then the gears slowly started turning.

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For whatever good it is, I guess everyone who’s taking the Enviro exam next week needs to report back on how useful the NCEES manual was (without specifics, of course). I’m leaving a post-it on my computer to remind myself to do this after the exam.

I’m pretty sure that wouldn’t violate the nondisclosure agreement. 

As an aside, I saw specific concepts that were on the October 2017 exam covered by the NCEES reference. It’s a shame NCEES didn’t publish it until after that exam, because it may have been useful then.  (I skipped the April 2018 exam, so I can’t speak much for the reference’s usefulness there)

In/PE/Out said:

For whatever good it is, I guess everyone who’s taking the Enviro exam next week needs to report back on how useful the NCEES manual was (without specifics, of course). I’m leaving a post-it on my computer to remind myself to do this after the exam.

I’m pretty sure that wouldn’t violate the nondisclosure agreement. 

As an aside, I saw specific concepts that were on the October 2017 exam covered by the NCEES reference. It’s a shame NCEES didn’t publish it until after that exam, because it may have been useful then.  (I skipped the April 2018 exam, so I can’t speak much for the reference’s usefulness there)

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Yeah, I think if we keep it super general, then we won't be violating the agreement. I too skipped out the April 2018 test cycle. I think my brain blocked out the October 2017 experience because I do not remember much from that exam.