PE stamping house plans

Hello -

I am a ME, recently received my PE. I would like to start doing some foundation design and stamping of house plans on the side. I do not have any experience in it, all of my career has been as a ME. I know it can't be that hard. Can anyone give me any advice on books, software programs, etc. Has anyone else gone this route for a little side income.

Thanks

^^^ I agree with Sapper .. you don't want to get your hand caught in the cookie jar. Also, there are numerous states (including mine) that require that you have had certain courses and experience prior to signing/sealing engineering works that come under the building code. The foundation design would certainly fall under that designation.

Approximately 80% of the referrals for disciplinary action for my state's board come from code inspectors reporting inadequate design based on aspects of the building code. So please don't take this as criticism - start off with building code and see if there is someone you can be supervised under who has some experience.

JR

Further, (in MA anyway) you don't need a PE stamp for one-two family dwellings. They trust the contractors and builders to follow the code guidance. Only unique or non-standard designs would need a stamp.

MA_PE said:

Further, (in MA anyway) you don't need a PE stamp for one-two family dwellings. They trust the contractors and builders to follow the code guidance. Only unique or non-standard designs would need a stamp.

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In CA, everything has to be stamped by a RCE. One could do owner/designer/builder without arch stamp, but it must be reviewed by a RCE or SE. This is a result of hard lessons learned during/after earthquakes (hence the seismic requirements for Civil PE).

As a fellow ME grad (now licensed as an environmental eng.) I would not stamp a foundation or house plan. I agree with Sapper - try to at least get some soils/geotech coursework as well as some good structural training first, before you even consider it.

isn't there something that says "practice within area of competence" or something along those lines... check your local laws!

sschellhase said:

isn't there something that says "practice within area of competence" or something along those lines... check your local laws!

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Exactly.

A lot of home builders just got in trouble here in Oklahoma because someone rubberstamped some plans, but the soil conditions can change rapidly. Claly soils may have rapid contraction and expansion, and sand soils may support less lbs per sq foot. Desiging foundations and pit walls for digital railroad scales was scary early in my career with no one checking my work.

Competency aside, make sure you're up to speed with your company's errors & ommisions insurance.

You may not be able to moonlight your seal. :smileyballs:

mcompound said:

Hello -
I am a ME, recently received my PE. I would like to start doing some foundation design and stamping of house plans on the side. I do not have any experience in it, all of my career has been as a ME. I know it can't be that hard. Can anyone give me any advice on books, software programs, etc. Has anyone else gone this route for a little side income.

Thanks

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All of the above advice is good, you most definitely want to proceed cautiously. Having said that, I'll say to you "Don't be skeer'd!" I've gone a similar route, but I've worked for the past five years in truss design, which is closely related to residential structural design. Get to know your local codes, and all of the referenced standards, and take your time. It can be done, but you should find someone in your area with more experience than you that's willing to show you the ropes.

I hold the opinions of those on these boards high because i know we're all looking out for each other - so i'd like to ask a question as well...

I've been drawing house plans for the last 15 years. i actually put myself through school doing house plans. during that time, i've had several engineer's that i would refer people to if the county or situation called for the plans to be stamped...

would you guys think this is sufficient experience - even though the work i did was not as a PE? One of my goals in obtaining the PE was so that i could stamp my own plans and keep that cost in house. I'm an ME by degree, so in order to facilitate greater knowlede i am planning to take a few pdh courses that deal strictly with residential foundation, framing, etc., just so that I would have that "paperwork" to backup what i'm doing... do you guys feel this is adequate? I dont' even mind taking courses at a local university if that would be more widely accepted. i personally feel very comfortable with standard foundations, and building sections, and even before i was a PE (just found out last thursday) - i would calculate loads and put together calc sheets for the engineers that would stamp to make their life/time more efficient...

thanks for any advice.

oh yeah!! MERRY CHRISTMAS to all... waiting till the kids are in bed to break out the santa stuff and put it together... knew my degree and PE could come in handy for something!

If you believe you are "competent" and your state allows you to certify any work in which you are competent, then it sounds like you might be able to. Ultimately it's you who will know this, not any of us. As long as you have been doing it for a long time for other engineers and know the codes and ins-and-outs of the design process, then I would assume it is fine as long as your state allows it. FWIW my "state" doesn't even require an engineer certificaiton for single-family homes or duplexes (I designed my house myself with the assistance of a non-licensed foreign arhcitect/drafter, who knew all the codes).

thanks - that is my thinking as well. in some counties if the house is over a certain square footage or dollar amount, then a stamp is required.

Just my 0.02 but I would think that house plans would need to be stamped by a civil or structural PE. You can probably get away with it if your stamp doesn't specifically say ME on it, but in the event that any civil/structural drawing stamped by you comes into question you'd probably have to do a lot of dancing in front of the board to convince them that you're qualified. The whole point in going through the application/testing process is to demonstrate for the record and to the board that you are competent to practice engineering. Obviously, that competency has only been demonstrated in the discipline that that you applied and tested for. If you start practicing some other discipline then it can be easily construed as practicing without a license.

Say for example, an angry abutter doesn't want a house built next to his. If he wanted to be an a$$hole and found out that an ME had stamped the structural drawings, he might be inclined to bring it to the Board's attention. Once the jig is up you'd be at their mercy. If that is your goal, I'd suggest that you apply for and take a civil/structural test and get license in two disciplines.

FWIW, my degree is ME. I have worked exclusively for a structural consulting firm. Over the years I took steel design courses, concrete courses, soil courses etc. but never got a civil degree. When I took my PE I took the STR1 exam. I would not consider myself competent to practice ME.

Make sure you are well aware of of the regulations and proceed with caution. my 0.02.

good luck

Can I stamp the plans I used to build the house I'm in for the hell of it?

Practicing outside your area of expertise is unethical and shouldn't be done, period. Plan-stampers of the residential construction variety give the profession a bad name when their slabs crack and their ceilings sag. Just because it follows the code doesn't mean it will work.

Judge Smails,

Hope you weren't talking to me, because I was joking.

"Ty, what did you shoot today?

Oh, Judge, I don’t keep score.

Then how do you measure yourself with other golfers?

By height. "

forelsu said:

Judge Smails,
Hope you weren't talking to me, because I was joking.

"Ty, what did you shoot today?

Oh, Judge, I don’t keep score.

Then how do you measure yourself with other golfers?

By height. "

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Sorry about that - I recognized your humor, and my reply was to the topic in general.

"You will get nothing and like it"

ol said:

Practicing outside your area of expertise is unethical and shouldn't be done, period. Plan-stampers of the residential construction variety give the profession a bad name when their slabs crack and their ceilings sag. Just because it follows the code doesn't mean it will work.

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Understanding this is a State issue (i.e. it only matters what your State prescribes by law), how are we to understand what "area of expertise" means? I don't buy the logic that you need to retake the PE exam to establish expertise... for the simple reason I don't think the exam has much to do with expertise. I'm sure the NSPE would weigh in with their BER, but short of that, what's a good rule?

ol said:

Practicing outside your area of expertise is unethical and shouldn't be done, period. Plan-stampers of the residential construction variety give the profession a bad name when their slabs crack and their ceilings sag. Just because it follows the code doesn't mean it will work.

Click to expand...

I understand where you are coming from 'ol deadbeat, I personally would never seal anything that could endanger anyone's life.. Here's what NSPE code of ethics state & a defintion of the word competence...

"Engineers shall perform services only in the areas of their competence. Engineers shall undertake assignments only when qualified by education or experience in the specific technical fields involved. Engineers shall not affix their signatures to any plans or documents dealing with subject matter in which they lack competence, nor to any plan or document not prepared under their direction and control"

Competence (American Heritage Dictionary): "The state or quality of being adequately or well qualified; ability. A specific range of skill, knowledge, or ability."

I ask all then: what would qualify experience or competence. Would someone whom has designed over 500 homes ranging from 1,000 to 10,000 square feet over the past 15 years not qualify enough experience? Would the fact that 97% of these homes required no engineering stamp or review, are soundly built to the building code not qualify as competence?

After looking at several college course outlines for civil degrees it's interesting to note that there is only 30 - 40 different course hours, none of which where specialized in residential framing or foundation design. Infact, in the early semesters, at one college, i found it odd that the civil's were required to take mechancial courses in statics, dynamics, materials, and mechanics of solids... - the foundation and basics of engineering...

So should i complete an undergraduate in civil to be able to stamp house plans?!?